TalkCello - Bass Players here learning the Cello

[Whale guy]

Please put me in the "I would love to" column with the other TBers. Maybe when I retire (like that will ever happen).

To all of you who are learning the cello...go get 'em!

 

[LowendG]

My wife bought me one for my B-day a couple years ago and admittedly I have not tried to work on it in any serious way. Just Youtube'ing for technique tips. I can play pizz pretty well with good intonation though so I have used it recording which has been super fun. Arco is a whole 'nuther story. I can record a bunch of long droney stuff and assemble some cool things in my DAW but man, bowing is a real challenge!

 

[Anne Millington]

I think my point is - to find like minded people who know some electric bass - who discover the cello.
Frankly, I think the DB crew will provide the same snobby-ness as the traditional cello crew.

Aaack I hope not. But I haven't been around here that long.

 

[Anne Millington]

That's a very generous offer, and whenever it's convenient for you I'd be interested in seeing some! While I've not (yet) delved into the 'cello, I've done several projects where I've picked up 'cello parts on the bass guitar — first playing duets with a cellist neighbor, and more recently in small chamber groups. So anything that can expand my knowledge and perspective is most welcome, especially as I make the transition to a fretless bass.

Sure! Do you prefer to start with classical or a pop duo?

 

[Geogio]

The Peterson phone app works pretty good, I like the strobe feature. Plus if you look at the gear setting icon they have different tunings for different instruments such as banjo and cello Etc, however I purchased a clip-on Peterson not too long ago with sweetened options and it's very nice. I also use a clippy Snark on the Bandstand with the bass and that gets me in the ballpark and that's cool because the other couple of acoustic guitarists employ cowboy chords and Capo's. I really wish (and dream) they would re-turn after slapping on their beloved capo's but they don't - and so you get a lot of stinkers when they start strumming along... grrrrrrr!

I heard the iPhone Peterson app is a little more robust but I have not used an iPhone and I probably never will.

 

[groooooove]

The Suzuki method might be awesome. But, from the little I know, the embedded material is less than engaging for today's adults.

I am specifically suggesting that we view suzuki as two different things-

firstly, the books themselves. they contain some of the most time-proven student arrangements of all time. good bow markings and logical fingerings, all laid out in sequential order. you really can't ask for anything more.

the opening pages of "learn by rote" rhythms and such are to be skipped/ignored by most people using the books themselves. Suzuki's "method" is 100% designed for young children. the books themselves are designed to bring you from one step of skill level to the next, and the next, until you are at a level of competence that can allow self-guided study of whatever repertoire you choose next. this works for any age - but it should be supplemental to a more 'standard' method book that will teach some other fundamentals, basics, etudes, and such.

it's hard to find collections of repertoire more engaging than what is in the suzuki books.

i think the issue of contemporary/modern melodies is a pretty simple one. they're typically under copyright and cannot easily be included in any books. it's certainly annoying, there are lots of times i wish we had some beatle songs or the famous harry potter theme in there. but, finding such things is really pretty easy online nowadays.

 

[fdeck]

I started on cello, before learning bass for the school jazz band. I wasn't good enough on cello to do anything with it beyond high school, other than sitting in the back of the cello section in college, which didn't excite me. On bass, I was always "first chair."

During the lockdown, I decided to get out my old cello and teach myself to play straight-ahead jazz on it. Not for any expectation of gigging, but just as an experiment. It's not as hard as classical, because there are no wrong notes. My intention was to treat it as a melodic instrument, not just another bass. I've taken it to a couple of jam sessions, and some old time fiddle jams.

When my son upgraded from his student cello to a nicer one, I got his old one, which I must say is better than anything that I can do justice to.

Yeah, fifths baby. That's coming back pretty well. When I was a kid, I could play bass and cello more or less interchangeably, including sight-reading on both instruments. Some of those brain cells still remain, others I'm still looking for.

Of course the bass world is on a quest for the perfect bass, that can be played acoustically in a band but isn't huge. Such a bass doesn't exist unless the other players exercise extreme restraint.

The drawback is, when people find out that I'm a bassist, they wish that I'd brought my bass.

 

[Rocket Queen]

I think there is a ton of opportunity for materials in this space.

The Suzuki method might be awesome. But, from the little I know, the embedded material is less than engaging for today's adults.

I Do think there is a market for modern materials that don't treat tab like a disease - and design exercises based on modern melodies. Twinkle doesn't apply. Thus, my Another One Bites The Dust and Owner Of A Lonely Heart melodies for learning first position.

No doubt - this is a snobby space. I hope to contribute to pushing some of it to the curb.

Not meaning to be snobby, but is your "Owner" tab actually correct? Or maybe the notation is wrong?

There probably isn't a huge maket for modern materials that don't treat tab like a disease because it may be felt, by teachers and book authors alike, that the longer you depend on tab, the longer you put off learning notation, and all the information it carries beyond simple pitch values.

