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The basic flaw in the p-bass

#561
smeet said:
No sarcasm or agenda here - I would sincerely love to hear a quick recording of you running a bass or two through a few of these diverse tones. Along with a description of the bass and other equipment used, this could be an educational and eye-opening listen.
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Pretty much any competent bass player can cop a Duck Dunn fingerstyle in one song and then get a Geddy Lee tone in another by adjusting style of playing and a few clicks on a pedalboard. Now they may not be able to play as well as Mr. Dunn or Mr. Lee. That is a seperate matter.
 
#562
I played for 2 decades without needing or wanting a P bass. Many gigs all over the country, recording in NYC studios... done it. I had an old, active Ibanez, and I could (and still can) get pretty much every tone out of it. Close enough, anyway.

Then I found my P bass. Ash, RW, goodness. It plays well everywhere. with all others. It's lighter than my Ibanez, and looks cooler too.

Not a one trick pony at all. More like graduations of flavor. Bright, solid, chunky, or meaty, muddy dubby, or right there in between where things get really good.
And shades between those. even.

I'll be keeping mine, thanks.
 
#563
Ric5 said:
Pretty much any competent bass player can cop a Duck Dunn fingerstyle in one song and then get a Geddy Lee tone in another by adjusting style of playing and a few clicks on a pedalboard. Now they may not be able to play as well as Mr. Dunn or Mr. Lee. That is a seperate matter.
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Sorry, but I haven't heard this. I hear GREAT players say that muting and thumb-plucking roundwound strings on a jazz sounds just like a P-bass with flats. I don't hear it, it sounds like what it is. I'm talking about top-level players who have the fingers part down. Their playing is great, but the instrument still has its voice.

I tried fitting various modern-ish basses into my Pink Floyd tribute band. They all sounded fine. Then I brought in the passive P with flats. BAM! I was transported back to when PF was laying down the tracks on the album, it really sounded different. My bandmates of course were less struck by the difference... :)

I know I'm taking both sides here - on one hand I say different instruments sound different in spite of techniques used, and on the other hand I say in the mix very few people will notice. But I still feel they are both true.
 
#564
I just removed the tone controls from my P-basses and run with a volume only setup. Seems to take away the tone choking of a capacitor and also add a bit more bottom from the pickup. Plus who really uses the tone control when you are gigging live and only have a 45 minute set?
 
#565
smeet said:
And of course, the dirty little secret that we all know but would rather not speak in public - In 99% of playing situations, if a bass instrument has enough body (mids and lows) and definition (attack and highs), nobody but the player cares or notices what instrument you are playing. Subtlety doesn't count for that much in bass tone, even though almost all our money is spent on that subtlety.
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I often step back to that very thought when I see some of the debates we as bassists get into. Your average audience CAN discern different tones, but overall they could not care less WHAT produces the driving low end of their favorite songs, be it electric bass with/without a wall of processing, electronic bass, or a washtub and string.

The same can be said of other instruments as well - only musicians care about the subtleties of tone etc.

In fact even if you record a hit, then radically change tonality of various instruments live, they still don't care as long as it's the same tune.
 
#566
smeet said:
And of course, the dirty little secret that we all know but would rather not speak in public - In 99% of playing situations, if a bass instrument has enough body (mids and lows) and definition (attack and highs), nobody but the player cares or notices what instrument you are playing. Subtlety doesn't count for that much in bass tone, even though almost all our money is spent on that subtlety.
Click to expand...

Yeah, this is the Monday morning, black-coffee TRUTH.

But, it kinda defeats the purpose of TalkBass, doesn't it?
 
#567
My P-Bass with flats...tone control wide open....lots of bottom end, never an issue.
On a side note...I use to play a Jazz with rounds...when I switched to the P-Bass with flats I asked people if they noticed a difference in my tone....most said no.
The only people that really noticed were the band, my brother (guitar, lead singer) preferred the Jazz sound but he's my brother so who cares what he thinks.
 
