Originally posted by billys73
I apologize for sticking my comments in your quote.
Just trying to be clear. Happy Holidays to everyone!
quote:
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Originally posted by billys73
I agree with a fair amount of what you are saying.
But, I think you hit on the defining difference between our experiences.
I believe that the Electric bass is PRIMARILY a electric musical instrument. That doesn't mean that I think it doesn't have acoustic properties! By the way, I can fully hear the acoustic properties of an electric instrument unplugged. They are obvious and important.
You (and others) believe it is primarily an acoustic instrument. I don't. That's cool, it's been an interesting discussion!
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Ever play a synth unplugged?
Billy: No. That would be useless. It has NO acoustic properties.
Still thinks electric bass is not primarily an acoustic instrument?
Billy: Yes. It is not PRIMARILY an acoustic instrument.
An Uprite bass is an acoustic instrument. A trumpet is an acoustic instrument. etc....If you put a pick-up on them, they are still acoustic instruments.
Interesting. So, how many basic categories of instruments are there in your opinion? The "if you put a pick-up on them" POV is interesting. They somehow maintain their "acoustic-ness" while the bass guitar doesn't because...?
I asked about the synth for what I would've thought an obvious reason... even with a pickup the only sound you'd hear would be the clank of the keys.
It would be interesting to know what you would consider acoustic bass guitars to be? IMO they're louder (unplugged) versions of solidbody basses, though still meant to be plugged in, in lieu of placing a mic in front of it... where do you draw the line? They're still stringed instruments that first and foremost emit an audible sound that reflects what is being done to it.
Maybe there's confusion over primary design vs. primary use. Maybe this is more complicated than it seems. IMO it isn't. YMMV
Most builders I know, at least the really good ones, consider the acoustic properties of an electric bass to be very important. Get that part right first and getting a great sound out of the bass is much easier.
Billy: Above, in my post, I said that the acoustic properties of the Electric bass are important.
But apparently we disagree as to how important
I think the key to a great bass is a design that speaks acoustically first. Again, talk to most luthiers and see where they stand. I'd think their opinion might have some relevance as they are the ones who actually have to deal with these issues when designing and/or building.
No, they aren't all meant to reach optimum volume unamplified (though some do) but that doesn't change the fact that you can hear them, even without plugging them in AND you can hear tonal characteristics from them while doing it.
If, as you say, you can fully hear the acoustic properties of an electric instrument unplugged, it should follow that you can hear when an amp is either staying relatively true to what you heard or is deviating. It's really no more complicated than that*.
Billy: It's a lot more complicated than that. You need to listen to sounds at the same volume to compare them.
Being able to hear one sound doesn't mean you've set up an accurate test for comparing two sounds. Especially at different volumes.
Actually it doesn't have to be as complicated as you're trying to make it.
You hear what you hear. Either it sounds transparent to you or it doesn't. Why do you think it's more complicated? We're talking about letting an instrument sound like it sounds. The key being "sound". In the case of the onboard electronics-driven basses, it's a matter of letting that sound through.
Listen at identical volume? I have no idea where this came from? It's just not true. I can play one bass unplugged and another plugged in and get an immediate idea of which one I'd prefer. Done it a bunch of times. The same is true of amps.
As far as accurate tests go, I'd guess you'd have to define "accurate". What we're talking about here is not a lab experiment, it doesn't require an oscilloscope or white coat. You can compare two different things at different times in different places... you'll know what you liked and didn't like as much.
I agree, it has been an interesting discussion. No better way to understand where people are coming from than talking things out.
Billy: Cool. 
Hey, I tried. I'll stop kicking this one
*Okay, it can be, with the aforementioned instruments whose electronics play a major role in their final sound. You don't really know what the intended sound is with these until you plug in.
Aaah....I almost missed the fine print! Yes, exactly! We're blood brothers now!
You do realize I meant Alembics, Cirruses, Smiths and basses that have a large part of their character defined by their electronics? Not other basses with less reliance on their electronics for their basic sound.
