And "better" means a lower gauge number (14 ga. or 12 ga.) when talking about about speaker cable size.
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Stereo wire vs quarter inch: Where to use what?
- Thread starter jfh2424
- Start date
And "better" means a lower gauge number (14 ga. or 12 ga.) when talking about about speaker cable size.
what?
no! hell no
regular guitar cable from bass to amp, speaker cable from amp to cab.
no “stereo” cables at all
Stereo wire. Is this what you are calling stereo wire ?
That is speaker wire like you would use for home stereo or your car stereo.
Use speaker cable between your amp and cabinet and instrument cable for your instrument, pedals, and from your board to the amplifier. Use instrument cable with your effects loop as well.
Most of the time, yes, this would apply. Except, for instruments with stereo /separate pickup outs, such as Rickenbacker (R-O-S), Gretsch (their stereo wired guitars; not sure if there any current/ new models that are, though). Probably others, too. Didn't Gibson do some stereo instruments, too?
Also, many acoustic guitar utilize TRS cables for dual source pickup systems.
It's actually tuned into quite a useful discussion so really no need to lock/delete this thread.
We don't actually seem to have discussed shielded and unshielded cables yet, which is rather crucial.
This is a shielded cable.
Its main characteristic is a metal braid or foil wrapped around one or more (sometimes it may be dozens) of internal wires. The shield is connected to earth and reduces spurious signals getting into the signal chain. Shielded cables are (for our purposes at least) exclusively used between the instrument and the eventual power amp. Typically mono instrument cables will have one core, and microphone cables two. Hi fi connection cables will typically be two separate shielded mono (single core) cables side by side in a common outer case. The cores will normally be quite small, and the cables can only handle very low power, and must never be used for speaker connections.
Unshielded cables, as in lowplaces post above, don't have the shield - obviously - instead they have two or more cores which will generally be all of the same size and thicker in order to handle greater power. We use these between power amp and cabinet. There are technical reasons why its actually a bad idea to use shielded cables for speakers, even if they do have reasonable size cores. Mains cable is unshielded, which is why its an acceptable substitute for cable designed as speaker cable.
Unfortunately its not always easy to distinguish shielded from unshielded cable without dismantling the connectors. This is one reason why its a very good idea to use exclusively speakons for speaker cables. Using jacks was and is always a bad idea, and using XLR, as was fashionable for a while, not much better.
Oh yes, and fundamentally cables will not affect your tone in the slightest unless you are using *really* unsuitable ones. Although the boutique hi fi boys get awfully excited about cables the consensus our side of the music game is that they have a tendency to listen with their eyes and pocketbooks rather than their ears.
This is a shielded cable.
Its main characteristic is a metal braid or foil wrapped around one or more (sometimes it may be dozens) of internal wires. The shield is connected to earth and reduces spurious signals getting into the signal chain. Shielded cables are (for our purposes at least) exclusively used between the instrument and the eventual power amp. Typically mono instrument cables will have one core, and microphone cables two. Hi fi connection cables will typically be two separate shielded mono (single core) cables side by side in a common outer case. The cores will normally be quite small, and the cables can only handle very low power, and must never be used for speaker connections.
Unshielded cables, as in lowplaces post above, don't have the shield - obviously - instead they have two or more cores which will generally be all of the same size and thicker in order to handle greater power. We use these between power amp and cabinet. There are technical reasons why its actually a bad idea to use shielded cables for speakers, even if they do have reasonable size cores. Mains cable is unshielded, which is why its an acceptable substitute for cable designed as speaker cable.
Unfortunately its not always easy to distinguish shielded from unshielded cable without dismantling the connectors. This is one reason why its a very good idea to use exclusively speakons for speaker cables. Using jacks was and is always a bad idea, and using XLR, as was fashionable for a while, not much better.
Oh yes, and fundamentally cables will not affect your tone in the slightest unless you are using *really* unsuitable ones. Although the boutique hi fi boys get awfully excited about cables the consensus our side of the music game is that they have a tendency to listen with their eyes and pocketbooks rather than their ears.
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Alternatively, don't read it if you don't like it and let others participate. It's free.
Alternatively, don't read it if you don't like it and let others participate. It's free.
Good advice. Especially since the person you offered it too just joined TB on August 19 and is already copping an attitude with another member.
The ohm rating on a speaker is impedance not resistance. The power to the speaker = current squared * z. Current is the driving force that determines how much power gets delivered to the speaker. This varies with frequency.
