Double Bass Tailgut Length

[Waltjie]

Hi all,

I just had to share with you my absolute HAPPINESS!

After much consideration, I decided to go for it and put a longer tailgut on my bass, since I've always thought it to be a little short ie the tailpiece bottom end is basically covering the saddle, actually sticking a little over it.

The tailgut that came on my bass was a really thick wire. Like aircraft cable, sure, but covered in a very thick plastic. Also, my bass just didnt feel as responsive as I wanted it to be. Strings felt stiff, even with proper action. They felt tough, hard to bow sometimes. In all, my bass sounded so, how shall I describe it... choked... glassy somehow, if that makes sense

I have a fully laminate bass from Stentor.

So, about 2 hours ago, I did the operation. Took of the bridge, took the strings out from the tailpiece, and removed it. Cut of the tailgut, and replaced it with a slightly thinner cable, with a less thick plastic covering. Most importantly, I made it longer, probably about 5cm. So now the tailpiece sits nicely above and away from the saddle.

I now have a new bass!!!

I sounds so ALIVE! It bows so much easier, and the sounds is MUCH louder as well. I have just fallen in love with my bass, and I never felt like this about it actually since I got it almost a year ago.

Anyone with the same symptoms I described above, I highly recommend you look at your tailgut as a possible solution. So easy to do yourself, took me under an hour.

 

[George700DL]

Hi all,

I just had to share with you my absolute HAPPINESS!

After much consideration, I decided to go for it and put a longer tailgut on my bass, since I've always thought it to be a little short ie the tailpiece bottom end is basically covering the saddle, actually sticking a little over it.

The tailgut that came on my bass was a really thick wire. Like aircraft cable, sure, but covered in a very thick plastic. Also, my bass just didnt feel as responsive as I wanted it to be. Strings felt stiff, even with proper action. They felt tough, hard to bow sometimes. In all, my bass sounded so, how shall I describe it... choked... glassy somehow, if that makes sense

I have a fully laminate bass from Stentor.

So, about 2 hours ago, I did the operation. Took of the bridge, took the strings out from the tailpiece, and removed it. Cut of the tailgut, and replaced it with a slightly thinner cable, with a less thick plastic covering. Most importantly, I made it longer, probably about 5cm. So now the tailpiece sits nicely above and away from the saddle.

I now have a new bass!!!

I sounds so ALIVE! It bows so much easier, and the sounds is MUCH louder as well. I have just fallen in love with my bass, and I never felt like this about it actually since I got it almost a year ago.

Anyone with the same symptoms I described above, I highly recommend you look at your tailgut as a possible solution. So easy to do yourself, took me under an hour.

Congratulations. I did the same thing about a year ago, based on what I read in Chuck Traeger's "Setup..." book. My bass really opened up as a result.

Also check out how close those 2 ends of the cable are to each other as they pass over the saddle. I moved mine in a little closer than they were originally and I believe that contributed as well.

George

 

[kg4muc]

Been thinking of doing the same thing....
Got any pictures??? Maybe I could establish a rough reference
considering every bass could be different in final placement.

Has anyone ever tried using an old string for the hanger?
I have been tossing this idea around awhile and have some old
used strings that I have changed out I could use.. Just an idea
I have been tossing around and though I would get others opinion
on this "brain storm"


TIA

Wayne

 

[George700DL]

Has anyone ever tried using an old string for the hanger?
I have been tossing this idea around awhile and have some old
used strings that I have changed out I could use.. Just an idea
I have been tossing around and though I would get others opinion
on this "brain storm"


TIA

Wayne

I guess you could, but I don't see why, when there are better options - like braided steel cable. Strings break, steel cable doesn't.

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

Has anyone ever tried using an old string for the hanger?

For what reason? Strings really dislike being kinked at sharp angles under tension and tend to fail dramatically. I don't know if you've ever seen a tailgut fail but it's not pretty.

18 inches of 5/8" aircraft cable and a clamp of appropriate size will run you a couple of dollars at the hardware store. Lemur Music sells a really nice ready-made kit for $11. Peace of mind is priceless.

 

[tstone]

18 inches of 5/8" aircraft cable and a clamp of appropriate size will run you a couple of dollars at the hardware store.

5/8" aircraft cable, eh? Well, at least you won't have to worry about it breaking. ;-)

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

D'oh! Make that 3/16".

 

[kg4muc]

LOL 5/8 " would definitely be a heavy duty hanger.

There is no real solid reason behind the old string theory other than speculation and curiosity. And agreed on the breaking.. I've not had it happen personally but have witnessed it and it definitely ain't pretty.. One of those sounds that sticks in your mind for awhile too. The flexibility of the braided cable speaks volumes on installation alone.

Bob Gollihur has a large selection from kevlar to steel. Haven't tried the Kevlar ( have braided steel) but seems like it might be a tad easier to work with.. Anybody tried it ??


Wayne

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

I tried climber's rope made of a material similar to Kevlar,with a 250 pound test weight. It was an improvement over the steel wire but my highly uneducated ears have to agree with Arnold S's opinion that the synthetics lack something in the high frequencies compared to aircraft cable.

