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Double Bass Wasn't RED a GREAT Player?

#321
chris dammann said:
okay i havn't read all 15 pgs of this thread, but has anyone mentioned the arco solo red takes on stardust from Ben Webster's live at the renaissance? its pure soul. its the kind of thing, one has dreams about. i got the album burned from a friend and always marveled at the bass playing and only recently found out who it was. i can't put into words how it makes me feel. it transcends story telling into something purely experiential. its the kind of thing i remember when i think about all the time i seemingly waste playing music.
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This side is a period of transition for Red. It's Red's first recorded side with the big Tyrol five-stringer. His attempt at trying to cop Gene Ammons tenor sound is apparent here. They do "Stardust" in the original key of Db. You can hear Red play that low Db on the B string all over the place. Actually, I find similarities with Jimmy Blanton's arco solos in Red too. So nice to hear arco bass without all that silly "virtuostic cello-envy" vibrato crapolla with solo tuning.
Red's solo would have been even more effective, if Frank Butler hadn't been dropping bass drum bombs on beat one, every bar in the background. Good thing he's gone now, or ida sent out my :ninja: Boyz.
Edit: Circa 1960. Same venue as Red's "Rejoice! Red Mitchell cello debut...Live from the Renaissance". Hollywood. Jazz cello, tuned in 4ths. Red, with Jim Hall, Frank Strazerri, piano, Jimmy Bond, bass and Frank Butler. Red could get nasty on bass, but on jazz cello, he's downright FILTHY. Alotta guys were doing this shtick in those days (including myownself) but Red made everybody else sound idiotic.
At one point in the cello side, you can hear Jim say, during the piano solo: "Hey Red..... We oughtta take this band to New York!"
 
#325
Good luck, man. Hard to find. I have it on an old vinyl. Never heard about it being released on a disc.

Side-bar...when I made my first trip out to L.A. to see Red, I was just out of high school. (59) Red and Rosie welcomed me to a club called "Sherry's" in Hollywood like I was their long lost son. Red played bass, arco and pizz five string. I played some jazz cello. Then Red played piano and I played bass....my first venture on a fiver.: eek: Then we'd switch up with Red on cello. The carpet needed a thorough vacuuming after he played.....funk all over da place. Ron Zito on drums and I can't remember the pianist's name. Bob West also joined the fun on bass, as well.....Whatta ******* night. I'll NEVER forget that one.

WARNING: The Ben Webster date.....the piano that Jimmy has to play is the most out of tune piano I've EVER heard in a recording.
 
#328
Just got this email from Bill Mays:

Hello to all bassists and fans of bass/piano duos:

Bassist extraordinaire Red Mitchell and I made two TV shows in 1982 in Los Angeles. Recently unearthed and edited, four tunes are now available at YouTube. They offer a wonderful close-up look at Red’s unique technique, tuning in 5ths, his great solos, and some snappy early 80s hairstyles!

Here’re the links:

Well, You Needn’t:

‘Round Midnight:
 
#330
thanks for those youtube links, great seeing ,hearing Red play.

Up until a little while ago ,there was some fantastic youtube footage of Red with Zoot Simms , and a guitar player ,who i can't recall, playing in someones sitting room , this was totally amazing playing from all three, art at its highest level.... but unfortunately it has been removed , ..... a real shame ,
if anyone has this stuff , can they PLEASE post it, .... thanks.

Paul W. i can't recall if you have mentioned this recording from Red , ..... i have it on vinyl, recorded around 1980 i think , entitled 'When I'm Singing ' . Its Red on bass , piano and vocals, overdubbed so he's doin all three at once sometimes, incredible album,some of his best stuff i ever heard , fantastic bass sound , very acoustic sounding , and his piano playing on it is pretty awesome too.

That man really was a genius if you wanna call anyone one , ...
imo ,

oscar
 
#333
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Here ya go oscar. Also, "Gone with the wind" over on the menu on the right. dailymotion can be a bit testy at times, but pretty good generally.
The guitarist is Rune Gustafson.
The album you're refering to, I don't seem to have. :eek: What tunes are on it?
My favorite Red sans bass cut is on "Home Suite" done in the Mitchell's living room in Stockholm. This is the one I've mentioned before on these pages. Red's vocal quality takes a minute to get used to.....rough and burlesquey, but so was Billie's. On "Body and Soul" he plays piano, sings AND whistles in unison with the piano. Doesn't state the melody at all. I had been playing that tune for about 40 years when I heard this. He reharms a couple chords and it sounds like I've never heard it before. Again, as I said before, I've played this cut for some pretty well known musicians.....most of the time it was a sense of awe. One time I played it for a well known Canadian bassist...I looked over for some response from him, he looked back with tears in his eyes.

EDIT: Once more, and I hope the last time. I been getting some PM's on this....cool, BUT...YES I know Red's sound became too long to really be functional in the rhythm section. AGAIN, let me say that he no longer was a jazz bassist....he did this **** on purpose. He loved the sound of the bass as a VOCAL or HORN-like vehicle for his voice. That's why, at times, it sounds over-amped and out in front. If you want pure, kick-ass jazz bass playing with the same melodic soloing, go back to the Hampton Hawes stuff from the 50's and 60's. And, IMO, he wasn't a "jazz bassist" in the end...he was A voice. That's what he went for and that's what he got....and so did we. Is this so difficult to understand?
No more "heads up" PM's please. :help::help:
 
#335
Paul Warburton said:
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Here ya go oscar. Also, "Gone with the wind" over on the menu on the right. dailymotion can be a bit testy at times, but pretty good generally.
The guitarist is Rune Gustafson.
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Wallbutton: Thank you thank you thank you for this clip. I was wrecked when You Tube took it down. One of my favorite tunes played by one of my favorite horn players. God, I love the feeling on this.
 
#336
Paul Warburton said:
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That was great. Red's sound kind of freaks me out, but what he's playing is so musically out it doesn't matter. Like you said, it's a voice, perfectly interactive and contrapuntal within the moment. The sound on the Ben Webster cut was nicer, but it's not that voice yet, at least not on that tune. But Zoot plays great, and the guitarist could play as well. Thanks for posting that.
 
#338
Fantastic ! thanks SO MUCH Paul for putting up that link to those tracks , great to hear it / see it again , I just love all these guys playing.
I will dig out that Red solo album and get the info for you soon, it is a must hear recording , thats for sure .
cheers ,
oscar
Paul Warburton said:
Invalid Link Removed

Here ya go oscar. Also, "Gone with the wind" over on the menu on the right. dailymotion can be a bit testy at times, but pretty good generally.
The guitarist is Rune Gustafson.
The album you're refering to, I don't seem to have. :eek: What tunes are on it?
Click to expand...
 

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