Subcontra Bass Hype or practical

[Ed Goode]

Amazing how people with no actual experience using such things know all the answers.

Amen, GB .....

 

[greenboy]

I once a read a review of your subcontra album, it wasnt a very positive review...

Not every review of gazillions of other albums is positive either. Is there something you wanted to say? ; }

 

[JAUQO III-X]

I once a read a review of your subcontra album, it wasnt a very positive review...

I read a couple of reviews in two Bass playing publications as well and I agree that is wasn't a positive review but the end result is I'm very proud of the recording and if I posted a list of the Bassist pros and otherwise that had nothing but positive comments and support of that recording people wouldn't believe it.

I offer no apologies that my CD isn't a flavor of the month recording,Individuality is # 1 in my book.

Opinions are just that,those reviews don't speak for these guys.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=157341

Maybe it would be more apt to say the melodies and form are not what you are accustomed to. It's more akin to what you hear in Ornette Coleman double-rhythm-section Prime Time, or some of James Blood Ulmer's stuff. Yeah, it's improv, but there's lots of development of thematic material though its improv, it's tied together.

Thank you and Ornette and Blood are two very good friends of mine.

Hey Greenboy check these tracks out,two different worlds.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=157341

Invalid Link Removed

 

[lefty007]

Maybe it would be more apt to say the melodies and form are not what you are accustomed to. It's more akin to what you hear in Ornette Coleman double-rhythm-section Prime Time, or some of James Blood Ulmer's stuff. Yeah, it's improv, but there's lots of development of thematic material though its improv, it's tied together.

I really dig jamming from people who can deal at this level.

Well, I'm familiar with Coleman, Eric Dolphy, Sam Rivers, Andrew Hill, John Zorn, etc. and I think I can differenciate great free-jazz from a superfluos jam. . . I don't think a comparison with Ornette Coleman is valid.

. . . but my intention is not to diminish Jauqo's work in any way, it just doens't float MY boat, whether I'm a 59-year old Jazz professor, or a 13-year old "Mastodon" fan.

I have listend to the CD Baby preview several times through studio monitors - I'm sure the Internets preview is lower quality than the CD, but the intention I can hear clearly.

Anyhow, I'm pro Jauqo (you are a cool cat, man) and I give thumbs up to the effort and props. I would love to hear more material and the Subcontra used in a different setting.

 

[greenboy]

Hey Greenboy check these tracks out,two different worlds.

Invalid Link Removed

Invalid Link Removed

Yah, I especially enjoyed the fretless 15 bass-only interlude after the "pierce the stratosphere" guitar explorations in THE POWER OF. Keep gettin' it out there, Jauqo!

 

[JAUQO III-X]

I can differenciate great free-jazz from a superfluous jam. . . I don't think a comparison with Ornette Coleman is valid.

For the record I once stayed for a period with Ornette in his home and I studied Harmolodics with him(the Creator of the concept)and I have actual theory literature that Ornette personally wrote out for me that to this day I continue to incorporate into aspects of my own musical concept.

Remember when Ornette first landed most thought he couldn't play,he was crazy,they wouldn't let him sit in etc,it was Miles who said that any body that plays like that(referring to Ornette) has to be F***** up in the head but over 30 years later he publicly apologized saying that he didn't understand what Ornette was doing at the time.

I remember when Ornette was telling me about the period when Coltrane was studying with him and one night Ornette showed me a stack of letters that Coltrane had written him(over a brief period of time) and in some of them there was a $30 money order and one of the passages read I'm starting to understand what you meant by abandoning the structure.

Yah, I especially enjoyed the fretless 15 bass-only interlude after the "pierce the stratosphere" guitar explorations in THE POWER OF. Keep gettin' it out there, Jauqo!

 

[Jay Terrien]

LOL! Confessed beer snob Beemer is now drinking lukewarm Schlitz cans to finance his bass lust!!!

Guys, subcontra isn't a concept anymore. It's a reality, thanks to a few key players in the bass scene like Jauqo, Gary Goodman, Yves, The Bee guys, etc. etc. Now we have many people playing them with lots of sonic success.

I AM a normal everyday musician...

 

[xXMurderSoulXx]

That's funny. I take my fretless Six to cover band gigs strung with a F#/E0 (Hipshot) sometimes and everybody can hear it and then some. Notes in that region occasionally get substituted for ones played an octave up in the recordings and nobody has ever said that there wasn't meat on the plate. One guitarist actually prefers during solos that I transpose downward more often because he likes that uberlow vibe.

