Thunderbird Club

[willsellout]

I too had those exact thoughts when I got my Classic IV T-bird. That it was everything I wanted the Ric to be (and more).

Not to fanboy out too much about the T-bird but this is exactly it. Maybe I was trying to make the Ric into something it's not, but there have been very few basses that have passed through my hands that have felt as comfortable and natural as the T-bird for me. And the tone is perfect. Even string volume across all the strings and up and down the neck. Fat and punchy with a lot of sustain and clarity.

And back to the Ric. I still love Ric's. I think they are great basses. I think they are beautiful and they sound great. But I can't deny their shortcomings. Every bass has their own faults though and there are lots of people who pick up a Ric and feel exactly like I feel when I pick up the 'bird. And for that I'm happy. Different strokes!

 

[D.M.N.]

I like where you're going. Do you plan to extend the upper horn a little to counter the large (and heavy) headstock?

No, I don't really want to ruin the aesthetics of the Jr body with a longer horn (much like I'm not fond of the extended upper horn on the newly announced Embassys). I'd likely put the strap pin on the back center, like where it's located on EB-3s and old Thunderbirds. But the neck dive is something I'm thinking about. Thought #1 is to essentially up the entire body a bit to add some more weight and size to the body, then use Ultralite tuners, and go for a 32" scale. Carlo would know best, I'm unclear whether the original EB-0 had the same sized body as the LP Jr. guitar, if it is I'd definitely upsize the body. I love my EB-3, but at 6ft it looks a bit tiny on me, and I'd prefer the proportions closer to a full sized bass. Additionally, they way I normally hold my basses helps combat neck dive. As you see I have the armrest on there, and I usually wear my basses fairly high and rest my forearm and elbow on the upper bout, and play between the pickup and the neck, or rest my hand on the cover when playing with a pick, similarly to Entwistle, which helps counter neck dive by holding it down more with the right arm than holding it up with the left.

 

[redstrand]

My 77 4001 doesn't make noise and isn't as noisy as a jazz, yes it had "that" sound. Honestly I bought it due to the neck, paid for it before plugging it in. It just feels right. Just like my TV Silver TBird, loves this so much more than the silver burst I had.

 

[TBird1958]

Loved my "73 4001, wished I'd never let it go really. For me the E string wasn't perhaps what I thought it should be, but I never found that to be a serious shortcoming. I love Ricks, everything about them.

 

[Rocker47]

I pretty much meet that criteria, except for the tube amp. I've got DR Lo-Riders (my go-to, all-purpose rounds for years) on my bird, but lately I've been really digging EB Cobalt flats. I put them on my custom Jag (a very aggressive sounding bass with rounds) and they sound fantastic and the bass hasn't lost any of its aggressive character. So when I built my P, I put Cobalt flats on that as well (a natural choice) and they sound great on that bass too, without sounding at all like the Jag. I've thought about putting them on the T-Bird, but I can't shake the feeling that flats would hold this bass back too much, even though they don't seem to hamper the Jag. So I'm just as curious to see what other people recommend.

I have rotosound flats on my 2006 stock bird and keep getting told it sounds great. They are the 77's. I have them on my Pbass as well. I like them, but they don't seem to get too much love here. I also have a set of 88's on my Epi Jack Casady and love them also. I have chromes on another bird and same thing....I like them. Maybe I'm too easy to please? Haha!

 

[Gaolee]

A string question for very specific players...

Looking to replace the string set on my TBird for the first time but before I do I thought it would be interesting to hear from other Bird brains on what they use.

However, I'm only looking for feedback from a very specific type of player...

If you own a Gibby or Eppi TBird and play mostly finger style, and don't really slap pop or tap, and don't like fret buzz but do like nice low action and clean clear deep bass notes with a present but not prominent mid range and a slightly low key top end that's clear and smooth not harsh or overly crisp, and you have a tendency to favor the neck pickup, and you typically position your right hand near the neck pup or even up to the neck heel while playing classic/progressive/alternative rock through a tube rig with 10" or 15" speakers - I'd like to hear what strings you use.

The reason for all the qualifiers is I've found just about every one of those factors to have a significant impact on the strings one chooses to play. If I were a pic player over the bridge pup with the neck pup off and playing acid metal I'd choose completely different strings than a finger player over the neck pup playing smooth jazz.

