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The Tal Wilkenfeld Thread

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#221
Norwegianwood said:
Jesus christ, who even got started with revolutionary? What kind of burden is <i>that</i> to put on her shoulders? Our instrument isn´t that young anymore, it´s not like a new jaco is gonna come and find out how to use it.
Shes just a really talented young musician, who even happens to be a girl (how cool is that!?!) I mean, listen to the Jeff Beck stuff, she´s really good. And if you put age into the equation, I´m inclined to say her playing is extrordinary.
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Our instrument is young, and there are a few cats out there who are bringing new material on the music scene with the use of their bass. If you already think we're done with bass, then I am honestly sorry for you.

Again, theres no point of discussing this yet. I shouldn't even have said that, as there is nothing but subjectivity to emphasize it, and this in itself is no proof.

Give her a few years. She's barely on the scene now, and she's starting to play with truly inspired musicians. At the level she is now, after only 5 years of playing, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that in the coming years she will blow all our minds, and I have to admit, it's really sad to see so many players, even some with really great chops, not realize that at all.
 
#222
jerry said:
I don't know why she has to be revolutionary! Revolutionary doesnt always get you the gig, maybe revolutionary cats can be a pain in the a$$ to tour with.;) I just think she is a very hip player and composer with one of my favorite bass-player albums of the year.[and I buy a lot]
I don't think she is asking for the revolutionary-bassist-of-the-century crown or anything.
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Who says there can only be one revolutionary bassist in a century? Nice way of putting words in my mouth.

I think high of her playing I think thats obvious by now, but you people are making this into something much bigger than it is.

Seriously, why are so many of you so touchy about a female bassist kicking serious butt? Are you people that non confident in your playing that if a girl brings it on you must put her down to raise your egos? I dont mean you explicitly jerry, but some of the responses in this thread make me ashamed to be a bassist, and even more so a male one.
 
#223
morf said:
Who says there can only be one revolutionary bassist in a century? Nice way of putting words in my mouth.

I think high of her playing I think thats obvious by now, but you people are making this into something much bigger than it is.

Seriously, why are so many of you so touchy about a female bassist kicking serious butt? Are you people that non confident in your playing that if a girl brings it on you must put her down to raise your egos? I dont mean you explicitly jerry, but some of the responses in this thread make me ashamed to be a bassist, and even more so a male one.
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er...a...morf, I'm kinda on your side about Tal..;)
 
#224
morf said:
Our instrument is young, and there are a few cats out there who are bringing new material on the music scene with the use of their bass. If you already think we're done with bass, then I am honestly sorry for you.
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Obviously, bringing new material on the music scene with the use of their bass is not exactly equal to bringing about a revolution.
Please don´t feel sorry for me. I believe tons of wonderful music is yet to be made and played on our beautiful instrument. By no means do I think we are done with bass. But a revolution? Nah. And I certainly don´t think we should expect it from this very fine young musician.
 
#225
Uncle Vester said:
And no, we wouldn't be talking like that about a 40-year-old with these kind of skills, even if that person had only been playing for 5 years. Of that I'm sure.
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We do all the time - just take a look at the first 10 pages of threads in the Bassists forum! 90% of them are about guys who aren't even close to Tal's level...

I'm done here, and I have to tell you I'd be embarrassed if I had written some of the things in this thread. I sure hope she doesn't read this. It would do all of us to remember that "Cutting of someone else's head does not make you taller".

Peace.
 
#227
Norwegianwood said:
Obviously, bringing new material on the music scene with the use of their bass is not exactly equal to bringing about a revolution.
Please don´t feel sorry for me. I believe tons of wonderful music is yet to be made and played on our beautiful instrument. By no means do I think we are done with bass. But a revolution? Nah. And I certainly don´t think we should expect it from this very fine young musician.
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Depends on the quality of the new material. IMHO, cats like Wooten, MM, Jaco, all revolutionized bass guitar with their playing.

Cats like Jeff Berlin? Not really. He may be as good if not better technically then some of these players, but there is no innovation in his sound (again, IMHO). Innovation I do hear in Tal's playing. That's just to give one example to try and clarify my opinion for you though, don't take it as a Jeff Berlin bashfest because I respect the man's playing a great deal, but I don't think he was revolutionary, he lacked "the sound", for lack of better vocabulary to explain my opinion.

We'll have to agree to disagree about Tal. I'm hearing something special, you're not.
 
#228
Pacman said:
We do all the time - just take a look at the first 10 pages of threads in the Bassists forum! 90% of them are about guys who aren't even close to Tal's level...

I'm done here, and I have to tell you I'd be embarrassed if I had written some of the things in this thread. I sure hope she doesn't read this. It would do all of us to remember that "Cutting of someone else's head does not make you taller".