 

[kg4muc]

Thanks for the feed back !! I will go with the opinions of you and Arnold.
Steel cable I can find around here most any place but Aircraft cable in this area may be hard to come by... off to Bob's me thinks

 

[Waltjie]

Here is my new tailgut I made using steel cable with a plastic covering:

One word of advice... Which ever way you choose to join the tips of the cable together eg. small clamp, I suggest you strip the cable of the plastic covering (if you choose to use this type of cable) since I didn't and the cable pulled right out of the clamp, sliding inside the plastic sleeve...!

 

[George700DL]

Here is my new tailgut I made using steel cable with a plastic covering:


One word of advice... Which ever way you choose to join the tips of the cable together eg. small clamp, I suggest you strip the cable of the plastic covering (if you choose to use this type of cable) since I didn't and the cable pulled right out of the clamp, sliding inside the plastic sleeve...!

Yes, that's important, in fact, I think they even tell you that on the packaging of the clamp

Looks like your clamp is underneath your tailpiece. If it's somewhat heavy, you might consider moving it near the endpin instead, to prevent it from adding mass to your tail piece.

The spacing looks close to what I have. Getting the 2 ends of the cable closer together really opened up the sound in my case.

George

 

[kg4muc]

Thanks for the pictures! Makes a great reference !

Is your clamp the little brass type that is in the Lemur kit ? I think Fretwell has the same kind of clamp.
Just wondering how well they work. Tried a compression connector ( electrical) once with little success..even using the factory spec crimp tool.. Evidently was not close enough in size for the compression range.. fortunately we caught it before it went boom

 

[kg4muc]

Went for the gusto today I was able to find a piece of stainless steel cable today at a local Tractor Supply of all places and went head on and changed things.After a little experimenting with string after length and tail piece location I found a spot that seemed to open up things quite a bit. It's hard to believe sometimes how the little things you do make the biggest difference So far my testing has been here in my cave and won't get a chance to try on stage with a band until next week but I am happy with the results I am seeing here.. Much more even string register and a tad more volume but the biggest improvements were elimination of some wolf tones I never seemed to be able to get rid of and amplification.. Much more even now with the pickup than before.

Most definitely an inexpensive upgrade that I would speculate would make a positive outcome most every time.

Thanks for all the opinions and pictures.. definitely helps set references

 

[Waltjie]

Went for the gusto today I was able to find a piece of stainless steel cable today at a local Tractor Supply of all places and went head on and changed things.After a little experimenting with string after length and tail piece location I found a spot that seemed to open up things quite a bit. It's hard to believe sometimes how the little things you do make the biggest difference So far my testing has been here in my cave and won't get a chance to try on stage with a band until next week but I am happy with the results I am seeing here.. Much more even string register and a tad more volume but the biggest improvements were elimination of some wolf tones I never seemed to be able to get rid of and amplification.. Much more even now with the pickup than before.

Most definitely an inexpensive upgrade that I would speculate would make a positive outcome most every time.

Thanks for all the opinions and pictures.. definitely helps set references

Happiness! Congrats!

 

[timobee4]

[QUOTE=Waltjie;11321299

After much consideration, I decided to go for it and put a longer tailgut on my bass, since I've always thought it to be a little short ie the tailpiece bottom end is basically covering the saddle, actually sticking a little over
I sounds so ALIVE! It bows so much easier, and the sounds is MUCH louder as well. I have just fallen in love with my bass, and I never felt like this about it actually since I got it almost a year ago.

Congratulations! It's great to see someone pleased with their instrument! Next time you feeling adventurous try Gamut real gut or Gollihur synthetic gut ( with care as it stretches) I have replaced these tail wires and it sounds nothing like metal wire! My luthier only uses wire on cheap student basses. One day please give it a go you'd never look back!

 

[Waltjie]

I've just finished what will probably be my last 'DIY upgrade' to my bass since I bought it almost a year ago.

I've just switched out the metal tailpiece it came with, with a awesome wooden one I had ordered.

It MIGHT be my imagination, but it seems to feel as if there is a slight improvement in string response...

 

[360guy]

I've just finished what will probably be my last 'DIY upgrade' to my bass since I bought it almost a year ago.

I've just switched out the metal tailpiece it came with, with a awesome wooden one I had ordered.

It MIGHT be my imagination, but it seems to feel as if there is a slight improvement in string response...

The tail gut looks long to me. As I've heard mentioned it should be about 1/6th of the total string length. If the free string length is 42" approximately then the after string length should be about 7", right?

 

[KUNGfuSHERIFF]

Way long. You want the bottom edge of your tailpiece to be about even with the saddle, maybe slightly below it.

 

[Jake deVilliers]

The tail gut looks long to me. As I've heard mentioned it should be about 1/6th of the total string length. If the free string length is 42" approximately then the after string length should be about 7", right?

Right - or two octaves and a fourth higher than the pitch of the string.