The Truth About Gene Simmons

[fourstringburn]

Yeah, I heard it. Written by Peter Criss by plunking every 3 notes on the white keys. C/ G/ F/ Dm/Em/Am. It's fine -- great anthem for guys in bands and their girlfriends. He can't sing for sh*t though. But feel free to tell me how many copies it sold.

Don't have the numbers but it reached number 7 on the charts so it is safe to say it will far outsell "DON'T FEAR THE REVERB" or anything you have put out. As for Peter Criss's singing, I think it sounds fine for the track. He has that raw gravely voice like Rod Stewart, Bonnie Tyler that many find appealing.

This is turning into another Gene Simmons hate, jealous, bashing thread.

You guys wouldn't like it if people were saying your music is lame, untalented, non-musical,or your bass playing s**ks would you.

I know of plenty rock bands that could fall into the simplistic category. Many of these you may like. Would it serve any purpose to ridicule them other than for being arrogant, pompous, and self gratification?

 

[plangentmusic]

Ahhh the jab was half in jest and meant in fun...don't take it personally!

As mentioned, your choice of thread title and using Kiss as your metaphor detracts greatly from the points you were trying to get across. Considering the outbreak of negativity we recently had here, I thought it was a very poor choice.

IMO, alot of your points on pop song writing are very accurate. It has gotten to the point where everything is manufactured and follows a formula. Often it seems that the secret ingredient is money, or knowing someone with money to back you and push you to the top. Why else would (band X) sellout shows worldwide, while a genius is having to flip burgers on the side just to make it?
Yet, there are those that despite the money, and initial success that having money behind you can bring, have zero staying power. Others become legends, living gods, but when you break it down....nothing they do is that special! So why the injustices?
Probably for the same reason other injustices exist: life isn't fair. In the same minute one baby is born into wealth, another into poverty. A baby is held up as a sign of hope for the future for being born on 911, and years later the same baby is shot dead at by a madman and becomes a symbol of our hopelessness.
All we can do, is do our best. Maybe we will be propelled into success and wealth and history. Maybe we'll just stay around the house and play on the side because it's what we love to do and enjoy being with the family. Just do your best. Because Jaco won't happen again, the Beatles won't, and neither will Kiss or Hank Williams...but something will!

Good post.

 

[skidrawk]

but really, get up and get your grandma out of here

 

[plangentmusic]

Don't have the numbers but it reached number 7 on the charts so it is safe to say it will far outsell "DON'T FEAR THE REVERB" or anything you have put out. As for Peter Criss's singing, I think it sounds fine for the track. He has that raw gravely voice like Rod Stewart, Bonnie Tyler that many find appealing.

This is turning into another Gene Simmons hate, jealous, bashing thread.

You guys wouldn't like it if people were saying your music is lame, untalented, non-musical,or your bass playing s**ks would you.

I know of plenty rock bands that could fall into the simplistic category. Many of these you may like. Would it serve any purpose to ridicule them other than for being arrogant, pompous, and self gratification?

HAHAHAHA Are you serious? Did you just try to knock me that saying a KISS album will sell more than mine? LOL!!! For real?

Interesting that you're calling this a hate, bashing, jealousy thread. No one has bashed Gene. No one has shown any hate. (Expect toward me) And EVERYONE is jealous of his money!

Dude, you're so taking this the wrong way. Get a grip.

 

[fourstringburn]

Not a knock, but I did say it is safe to say that the song Beth and any Kiss album will outsell anything you have put out.

If I'm wrong, than who are you and what have you put out and that will put it to rest.

Also I said this thread is turning into a bashing thread, not that it has , so don't mince words!

 

[MrRiff]

Don't worry...this is not a thread to debate the merits or the foibles of Gene Simmons. He's fine. Certainly competent for what he needs to do but nothing amazing. I'm sure even Gene would be in agreement with that assessment. So, let's leave that alone. On to my main point...

I see within a lot of those types of threads a major misunderstanding. it's about songwriting. KISS sold millions of records so people assume they must be good songwriters, or in the least ....decent?

Here's the reality. Writing a rock and roll song is relatively easy. It's comparable to a skill such as sketching, or hanging wallpaper. Some people do it better than others and some people can't do it al all. But it's hardly an elite artistic talent. A million guys can do it.

