The Dispersion Issue

[BassOnTheSide]

So how many of you consider dispersion or off-axis response when buying a bass cab/speaker? I know this is important for people that play live that may or may not have good FOH support, but for some (including me), I don't really think about it when selecting/buying a cab. If it sounds great with me sitting right in front of it, I'll say "it's great" and probably buy it based on that. I know this is probably a bit naiive, but that's the truth.

I know from a technical perspective that it's really important, and it greatly affects what the crowd hears at different angles, but does the crowd really care? Do you really care?

 

[ThisBass]

Does the crowd bother on the off axis dispersion of a violin?
Does a violin player hear the same spectrum like a listener on axis in 5 feet distance ?
The answer is, No!

Does a Stradivari violin sound different from a Stainer violin independent of on axis or off axis listening?
the answer is, Yes!

I bet this thread will shortly reach more than 20 pages

 

[Bassmunnky]

Foh or not - may amp is just a monitor - I'd never assume "my sound" coming from the amp the way I hear it is making it to the audience - that's what my cool DI boxes are for- VT deluxe - Tone Hammer - Bassbone OD -

 

[lomo]

I want my stack to be able to fill a small bar or resto without being in the PA, and I prefer to do my level best to avoid significant peaks and troughs in the room, so I care. YMMV.

 

[rufus.K]

I really don't take it into consideration when purchasing. I do take time/care with placement while setting up

 

[Mystic Michael]

So how many of you consider dispersion or off-axis response when buying a bass cab/speaker? I know this is important for people that play live that may or may not have good FOH support, but for some (including me), I don't really think about it when selecting/buying a cab. If it sounds great with me sitting right in front of it, I'll say "it's great" and probably buy it based on that. I know this is probably a bit naiive, but that's the truth.

I know from a technical perspective that it's really important, and it greatly affects what the crowd hears at different angles, but does the crowd really care? Do you really care?

Yes. I care.

As for whether the crowd "cares", that's a funny question. The crowd knows whether they can hear me or not. Assuming that I'm playing well, which I always strive to do, then the crowd generally cares about whether or not they can hear me. To the extent that my cabs disperse well then, one could say that the crowd "cares".

MM

 

[BassOnTheSide]

Cool. So what type of cabs or configuration do you run to address the issue?

 

[B-string]

What the audience hears to me is more important than what I hear on stage. If it's not good out where the folks that pay the bills are, I might as well stay in the band room playing with ourselves.

 

[BassOnTheSide]

Same question then. How do you address it?

 

[B-string]

Same question then. How do you address it?

The staggered speaker arrangement in the cabs I play (12") actually works pretty well. Not as good as a vertical alignment would, but the cabs are manageable size and project mids better than the vertical 215's I used to play.

 

[BassOnTheSide]

Do you use tweeters and/or horns?

 

[B-string]

Do you use tweeters and/or horns?

Usually only a touch (tweeter horn) some genres will get more (I can control the tweeter horn from the amp head).

 

[ThisBass]

I think what the OP asks is the question if the crowd really bothers about 15" cone beaming and/or typical 410/810 alignment dispersion?

 

[BassOnTheSide]

Yes! We all know about it and the "dispersion police" here on TB are always sure to point it out, but I wonder how many of us actually address it with our bass rig.

 

[Downunderwonder]

I stack 210 vertical on 115. Less than ideal.

As a bar room audience member I position myself on axis. Otherwise I suffer and curse multi ten boxes. That's why I am a card carrying member of the dispersion police.

 

[Pat C.]

So how many of you consider dispersion or off-axis response when buying a bass cab/speaker? I know this is important for people that play live that may or may not have good FOH support, but for some (including me), I don't really think about it when selecting/buying a cab. If it sounds great with me sitting right in front of it, I'll say "it's great" and probably buy it based on that. I know this is probably a bit naiive, but that's the truth.

I know from a technical perspective that it's really important, and it greatly affects what the crowd hears at different angles, but does the crowd really care? Do you really care?

I've had the same bass cabs for over 15 years and back then had no knowledge of such things to even consider them.

IMO, the PA is there to disperse the sound properly to the audience, assuming the PA is appropriate for the venue and properly deployed and operated. My amp is for me and the band. I mostly stand in front of it (many times, closer than I would like). If I move off-axis, I expect a decrease in clarity, but if I want it back, I can step back in front of it. Not a big deal. The best stage sound I've had has been on stages large enough for me to position my rig diagonally cross-fired across the stage and I could stand at least 10 feet away. Perfectly clear sound for me and the rest of the band. The PA carries the house. Would a cabinet configuration with "proper dispersion characteristics" be better in this situation? Theoretically, yes. Practically, I doubt it.

Does the crowd care? No.

Do I care? Yeah, I care that the crowd can hear me, within the context of the overall mix. I'll leave the dispersion to the PA.

-------------------

What about venues with an inadequate PA? In that case, everyone is at the mercy of the room anyway. The guitar amps are likely way more directly, peaky with terrible off-axis response compared to the bass amp. There are too many variables involved in a live music performance for the off-axis response of the bass amp to make a huge difference in the success of a show, IMO.

And There are only a small number of cabinets that claim to have theoretically proper design and dispersion through the mids and hi's (I'm thinking Fearful/Fearless, Audiokinesis, Barefaced, etc.) but I have yet to see actual published measurement results for SPL, frequency response or directivity.

 

[Marko 1]

Soon I'll be gigging my Markbass CL152 and I'm wondering how it will perform live. I've done 115 (combo), 212, 410 and 810, but never a 2x15.

Even though 98% of stages I've ever play are small, and I'm always in the PA (I provide) I'm still looking forward to it.

 

[agedhorse]

Some of us pay close attention to on axis AND off axis response during the design process, and have been doing so for decades.

I have discussed this topic several times before, and how drivers can be designed to reduce beaming if appropriate measures are taken.

 

[JimmyM]

So how many of you consider dispersion or off-axis response when buying a bass cab/speaker? I know this is important for people that play live that may or may not have good FOH support, but for some (including me), I don't really think about it when selecting/buying a cab. If it sounds great with me sitting right in front of it, I'll say "it's great" and probably buy it based on that. I know this is probably a bit naiive, but that's the truth.

I know from a technical perspective that it's really important, and it greatly affects what the crowd hears at different angles, but does the crowd really care? Do you really care?

I don't see it as naive at all. I think cabs with excellent highs and upper mid dispersion are a great thing...for PA's. But I always turn the tweeter off, and though I will try to maximize dispersion out of a bass rig when I can, such as stacking 210 cabs vertically, if I lose some high end off to the sides, I really don't miss it, even if I'm using my rig to carry the room instead of the PA. But there are bass players who want to maximize dispersion in every way possible, and for them, the technology exists and I'm glad it does.

 

[/\/\3phist0]

So how many of you consider dispersion or off-axis response when buying a bass cab/speaker? I know this is important for people that play live that may or may not have good FOH support, but for some (including me), I don't really think about it when selecting/buying a cab. If it sounds great with me sitting right in front of it, I'll say "it's great" and probably buy it based on that. I know this is probably a bit naiive, but that's the truth.

I know from a technical perspective that it's really important, and it greatly affects what the crowd hears at different angles, but does the crowd really care? Do you really care?

I do care as I often have no FOH and roam the stage and the room (wireless) I also find it funny that you,
@BassOnTheSide are asking about off axis
On the side get it ?