The voltage across the speaker and speaker conductors is limited to the rails of the output section of the amplifier.
If our equipment was delivering lethal voltages to the speaker cabinet, safety agencies would likely require a ground wire in our speaker cables.
Good morning, everyone.
Wow, I'm sorry I didn't respond right away. I posted and left, this is true. Didn't check back in until this morning. And then...wow.
Thanks so much for everyone who helped me out! It's a million times clearer for me now, after reading what you all so generously wrote. I now clearly understand that I need to use a speaker cable (not wire) between my head and my cab. And an instrument cable for everything else.
I'm pretty sure that I am using a speaker cable between my head and my cab. This cable is thicker than others and it is written "Neutrik" on it. The pics are below!
I have a question: I know from reading the above that it is important for my instrument cable to be a short as possible in order to prevent signal loss. Is this the case for speaker cables too? Should they be as short as possible?
I've had the instrument cable that goes between my bass and my Line 6 G30 crap out a few times. I think this is because I plug and unplug it often. Could you guys kindly suggest to me a short instrument cable that is of higher quality that I won't need to replace as often and that I can have confidence in?
Thanks so much again, guys!
Wow, I'm sorry I didn't respond right away. I posted and left, this is true. Didn't check back in until this morning. And then...wow.
Thanks so much for everyone who helped me out! It's a million times clearer for me now, after reading what you all so generously wrote. I now clearly understand that I need to use a speaker cable (not wire) between my head and my cab. And an instrument cable for everything else.
I'm pretty sure that I am using a speaker cable between my head and my cab. This cable is thicker than others and it is written "Neutrik" on it. The pics are below!
I have a question: I know from reading the above that it is important for my instrument cable to be a short as possible in order to prevent signal loss. Is this the case for speaker cables too? Should they be as short as possible?
I've had the instrument cable that goes between my bass and my Line 6 G30 crap out a few times. I think this is because I plug and unplug it often. Could you guys kindly suggest to me a short instrument cable that is of higher quality that I won't need to replace as often and that I can have confidence in?
Thanks so much again, guys!
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I wasn't aware it was a crime to only sign onto a web page once a day. I should ignore that.
I shouldn't panic about signal loss. IME you're talking tens of metres for it to be very significant.
Any cable that has Neutrik brand connectors is probably pretty fair. They aren't the budget option. Unfortunately there are fakes though.
I have my doubts that the cable pictured is a speaker cable. I wouldn't expect to see a stereo plug on a speaker cable.
I shouldn't panic about signal loss. IME you're talking tens of metres for it to be very significant.
Any cable that has Neutrik brand connectors is probably pretty fair. They aren't the budget option. Unfortunately there are fakes though.
I have my doubts that the cable pictured is a speaker cable. I wouldn't expect to see a stereo plug on a speaker cable.
It’s simple.
Use an instrument cable for anything preamp related. This includes pedals, the effects loop in and out, and into a DI from the pre-amp out. It is a shielded cable and helps keep noise out of low level signals.
Use a speaker cable, sometimes called lamp cord (what you are calling stereo wire), for anything between the power amp output and the speaker cabinet. This signal level is higher both in terms of voltage and current. This is way above the noise level so shielding would not help.
Use an instrument cable for anything preamp related. This includes pedals, the effects loop in and out, and into a DI from the pre-amp out. It is a shielded cable and helps keep noise out of low level signals.
Use a speaker cable, sometimes called lamp cord (what you are calling stereo wire), for anything between the power amp output and the speaker cabinet. This signal level is higher both in terms of voltage and current. This is way above the noise level so shielding would not help.
As you can see from the example below ... the shielded cables goes to the amp (boxes on wall) and the other cables (non shielded) can go wherever. Wire gauge is not a factor in this example.
Here is a better example which should be easier to understand.
Here is a better example which should be easier to understand.
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I sincerely hope that you mean the wires that run from your home stereo to your home stereo cabinets and not stereo wires as in 'Wires that carry a stereo signal'.
As was stated many times above, the usual bass amp sends quite a bit of juice through speaker cables and therefore needs a heavier gauge.
A signal that is sent from the speaker out is as strong as it'll ever be. That's why speaker cables are not shielded. A little cosmic radiation (or cellphones or whatnot) will not make a difference with a signal that strong that is not amplified any further.
An instrument cable is something else entirely. It carries a weak little signal which is meant to be amplified. That signal must be protected.