But that's the magic of music. When it's all done in time and in tune and with good sounds, it takes on a power. It moves people. It makes them think it's more than it actually is. And the truth of the matter is, even if you're mediocre -- even if you're LESS than mediocre -- with enough time and effort and experience you can take any old crappy song and do it well enough to elicit that reaction.

Let's face it -- KISS weren't signed for being hitmakers. They had a gimmick that the record company knew would sell. The music is secondary. In their career of 100 or so songs, about five are barely pretty good. (Arguably) At any rate, that ain't that great.

Now of course, the pedestrian response is "Well, YOU do it!" Well, I have. But in the music industry it isn't about ability, it's about having the right product at the right time and being involved with the right people. That's not sour grapes. I've experienced it myself. I was on a TV show for 5 years. Why? I got lucky. Right place/right time. Meanwhile there are guys who can recite Shakespeare who are waiting on tables. I'm not saying I'm not a good actor. But it's still 90% luck.

So there it is. Don't look too much into it. There's talent all over the place. On Youtube. Right here on TB. Next door, upstairs , accros the street. And then there's mediocrity -- on TV. In the movies. On the stage at Madison Square Garden. At the Grammy's.

That's show biz.

Right On and well put.

 

[fourstringburn]

Also you just to a stab by Kiss by saying Peter Criss' voice sucks and the song is nothing more than plunking keys on the piano. Surely that has a jealous overtone.

Jealousy is an form of hatred.

 

[plangentmusic]

Not a knock, but I did say it is safe to say that the song Beth and any Kiss album will outsell anything you have put out.

If I'm wrong, than who are you and what have you put out and that will put it to rest.

Also I said this thread is turning into a bashing thread, not that it has , so don't mince words!

You're right. Whoever sells the most records is the best! And between 2 artists, whoever sells more, is better. It makes perfect sense.

And as long as someone doesn't outsell someone else they should not have an opinion.

Okay then. Close down TalkBass, because there's nothing else left to say!

Oh, wait a minute. Does that mean if I sell more records than YOU, then you're not entitled to have an opinion about ME?!?!

COOL!

 

[Dymond-]

Don't have the numbers but it reached number 7 on the charts so it is safe to say it will far outsell "DON'T FEAR THE REVERB" or anything you have put out. As for Peter Criss's singing, I think it sounds fine for the track. He has that raw gravely voice like Rod Stewart, Bonnie Tyler that many find appealing.

This is turning into another Gene Simmons hate, jealous, bashing thread.

You guys wouldn't like it if people were saying your music is lame, untalented, non-musical,or your bass playing s**ks would you.

I know of plenty rock bands that could fall into the simplistic category. Many of these you may like. Would it serve any purpose to ridicule them other than for being arrogant, pompous, and self gratification?

Seems pretty clear by your post that you are trying to turn it into a Gene hate, jealous, bashing thread. I could say a few things about KISS in here that would piss off a lot of people, but I wont for the sake of the OP and the discussion he is trying to provoke.

OP: Its all about getting that big break, and KISS seemed to have got it. And your defiantly right about Youtube. There is tons and tons of talent on Youtube being posted every day, its great to see it, but it would be better if I could see that same talent onstage at a show.

 

[plangentmusic]

Seems pretty clear by your post that you are trying to turn it into a Gene hate, jealous, bashing thread. I could say a few things about KISS in here that would piss off a lot of people, but I wont for the sake of the OP and the discussion he is trying to provoke.

OP: Its all about getting that big break, and KISS seemed to have got it. And your defiantly right about Youtube. There is tons and tons of talent on Youtube being posted every day, its great to see it, but it would be better if I could see that same talent onstage at a show.

Dead on.

 

[plangentmusic]

Also you just to a stab by Kiss by saying Peter Criss' voice sucks and the song is nothing more than plunking keys on the piano. Surely that has a jealous overtone.

Jealousy is an form of hatred.

Stating that a song is made up of white key triads is a form of hate?

Huh. Never knew that.

 

[odin70]

I've never been a KISS or Gene Simmons fan, however after watching this video I have a whole different respect for the man as a patriot.

And this is the man that could not support Live Aid, because he should not interfere with "politics"
On the other hand what would his favourite land (besides U$A) be without US military support and presence in the middle east?

 

[Meyatch]

Gene & Kiss aren't necessary for the OP to make his point or share his opinion.