I take it you play rock, thats heavly influenced by bass. Live shows are different from recordings. Listen to Jauqos cd, when the guitar starts going, you can barely hear him playing bass.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

xXMurderSoulXx,no disrespect but I think you're missing the overall point what role a lower than normal Bass plays in certain musical settings.

 

[greenboy]

Live shows are different from recordings. Listen to Jauqos cd, when the guitar starts going, you can barely hear him playing bass.

Check your playback gear, check your ears.

 

[knuckle_head]

....we don't have cabs that can handle that.

This is an interesting statement.

By and large most players don't have cabinetry that can handle a 40 Hz E fundamental, and that has been true since bass started in the mid-1930s. But bassists percevered and did what they did anyway.

If you consider that the F# is a whole step higher than an octave down E, and that affordable rigs can do a decent job with a standard 40 Hz E these days I would suggest that we are no worse off in general now than those that adopted when electric bass was born.

It's kind of cool starting from scratch, don'tcha think?

 

[Gregory Bruce Campbell]

I offer no apologies that my CD isn't a flavor of the month recording, Individuality is #1 in my book.

that is one of the most inspirational things i have ever read on TB!

well said Jaquo!

 

[JAUQO III-X]

I offer no apologies that my CD isn't a flavor of the month recording, Individuality is #1 in my book.

that is one of the most inspirational things i have ever read on TB!

well said Jaquo!

Thanks Greg,thats one of the problems artist face today,if you're not sounding like the flavor of the month then you're not worthy.

 

[Gregory Bruce Campbell]

I offer no apologies that my CD isn't a flavor of the month recording, Individuality is #1 in my book.

Thanks Greg,thats one of the problems artist face today,if you're not sounding like the flavor of the month then you're not worthy.

I see it within the ERB comminuty as you and I have spoken of...



When I quoted you, it reminded me of what being a musician is all about.

Individual expression.

No matter how much you like or dislike the CD by jaquo. its real validity for all of us, is what was acomplished.

If you dig the music BONUS!

If you don't dig the music... its totally cool...

Jaquo, you still made a mark in history and i feel that any self respecting bass player should hear the cd through a variety of systems...

its all about the experience!

 

[Bassist4Life]

I'm gonna say that a SubContra Bass is practical, but it depends on the person playing it.

If you give me a canvas with a whole bunch of paints and fancy brushes, I will create the same kind of image that I would with some markers and crayons.

If you give those materials to a talented artist, he can create a masterpiece.

Joe

 

[Mudfuzz]

ENJOY

 

[spade2you]

Check out the new stuff by Yves!!!
Link Removed
Practical? Who cares, sounds killer with good headphones or good speakers!

 

[JAUQO III-X]

Oh yes,Cloudy Day is one of my favorite tunes by Yves.

 

[spade2you]

Oh yes,Cloudy Day is one of my favorite tunes by Yves.

Hellz yes!!! I guess I always had trouble hearing stuff f# and below on those contra basses, but somehow that particular bass really came through the mix. I may look at getting something like that some day....after a bunch of other things on the 'ol GAS list!

 

[barthanatos]

Just stopping in to say that I played my fretless F#BEAD Peavey Cirrus at church today. Had a good time. I love the tone of those SIT Conklin Signature strings. My absolute fave for that bass. I'll be playing the same bass tomorrow.

In regards to practicality... I think the only things working against the concept of Subcontrabass are availibility and cost. Jauqo's custom pickups and such come to mind. I wouldn't mind going down to C#, but I'm simply not going to make that kind of investment. I decided to compromise and go down to F#. This lets me work with gear that's a little more available. The only thing I did to my Cirrus was change the strings and file the nut. I added a Whappo Grande to my setup (which I didn't use today - my church has a very low range subwoofer in the PA, and stacking a WG and an El Whappo is a bit overkill for the setting). I can stick with a five-string so that keeps my neck pretty slim, and I've still got a D string, which if I go up the neck gives me plenty of high notes.

The vast majority of people do not own sound systems that can reproduce the low C# in a quality manner. But I bet those that do enjoy it, And I'm sure people can appreciate it live. I'm sure there's also plenty of refinement left to go to really get the gear to perform at its best. Scale-length comes to mind. I'd like to see something in maybe a 38" scale, but I'm sure not going to be the guy to finance that experiment.