Peace.
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Yep, I also really hope she misses this thread. Although if she doesn't, I am sure she is already way above taking, pardon my french, piss-poor criticism, whether its centered on her playing or her sex. :D
 
#229
morf said:
There is no leaving age out of it. She's what, 23-24, 5 years of playing, and she has major chops, a monter groove and is playing with Caliuta. End of discussion as far as I'm concerned. If thats not enough for you, give it time, within a few years I dont doubt for a second you will agree :)
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The point is "revolutionary". The question remains unanswered.
 
#230
jerry said:
I don't know why she has to be revolutionary! Revolutionary doesnt always get you the gig, maybe revolutionary cats can be a pain in the a$$ to tour with.;) I just think she is a very hip player and composer with one of my favorite bass-player albums of the year.[and I buy a lot]
I don't think she is asking for the revolutionary-bassist-of-the-century crown or anything.
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She doesn't have to be, jerry. I am merely asking a question about a point that was brought up in this thread. It has nothing to do with anything Tal has said. I know she's not asking for anything, I'm asking a genuinely straight question. "Revolutionary"... how so?

That's all.
 
#232
morf said:
Depends on the quality of the new material. IMHO, cats like Wooten, MM, Jaco, all revolutionized bass guitar with their playing.

Cats like Jeff Berlin? Not really. He may be as good if not better technically then some of these players, but there is no innovation in his sound (again, IMHO). Innovation I do hear in Tal's playing. That's just to give one example to try and clarify my opinion for you though, don't take it as a Jeff Berlin bashfest because I respect the man's playing a great deal, but I don't think he was revolutionary, he lacked "the sound", for lack of better vocabulary to explain my opinion.

We'll have to agree to disagree about Tal. I'm hearing something special, you're not.
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First off all, now we are more discussing the concept of applying the term "revolution" to bass, rather than Tal´s abilities.

When it comes to the bass player in question, I hear something special too, indeed. I hear a greatly giftet young musician expressing herself. That´s special to me! But I do not hear something that will change the concept of bass guitar anytime soon. And truth to be told, I think it´s kind of unfair to ask that of her.
 
#233
morf said:
There is no leaving age out of it. She's what, 23-24, 5 years of playing, and she has major chops, a monter groove and is playing with Caliuta. End of discussion as far as I'm concerned. If thats not enough for you, give it time, within a few years I dont doubt for a second you will agree :)
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There absolutely is leaving age out of it. What does age have to do with being revolutionary?

Maybe you don't really mean "revolutionary"... I don't know. The word means something and I'm asking how it fits.

As far as what will happen in a few years... that's not revolution, it's clairvoyance.
:)



At this point I'll remind people that this really has little to do with Tal specifically, more about explaining a description of her. IME there really aren't very many revolutionary players.
 
#234
morf said:
...Give her a few years. She's barely on the scene now, and she's starting to play with truly inspired musicians. At the level she is now, after only 5 years of playing, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that in the coming years she will blow all our minds...
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I don't really disagree with you . . . but . . . it IS true that she's only been playing BASS for 5 years, but she has been playing AND STUDYING music for a LOT longer than 5 years! IIRC she quit school (at 16 years old!) to work full-time on her guitar-playing career . . . that's 7 or 8 years ago, folks . . .

Does anybody here know how long Tal has been playing (and studying) MUSIC?
 
#236
Norwegianwood said:
First off all, now we are more discussing the concept of applying the term "revolution" to bass, rather than Tal´s abilities.

When it comes to the bass player in question, I hear something special too, indeed. I hear a greatly giftet young musician expressing herself. That´s special to me! But I do not hear something that will change the concept of bass guitar anytime soon. And truth to be told, I think it´s kind of unfair to ask that of her.
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Gifted young musicians expressing themselves isn't special, it's a pretty common occurrence. You guys are understanding revolutionary from a technique viewpoint strictly. I am talking about feeling, about musical taste applied to genres, and the result of such on an audience and the musicians she plays with.
 
#238
I'll say again, I really liked Tal's CD, very listenable which is unlike the majority of the bass CD's I've heard. I would love to know how much influence the other great players on her recording had over the overall composition and arrangement. I'm sure she got a lot of help. There's nothing wrong with that. She'd be stupid not to listen to these more experienced players, it's how most all great albums are made, through a group effort. I wish Marcus would either accept more help from his touring/recording band or get new guys. His sound is very stale, he needs a fresh approach to his music.
 
#240
Peter Parker said:
I'll say again, I really liked Tal's CD, very listenable which is unlike the majority of the bass CD's I've heard. I would love to know how much influence the other great players on her recording had over the overall composition and arrangement. I'm sure she got a lot of help. There's nothing wrong with that. She'd be stupid not to listen to these more experienced players, it's how most all great albums are made, through a group effort. I wish Marcus would either accept more help from his touring/recording band or get new guys. His sound is very stale, he needs a fresh approach to his music.
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I really enjoyed her album as well. It is a nice recording with good compositions not just a bunch of endless soloing.
 
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