#569
Ric5 said:
Pretty much any competent bass player can cop a Duck Dunn fingerstyle in one song and then get a Geddy Lee tone in another by adjusting style of playing and a few clicks on a pedalboard. Now they may not be able to play as well as Mr. Dunn or Mr. Lee. That is a seperate matter.
Click to expand...

Not huge Geddy fan by any stretch, but his tone is much more layered and complex then you are giving him credit for. Have you ever listened to his isolated bass tracks? They are incredibly dirty with alot more lows then are evident in the final product. I can't say I've ever heard anyone even come close to the sound he manages to get on tape...at least not with a simple jazz bass and amp.

Duck is another story but same deal with the isolated tracks: much more studio saturated dirt in there then people think. As much as people like to say they "nail that sound" when it comes to Duck or Jamerson, I have yet to hear a sound clip posted here that even comes close. I'd be interested to hear your examples of the basses you say cover these tones so well...I'd wager they are vastly different then the actual product.
 
#570
Salamenster said:
Those two pickups in parallel? Someone likes midscoop and giving the engineer a headache!
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I guess I had good engineers. Never any whining from engineers.

smeet said:
I don't actually feel the P-bass is one-trick. Played with fingers/pick at various locations on the string, slapping, typewriter-style, thumb-plucked, flats vs. rounds, and different tone settings, not to mention different P-basses sound different... There are a lot of variations.
Of course, I'm still thinking about adding a J-type pickup to my P's, as I don't really like switching basses on a gig.

And of course, the dirty little secret that we all know but would rather not speak in public - In 99% of playing situations, if a bass instrument has enough body (mids and lows) and definition (attack and highs), nobody but the player cares or notices what instrument you are playing. Subtlety doesn't count for that much in bass tone, even though almost all our money is spent on that subtlety.
Click to expand...

That can be said of any instrument.
 
#571
Ric5 said:
Pretty much any competent bass player can cop a Duck Dunn fingerstyle in one song and then get a Geddy Lee tone in another by adjusting style of playing and a few clicks on a pedalboard. Now they may not be able to play as well as Mr. Dunn or Mr. Lee. That is a seperate matter.
Click to expand...

Geddy sounded like Geddy on a Rick, Steinberger, Wal and Jazz, probably on a P-bass, too, if he played one - maybe that tone is not in the bass?
 
#573
IMHO, I can't stand Pbass tone. Never could. Even back in the 1970's when I first played them. never liked them. To me the electronics just do not sound good. Now obviously there are millions that disagree, but it is the reason I don't play them. The bottom end (for me) is way to thin and the top end is way to glassy
 
#575
Ric5 said:
Actually I require my bass to do the Geddy and Squire tone and do Jamerson and Dunn tone as well. If it can't do all of that then it doesn't work for me.
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Done and done.
Link Removed

earlyrush2.jpg
 
#577
iriegnome said:
IMHO, I can't stand Pbass tone. Never could. Even back in the 1970's when I first played them. never liked them. To me the electronics just do not sound good. Now obviously there are millions that disagree, but it is the reason I don't play them. The bottom end (for me) is way to thin and the top end is way to glassy
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That's a description for the P that's new to me. I find them to have excellent bottom with a nasally top end. Just goes to show what means what to some. "Glassy" is a term I usually hear applied to single coils and some MM style pickups, but never a Precision.
 
#579
iriegnome said:
IMHO, I can't stand Pbass tone. Never could. Even back in the 1970's when I first played them. never liked them. To me the electronics just do not sound good. Now obviously there are millions that disagree, but it is the reason I don't play them. The bottom end (for me) is way to thin and the top end is way to glassy
Click to expand...

Is that why you are member #483 in the P Bass club?:hiding::p
 
#580
iriegnome said:
IMHO, I can't stand Pbass tone. Never could. Even back in the 1970's when I first played them. never liked them. To me the electronics just do not sound good. Now obviously there are millions that disagree, but it is the reason I don't play them. The bottom end (for me) is way to thin and the top end is way to glassy
Click to expand...

Sure. This is thin low end.


RECORDED DIRECT! NO EQ
 

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