So how 'bout it, anyone out there in Birdland fit the outline above???

I don't use a tube rig. I use an Acoustic Control stack that has a folded horn or a little Carvin combo, so there's the amp disclaimer. Otherwise, my playing is a whole lot like yours. I often play closer to the bridge, depending on the sound I want at the time, but I don't usually want too much anger out of the bass.

I don't slap at all and rarely pop. It's a rare occasion that I play with a pick.

The strings I like best on my Thunderbirds of all kinds are Cobalt Flats. I find that they are touch sensitive in a way that lets the bass sound like it needs to for the song. For example, I can dial it way back and get thumpy for mid-60s Motown type sounds and then get the aggressive sounds that make the Pretenders' "Back on the Chain Gang" sound like it does in places. DR Sunbeams are good, too, if you prefer rounds. Chromes aren't bad, but not as good as the other two. I have been far less happy with Sadowsky flats and other DRs on 'Birds.

For what its worth, I had TI Jazz flats on the Ric for a while, when I had the Ric. I didn't like them very much on that bass. Sunbeams worked much better. Perhaps Cobalt flats would have worked, too, but the Ric was gone before I discovered those. It was nice enough, and I didn't have any of the noise or other problems other people have reported. It just wasn't a Thunderbird.

 

[Korladis]

I don't use a tube rig. I use an Acoustic Control stack that has a folded horn or a little Carvin combo, so there's the amp disclaimer. Otherwise, my playing is a whole lot like yours. I often play closer to the bridge, depending on the sound I want at the time, but I don't usually want too much anger out of the bass.

I don't slap at all and rarely pop. It's a rare occasion that I play with a pick.

The strings I like best on my Thunderbirds of all kinds are Cobalt Flats. I find that they are touch sensitive in a way that lets the bass sound like it needs to for the song. For example, I can dial it way back and get thumpy for mid-60s Motown type sounds and then get the aggressive sounds that make the Pretenders' "Back on the Chain Gang" sound like it does in places. DR Sunbeams are good, too, if you prefer rounds. Chromes aren't bad, but not as good as the other two. I have been far less happy with Sadowsky flats and other DRs on 'Birds.

For what its worth, I had TI Jazz flats on the Ric for a while, when I had the Ric. I didn't like them very much on that bass. Sunbeams worked much better. Perhaps Cobalt flats would have worked, too, but the Ric was gone before I discovered those. It was nice enough, and I didn't have any of the noise or other problems other people have reported. It just wasn't a Thunderbird.

Never really dug flats. One of those "sounds cool when other people do it" things for me.

I pretty much don't use slap and pop at all. So it's frustrating when I try to watch a youtube demo of a bass or an amp and it's all that. I'm not saying that there shouldn't be any of it; just that I want to hear finger style and pick style as well.

 

[Mosstone]

You said every one you ever tried sounded like yours. My 4003S sounds about like other 4003s I've tried. The logical conclusion is that it sounds a lot like yours, which you think is "bad."

Let's maintain the thread of the conversation here. You said: "I'm sorry my bass tone doesn't match your refined palette then."

I wasn't talking about your bass tone, I was talking about mine. And I didn't think it sounded bad, I thought it sounded terrible. I have the right to express my opinion about my own bass. I also have the right to observe that current 4003s that I have tried sound very much like the bass that I owned. You decided to make it about your bass.

Just explaining why I don't care about RWRP.

Fair enough.

So before you said you were only talking about your bass, but now you're saying that there must be something wrong with two of my other basses because my bass couldn't possibly not be noisy? Which is it? Are you talking about your bass or mine?

That was meant as a joke, actually (I'm not taking this very seriously ).

The 4004 sounds darker than the 4003, true, unless you do some knob twiddling. Like a stock T-bird, even. And given that you're on the T-bird thread, seems like it would be more up your alley.

I don't know that I have an 'alley' per se. I like diversity in my guitars and basses. I don't identify with one particular type of sound any more.. I used to think all I needed, or all I'd ever want is a Jazz bass, and if you feel that way, then that statement is 100% true. But now, I think different basses and guitars are appropriate for different applications. If I hear a particular tone in my head, I want to have the instrument that's capable of recreating that tone at my disposal.