He put Gene in the title because Gene threads will get more readers than "the day I almost got to hang with Hasselhoff, and what I think of the music biz" as a title.

Just ignore it, he'll start a new thread in a bit...prolly about Squiers being cool or something.

Its a meta thread title.

Proving his point that the marketing is more important than the content!

clever.

 

[plangentmusic]

Its a meta thread title.

Proving his point that the marketing is more important than the content!

clever.

 

[THand]

Its a meta thread title.

Proving his point that the marketing is more important than the content!

clever.

 

[Ben Noblit]

Because Jaco won't happen again, the Beatles won't, and neither will Kiss or Hank Williams...but something will!

While I entirely agree with most of THand's post here, I somewhat disagree with the quoted bit. It seems that one could argue that KISS IS happening again, in the person of Lady Gaga. They both have an amazing talent for showmanship and marketing, a keen sense of what the audience wants, catchy hooks, minimal musical skill, good pop songwriting, and a gimmick.

 

[plangentmusic]

While I entirely agree with most of THand's post here, I somewhat disagree with the quoted bit. It seems that one could argue that KISS IS happening again, in the person of Lady Gaga. They both have an amazing talent for showmanship and marketing, a keen sense of what the audience wants, catchy hooks, minimal musical skill, good pop songwriting, and a gimmick.

Not to open any additional cans of worms but I think LGG has a much more developed melodic sense.

 

[HEADLE]

Aaaahhh, Haters in the House.

"The Truth about Gene Simmons". It's a the internet equivalent to a buglight. Lot's of folks here on this forum will be unable to bring themselves to not fly into it.

There is no "truth" about Gene, other than he's just a fella. No different from many others in the music biz. He joined a band in the early 1970s that became very successful and he was able to parlay that into a celebrity career that lasted decades beyond. That career is ongoing. Good for him! We should all have our hard work rewarded so.

And he did work hard. All the successful ones do.

You don't like his music? Who cares? If you look at your radio, or TV, you'll notice that there is more than one station. Know why? Cuz it's not all there for you. Some people like things you don't like. Haters can make themselves feel more sophisticated by slagging some dude they've never met on an internet forum because they don't like the artist's product, but what are you accomplishing? Have you raised anyone's artistic appreciation that way lately? Didn't think so.

Gene didn't write any songs? They're still playing Rock n Roll all Night on the radio. Over the years I've heard plenty others. A popular music career doesn't last four decades because you've got cute boots.

Know what I like about Gene musically (this is a musical forum, no?)
-I LOVE his tone in the early days. That distorted Gibson Ripper was heavy duty in 1974.
-The Macca inspired melodic lines that sometimes served as a counter point to the guitars. Now, this changed sometime around 1979 (the whole band did - drugs, fatigue, creative burnout, star syndrome, overexposure) but early on Gene's patterns showed creativity and melodic awareness. Later metal players tended to stick to root notes and speed. Early Kiss is more melodic and Gene's basslines were a big reason.
-Dedication to performance. Rock and Roll is part circus. Don't like it? Don't buy a ticket, Plebius. But Gene hated going to a rock concert and watching some wanker turn in a dead show. He made sure his band didn't do that.

You don't have to be the best bass player in the world. I don't want to be and neither did he. But he wanted to be in a great Rock n Roll band and for awhile there, Kiss really was.

Buy a ticket to the show, my friends. Maybe not his, but someone else's. Maybe down the street. But go see a live band. It's cool. It's fun. It's rock n roll.

+1000000000

I have noticed that the people who really talk crap about KISS are musicians. MOST of the world are not musicians. I find that for the most part non-musicians love them. Makes me wonder sometimes if we as musicians sometimes try to hard to turn in too much of a performance and turn some "lay people" off. Here we are talking about Kiss and Nickelback like they were a bunch of hacks. I certainly would like to achieve hack status if that is the case.

H

 

[rockstarbassist]

The truths are, is that he is a member of one of the biggest top 5, maybe top 3 bands of all time, haz a gagillion dollars, an awesome life anyone pretty much on the planet would swap for, and got that way by providing people with what they really want. He's an entertainer first, musician second.

It isn't terribly complicated.

 

[plangentmusic]

I happen to think Nickleback has a great voice. I just can't tell one song from the next.