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Double Bass Spirocore Stark- initial thoughts and encouragements

#42
Another follow-up:

I just came back from a little tour playing 5 shows in Germany with my sometimes-pretty-loud quartet. In the weeks before the tour, I had not exactly played often, only practiced the usual. The starks are being in their stable mid-lifespan period, where they just work as they always did, and don't change their sound noticeably.
I admit the starks are a little harder on the right hand under those tour circumstances. Playing live and loud and considerably harder than at home. If you don't have your callouses in order, you're going to notice. Especially when hand-sweat gets into the game and renders everything slightly sticky.

However, it's nowhere near scary. It got more and more comfortable each day, and now I could go on forever.

Bottom line is maybe: These strings are not for the occasional player. The occasional player will probably always run into the blister risk, or maybe slight right-underarm-pains. But if you keep your body in shape, practice regularly and learn to take it easy, it's great and pays off more than well because the strings are fantastic under live sound circumstances, projecting like crazy, amplifying is a dream.

Best
Sidecar
 
#45
swervy jervy said:
Interested in your thoughts on starks for E&A with EP weichs on the D&G. Do you reckon an awkward sound balance?
Click to expand...

Hi,

I have no experience whatsoever in blending strings, have never done it. But this combination would lead me to expect huge differences in volume.
And frankly, I don't see, why I would pair the bottom spiros with anything else on top, especially when we're talking stark, since they're neither zingy nor thin sounding at all. That is, if I understand correctly, the reason why many players change top strings when they're on spiros, because the g can be awkward. I don't think it's the case with stark.
BUt go ahead and try, and report also. I am willing to learn new tricks anytime.

Best
Sidecar
 
#46
I'm using the Mittels now on the E and A and find the balance satisfactory with D, G EP Weichs. This thread and other research has raised my curiosity with the Starks. My Upton hybrid does well with higher tension strings. I'll spin Starks on the E and A and report back in a few weeks.
 
#47
MrSidecar said:
Hi,

I have no experience whatsoever in blending strings, have never done it. But this combination would lead me to expect huge differences in volume.
And frankly, I don't see, why I would pair the bottom spiros with anything else on top, especially when we're talking stark, since they're neither zingy nor thin sounding at all. That is, if I understand correctly, the reason why many players change top strings when they're on spiros, because the g can be awkward. I don't think it's the case with stark.
Click to expand...

On one particular bass of mine, the stark G had one or two notes right up where the neck meets the body where the sound was a bit nasal, and on the D string there was a little "zing" patch on the D string of maybe a minor third. They weren't deal breakers, but they were there. As regards the whole string mixing thing, it makes perfect sense to me in two areas: tension, and timbre. I have yet to run across a string set that I have felt to be in balance tension-wise for pizz playing for any bass I've ever owned - the E strings are too floppy for the rest of the set across the board. One of my close friends is an accomplished professional arco player, and he reports nothing like this, so it might be an arco/pizz thing.
 
#49
Funny enough I never thought of this tension difference issue. Whatever set I played in the past sure felt ok tensionbalance-wise. They had maybe other things, but this tension thing never occurred to me. It's certainly just me taking the status quo for granted, but I am very happy with the balance of any whole set I know, and spiro stark especially. (Certainly no floppy e there!)

I still love those starks and have no intention of changing, might I add. Boy, that was powerful on this tour. No amplification or volume issues, monster projection, fat lows/fundamentals... End love song :-)
 
#50
Boy, I am a convert now. Spun up a stark E (matched with existing mittel A and the D, G ep weichs.)

The stark opened up the entire fingerboard and it's a true Hemi under the bow. Even the weichs' voice and sustain jumped, but I'll switch both those over to mittels to even out tone.

Of course, YMMV, but my Upton is constructed for thump and projection - it sings at higher tension.

Very happy.
 
#53
Full Stark set and after a week and a couple of gigs... they're still on but the tailpiece cord isn't.

Last night tuning dropped about a tone and I couldn't bring it back up to pitch. Emergency surgery taking off the tailpiece cord going to a stranded steel cable and so far so good.

The starks replaced a full set of Permanent strings. Whilst the stark tension is higher it doesn't seem to be on the D and G because the stark string is more flexible. I also noted how bad my pizz intonation had become on the lower 2 strings (presumably from not being able to hear the note as clearly).
 