For example; one time, I wrote a song that really felt like it needed a Telecaster sound, but I didn't own a Tele and I couldn't get that tone from my other guitars. I didn't want to spend a lot of money buying one (I didn't think I really liked Teles at the time) so I built a Tele and discovered that I really do like them - and I'm building another one. But I'm not gonna go all John 5 and play nothing but Telecasters.

Anyway, it just gets annoying whenever you talk about the issues with the 4003 and someone invariably says: "You shoulda got a 4004 if it bothers you that much".

It's like complaining that your steak is over-cooked and having someone tell you that you shoulda got the fish if you didn't want over-cooked steak. Or; "My steak is burnt to a crisp and that's they way it oughta be! I don't know what your problem is".

I just get annoyed because this forum likes to bash two of the basses I own, constantly....You say I'm telling you that your negative experience is erroneous or invalid? Well, to me, on this subforum of talkbass, I've come to feel like everyone is telling me that my positive experiences with 4003s and T-birds are erroneous or invalid. And I had thought this particular thread was above that.

I'm sorry, my intention was not to bash Rickenbackers. I just said I used to love them until I bought one, and I was content to leave it at that. I didn't go off on a rant, or say anything disrespectful (I'm not saying you did either).

And I regret using the term "thin skinned". That was pejorative. But I meant it in the most general sense. By and large, Ric aficionados do tend to be hyper-sensitive to criticism of Rickenbacker products. And honestly (again, speaking generally here, not about you personally) I think it reeks of insecurity and the need for validation.

I have never thrown shade on anyone for digging Rics, or told them that they were wrong for liking them, but I should be able to talk about my own experience in frank terms without being afraid of hurting someone's feelings, or worse, angering them.

For example; I like T-Birds, but I've been a Fender (sorry, 7ender) guy for years, and there's a fair amount of jabs taken at 7ender basses and 7ender players in this thread, but I don't take it personally. I don't feel like I have to defend anything, or get all butt-hurt if someone makes a joke about them.

Ric fans even turn on each other... Just wait until someone mentions that they want to put a Hipshot bridge on their 4003 and watch the ad hominem attacks begin.

Anyway, the last thing I want to do is alienate anybody, so I'm willing to drop the whole thing and forget it ever happened.

 

[Mosstone]

Not to fanboy out too much about the T-bird but this is exactly it. Maybe I was trying to make the Ric into something it's not, but there have been very few basses that have passed through my hands that have felt as comfortable and natural as the T-bird for me. And the tone is perfect. Even string volume across all the strings and up and down the neck. Fat and punchy with a lot of sustain and clarity.

And back to the Ric. I still love Ric's. I think they are great basses. I think they are beautiful and they sound great. But I can't deny their shortcomings. Every bass has their own faults though and there are lots of people who pick up a Ric and feel exactly like I feel when I pick up the 'bird. And for that I'm happy. Different strokes!

Eh... You can fanboy out a little bit. I always gush about mine to anyone who asks. And yeah... Rics are great for other people... Just not for me. I wish Geddy was still playing a Rickenbacker.

 

[Mosstone]

I have rotosound flats on my 2006 stock bird and keep getting told it sounds great. They are the 77's. I have them on my Pbass as well. I like them, but they don't seem to get too much love here. I also have a set of 88's on my Epi Jack Casady and love them also. I have chromes on another bird and same thing....I like them. Maybe I'm too easy to please? Haha!

Maybe... I always hated flats until I tried the Cobalts, (and I've tried many!). LaBellas sound great on my Beatle bass, too.

 

[Count Bassie]

A string question for very specific players...

Looking to replace the string set on my TBird for the first time but before I do I thought it would be interesting to hear from other Bird brains on what they use.

However, I'm only looking for feedback from a very specific type of player...

If you own a Gibby or Eppi TBird and play mostly finger style, and don't really slap pop or tap, and don't like fret buzz but do like nice low action and clean clear deep bass notes with a present but not prominent mid range and a slightly low key top end that's clear and smooth not harsh or overly crisp, and you have a tendency to favor the neck pickup, and you typically position your right hand near the neck pup or even up to the neck heel while playing classic/progressive/alternative rock through a tube rig with 10" or 15" speakers - I'd like to hear what strings you use.

The reason for all the qualifiers is I've found just about every one of those factors to have a significant impact on the strings one chooses to play. If I were a pic player over the bridge pup with the neck pup off and playing acid metal I'd choose completely different strings than a finger player over the neck pup playing smooth jazz.