 

[RandomKaren]

Not meaning to be snobby, but is your "Owner" tab actually correct? Or maybe the notation is wrong?

There probably isn't a huge maket for modern materials that don't treat tab like a disease because it may be felt, by teachers and book authors alike, that the longer you depend on tab, the longer you put off learning notation, and all the information it carries beyond simple pitch values.

Tab for cello is a new one for me. I learned notation at school, sometimes use tab for guitar but didn't even know it existed for cello.

 

[Anne Millington]

Tab for cello is a new one for me. I learned notation at school, sometimes use tab for guitar but didn't even know it existed for cello.

I've seen it for cello, and could sort of parse it out, but would never be able to read it fluently. It bears little relation to cello fingering, so totally confusing for me. But I bet for a person used to tab notation, it would be really helpful

 

[KeepItMoving]

Sure! Do you prefer to start with classical or a pop duo?

Mmm, good question! The vast majority of my experience is on the pop side but the last 5 or so years I’ve been pretty focused on Baroque/Classical.

Apologies for answering a question with questions, but, are there any that you find especially interesting or enjoyable to play, or that people seem to respond well to? Or ones that are maybe a little surprising, like that aren’t obvious choices for a ‘cello duet but work well anyway?

 

[SBassman]

Not meaning to be snobby, but is your "Owner" tab actually correct? Or maybe the notation is wrong?

There probably isn't a huge maket for modern materials that don't treat tab like a disease because it may be felt, by teachers and book authors alike, that the longer you depend on tab, the longer you put off learning notation, and all the information it carries beyond simple pitch values.

Which note do you think is wrong? I thought it was correct.

As far as the tab, any tab I used will be standard + tab stacked.
I have every intention of learning the standard along the way, but the tab allows some earlier playing with the standard not getting in the way.
If you are coming from no other instrument, I'd agree that you should go straight to standard. If you are coming from electric bass and you don't know standard, I think there is great value in use of the tab in the beginning. Again, with it Stacked with standard.

 

[Anne Millington]

Mmm, good question! The vast majority of my experience is on the pop side but the last 5 or so years I’ve been pretty focused on Baroque/Classical.

Apologies for answering a question with questions, but, are there any that you find especially interesting or enjoyable to play, or that people seem to respond well to? Or ones that are maybe a little surprising, like that aren’t obvious choices for a ‘cello duet but work well anyway?

 

[Anne Millington]

Well I was thinking "Happy Together" might be a good start. We have nice duo for cellos in an easy register and fun to play, and open for adding whatever you want along the way. We wouldn't sell it to you, but offer it as a practice/fun piece. There are lots of good commercially available classical/baroque duos out there that I can list for you, Marcello sonatas for cello/bass being an example. We have another arranged by us in the semi-classical realm of "As the Deer" which is a good piece as well.
Please feel free to PM me if you want to delve into this! We are always happy to share this stuff.

 

[Rocket Queen]

Which note do you think is wrong? I thought it was correct.

The tab is a minor third higher than the notation.

First bar:
First note: Notation says E2 / tab says G2
Second note: Notation says F2 / tab says A2
Third note: Notation says Gb2 / tab says Bb2
Fourth and fifth notes: Notation says A2 / tab says C2
etc.

So, while the tab may or may not be internally consistent, and the notation may or may not be internally consistent, they are definitely not consistent with each other. The funny thing is, if you were only reading from the notation, you'd know immediately that the tab was wrong, and if you were only reading from the tab, the stacked notation would not only do you no good, but would be misleading.

I have every intention of learning the standard along the way, but the tab allows some earlier playing with the standard not getting in the way.

The tab (and this particular notation) gives you no instructions or suggestions about bowing. Would those really just get in the way? Actual cellists can correct me, but it seems like you'd want to learn at least the rudiments of bowing before playing anything.

 

[bassicmike]

My teacher is adamant about correct bowing and strict adherence to bowing instructions on the score.

 

[Anne Millington]

My teacher is adamant about correct bowing and strict adherence to bowing instructions on the score.

There are conventions, to be sure, that are often not written in the score because they are assumed by all. Bowing "as it comes" is sort of a default, with upbow on pickups, and downbow on the strong beats. But you only learn these by seeing them, thus bowing etudes and tutorials. Sometimes printed bowing is totally cockamamie (as in who came up with that?), so no harm in using judgement.

 

[Jazzdogg]

Here's mine...

Is yours tuned in fourths or fifths?

 

[bholder]

Is yours tuned in fourths or fifths?

5ths for range

 

[bassicmike]

There are conventions, to be sure, that are often not written in the score because they are assumed by all. Bowing "as it comes" is sort of a default, with upbow on pickups, and downbow on the strong beats. But you only learn these by seeing them, thus bowing etudes and tutorials. Sometimes printed bowing is totally cockamamie (as in who came up with that?), so no harm in using judgement.

I'm sure it's so that I learn the 'correct' way in order to play 'as it comes' with more proficiency. I can tell when my bowing gets backwards yet I can still play the notes on the page.