#54
Just today, like you, I replaced a full set of Perms with a full set of Starks. :eek: While I'm sure that I'll need more time to really get to know these, it's truly amazing how much more power/ volume I'm getting, and how easy it is to vary the dynamics with the bow. The open A seems a little bright/tight on my bass, but this is a new set so I'll give it time.

I've followed this thread for quite some time and bought the Starks here on TB about months ago. Now I'm wondering why it took so long to take the plunge. I guess I wanted to give the Perms a good try. They were fine but if I can get used to the difference in how the bow starts, I may keep these a long, long time.
 
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#55
tomshepp said:
The open A seems a little bright/tight on my bass, but this is a new set so I'll give it time.
Click to expand...

This has actually been my experience as well, at least under the bow. The solution for me has been to just use more rosin... ... A LOT more rosin. Then that string will seem to open up and you can play into it the same way you can with the other strings.
 
#56
Chris Fitzgerald said:
On one particular bass of mine, the stark G had one or two notes right up where the neck meets the body where the sound was a bit nasal, and on the D string there was a little "zing" patch on the D string of maybe a minor third. They weren't deal breakers, but they were there. As regards the whole string mixing thing, it makes perfect sense to me in two areas: tension, and timbre. I have yet to run across a string set that I have felt to be in balance tension-wise for pizz playing for any bass I've ever owned - the E strings are too floppy for the rest of the set across the board. One of my close friends is an accomplished professional arco player, and he reports nothing like this, so it might be an arco/pizz thing.
Click to expand...
Yes, the arco/pizz "thing" is why I changed out the Bel E for a Spiro 3/4 Weich 3885.5 E string. Much better balance tension and tone with the Bel ADG on my CCB for my jazz/dance band gigs.
 
#57
Stark E, Mittel A and D, Olive G. The Mittels are ancient and I bought the Stark used. Based on the quality (lack thereof) of the silk it looks to have been around the block a few dozen times but spirocores can take abuse and still get it done. The Olive is maybe ten months old. This setup is by far the loudest, punchiest and most even that I've had on this bass. It feels better than the EP regulars and I find the bass responds much quicker while sounding fairly dark. I may leave it alone until something breaks. The spirocores are the 42 set.
 
#58
I did something similar to Greg. I was still kind of fighting with the Stark A (arco, that is) even after experimenting with some of the things that I've noted in this thread and the "bowing spiros" thread, it just sort of seemed like that string in particular was choked. So, because it seems weird to me to use a stark G, D and E with a mittel A, I decided to switch out the top 3 strings. I didn't have a full set of Mittels handy, so I used my Permanent D/G along with a mittel A. With a slight adjustment of the bridge adjusters, this worked like a charm. I've still got that ridiculous low E and the rest of the bass breaths better. The balance of volume and tone is fantastic (Perms don't growl like spiros, but my bass isn't terribly growly and I'm not looking for growl so much as I am for clarity and punch), Plus, the end of the fingerboard plays much better (arco) with the permanents than any other string I've tried (Zyex was absolutely frustrating in that matter).

So, to recap: Stark E, Mittel A, Permanent D/G = Good for me and my bass.
 
#59
I broke down and bought a new Mittel A and D because mine were hammered. They've been put out to pasture. After a bit of bridge tweaking I felt that the Stark E was quite a bit louder than the other strings so I put the Mittel back on. The strings will settle in for a few weeks before I consider any changes. The bass is sounding good but it was good before so there you go.
 
#60
LouisF said:
Good Lord, why didn't somebody tell me sooner! I just put on a new G&D with an older E&A (bought used here) and my goodness the bass (Giormenti carved Argentine bass) sounds phenomenal. The bass had always sounded good but had some volume issues.

Some what? I can't hear you! The floorboards are still rattling.

I did the Prelude to the Second Bach Cello Suite (using Dr Rod's trick of putting rosin right on the strings) and, seriously, I don't why people say the strings are hard to bow. Sure the G&D are tinnier right now than the older strings, but you can tell where everybody's going to be in a month or so.

I will get the action lowered a little more for these puppies, but I think this a real match on this bass - and what fun to dig in and really play old school sounding BASS!

Thanks for all your input.

Louis

PS: I had flexocore G&D on before today. Is it possible that the Starks are actually less stiff (or have less tension) than the Flex's? It certainly felt that way.
Click to expand...
Auday Giormenti bass from Bahia Blanca, Argentina
 

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