A little noise at the start of the chain will be amplified through the various gain stages along with the signal and lead to a lot of noise in the end.
Given what I’m reading in this thread fleeing was far and away the best thing he could do. Too many of you guys have far too little understanding of the topic to be posting anything but another question.
That is not a speaker cable. It's a 1/4" TRS cable. Given that the connector has 3 contacts, a Tip, Ring & Shaft, that leads me to believe it is some sort of stereo (2 channel) cable that could be a stereo instrument cable for people who use Rickenbacker Rick-O-Sound, or maybe even a headphone cable. It is not suitable for use in anything based on your described situation. 1/4" jacks used for speaker connections are known as 1/4" TS jacks, and have just two contacts, a Tip and a Shaft.
Rather than post a bunch of pics, look here. (You can price shop later)
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Many people here make their own, but if all you need is 1/4" to 1/4", get a pre-made one. If your head and cab have Speakon type connectors, use Speakon instead.
(Some heads and cabs have both. 1/4" was the original, but Speakon is the more recent, a better way to go.)
In your case, don't worry about speaker cable length. Nothing wrong or wasteful about getting a 10' cable just in case you have to place your head somewhere else. 16/2 AWG should get you there gauge-wise. Some may even argue that 18/2 is adequate for short runs of reasonable power.
There are too many poor quality instrument cables out there. Many have their favs, but don't fall for the hype that Monster Cables or Mogami uses.
I use Lava Tweed Cables.
(You may see the term 'low capacitance' when comparing cables. A typical instrument cable will cause the signal to loose a bit of highs over the course of the cable run. Low capacitance means that the loss of highs is somewhat mitigated, if that makes sense. If you get a high quality cable, don't worry about it. Looking at websites and specs that compare capacitance values of various cables may send you into information overload.)
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@jfh2424 Good morning good sir of the north. I would recommend you purchase a new set of cables. Those in your pictures appear to be TRS cables and are not needed for your application. A quick search on Amazon can offer you a plethora of “instrument cables” and “speaker cables”. I personally (and I’m sure I’ll get hate for this) have been an avid Monster speaker cable and Mogami instrument cable user for 15 years. They are on the pricier side of the spectrum and have never failed even with moderate/heavy gigging use. Others I’m sure can recommend other brands; Livewire, GLS, HOSA etc.
As far as length of cables, for your specific application, I’d say 3 ft cables would be just fine. A little extra length is better than not being long enough. Good luck and be sure and let us know how you’re gettin on.
As far as length of cables, for your specific application, I’d say 3 ft cables would be just fine. A little extra length is better than not being long enough. Good luck and be sure and let us know how you’re gettin on.
The pictures below are a 1/4" to 1/4" TRS cable. NOT a speaker cable. Not safe to run that cable between your amp and cab.
"Neutrik" is simply a brand name. They make connectors.
You need a propper speaker cable. This first one has "jumbo" connectors and thick wire. The second one (get this one if it works with your amp and cab) has speakon connectors. ---- Or got to your local Guitar Center or music store and tell them you need a speaker cable for your bass amp.
https://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Sp...speaker+cable&qid=1568555309&s=gateway&sr=8-9
https://www.amazon.com/GLS-Audio-Sp...able+speakon&qid=1568555400&s=gateway&sr=8-10
With regards to keeping cables short...
Yes. Keep your speaker cable as short as possible. For a speaker cable, you probably only need 3-6 feet (or as far as you would have your amp from your cab).
If your cable is like 15', you will not have signal loss. If it is 100' you might. But why would you cary around a 15' cable to connect things that are 2' away. It's big, heavy, gets tangled up, and you can trip on it.
Same with instrument cables. Everything adds up... bass to tuner, to pedal, all those patch cables for your pedals, cables for your wireless system. They all add up. If you have 10 pedals, and 1' patch cables, that's 10' of extra cable.
With instrument cables, I think signal loss is more of a concern with really cheep or junky cable or with really long cables. But do you really need a 50' cable? You have a wireless right? Keep it to like 25' max if you can.
There are plenty of good cable brands. You don't need to spend $100, but also don't want to buy the cheapest stuff at the store. "Neutrik" connectors are usually a sign of good quality.
If you've had cables crap out, it's probably because they are cheep. A good quality cable should last you for year of plugging and unplugging.
My advice is get a cable that is just as short as you actually need, but just as long as you might need. Don't worry so much about signal loss, and worry more about reliability. You are more likely to suffer from a broken wire inside a cheep cable than signal loss.
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