So how 'bout it, anyone out there in Birdland fit the outline above???

A loose answer..

I'm that player.

I had a Schecter Stiletto Elite, modded w/ a DiMarzio Model 1 in the sweet spot, some Jazz-type thing at the bridge. I had a set of GHS Brite Flats, standard gauge (they're polished-down roundwounds). That bass killed it for me. It's all over Plan 9's last album, "A Tonic of Puffer Fish", and the tone is solid and stout, but has a good deal of tonal variety with a semi-slippery, noodly bass line.
They didn't even try to give glassy highs, but the recorded sound was effectively 'awake' in the upper ranges and harmonics when I'd go to bend around a sharp turn in the melody or phrasing.
I really liked them, you're reminding me to go get another set.

Currently I have a set of DR Black Beauties on my Blackbird. At first I didn't like them, visually they threw me, and the coating tries to eventually slough off... they are a little thinner sounding than the GHS mentioned above, but that's not bad. I've still managed to get a throttling, deep-mids punch out of them, they just have a more 'open' sound, pronounced highs and a little less stout.

Thinking about how to describe the Ernie Ball Cobalt Flats. Those were very plain-sounding, in a good way. Definitely flats character-wise, with strong highs and solid body. They have some snarl to them.

Gonna go back for some of those GHS...

Edit... not trying to give myself a plug there about the record thing- but it's always fun to hear your sound from outside yourself.

 

[JIO]

Bill Laswell was my introduction to the 8-string back in the 80's:



This song made me go out and order one soon after (Ibanez Musician neckthrough 8-string Bass), and I had to wait 3 months for the shop to get it from Japan...

I bought this (album) when new - haven't heard it for a while. Killer musicians all -

 

[Mosstone]

No, I don't really want to ruin the aesthetics of the Jr body with a longer horn (much like I'm not fond of the extended upper horn on the newly announced Embassys). I'd likely put the strap pin on the back center, like where it's located on EB-3s and old Thunderbirds. But the neck dive is something I'm thinking about. Thought #1 is to essentially up the entire body a bit to add some more weight and size to the body, then use Ultralite tuners, and go for a 32" scale. Carlo would know best, I'm unclear whether the original EB-0 had the same sized body as the LP Jr. guitar, if it is I'd definitely upsize the body. I love my EB-3, but at 6ft it looks a bit tiny on me, and I'd prefer the proportions closer to a full sized bass. Additionally, they way I normally hold my basses helps combat neck dive. As you see I have the armrest on there, and I usually wear my basses fairly high and rest my forearm and elbow on the upper bout, and play between the pickup and the neck, or rest my hand on the cover when playing with a pick, similarly to Entwistle, which helps counter neck dive by holding it down more with the right arm than holding it up with the left.

This reminded me of a design that a fellow on a guitar forum that I frequent is having manufactured in China. He started with a DC Junior, but extended the horn just a little bit. I think that was more to avoid trademark issues than for balance, though (the Gibson style headstock is gonna go, too). The overall effect is it looks like a cross between a Gibson LP Special and a PRS. I think it looks cool.

 

[tombowlus]

The D-Bird has landed, and it's already hanging out with its older brutha from anutha mutha!

 

[Haji]

Man, I dig the D Bird.

 

[TBird1958]

The D-Bird has landed, and it's already hanging out with its older brutha from anutha mutha!

Congratulations!

Lovely bass!

 

[RedVee]

I did not pick up a bass until 38. I am 41. I am so PO'd at myself for not doing this sooner. I envy the playing years you all have under your belts (or skirts).

53 for me, now 55 in January; and I agree. Giving up on not doing stuff because of what other "might" think.
Who cares !

 

[Nocturnal]

The D-Bird has landed, and it's already hanging out with its older brutha from anutha mutha!

I love the look of the D-bird! When will we get a review??

 

[kat888]

The D-Bird has landed, and it's already hanging out with its older brutha from anutha mutha!

I like how you have holes around the edges of your Bird table to let the blood drain away ... oh, and you have some serious parallax issues with your camera dude, albeit it only seems to affect one side of the lens.

 

[PillO]

53 for me, now 55 in January; and I agree. Giving up on not doing stuff because of what other "might" think.
Who cares !

Yeah, I don't know what is with these youngsters that take up bass far too early in life. Shouldn't you be out risking your life before middle age (or was that just me)?