What can Pro Tools do that Logic can't?

[elros]

While on the subject on ProTools vs. the rest:
how does ProTools LE compare with the other stuff (primarily Cubase and Logic)?
I'm thinking of getting the Digidesign Mbox 2 Pro Factory..... comes with Pro Tools LE 7.

BTW: the few studios I've been in all use ProTools, so that alone is a good reason to go the DigiDesign way.

 

[Aaron]

BTW: the few studios I've been in all use ProTools, so that alone is a good reason to go the DigiDesign way.

A good reason IF you are going to use other studios for tracking and mixing.

 

[EastCoastThump]

A good reason IF you are going to use other studios for tracking and mixing.

The OP does say he's going to a PT equipped recording school. Probably safe to say that he'll want to transfer work-in-progress b/w their stations and his Macbook more than once or twice.

Possible to do this if he's running different recording software, but more tedious.

 

[fokof]

Not true . . . the Apogee Electronics AD/DA units have ALWAYS worked fine with PT.

So your telling me that I buy a Apogee PCI card , put it in my G5 , I boot PT , and I'm gonna be able to have sound without having to but an Avid interface ?
Sorry I didn't know that.....

And now with the M- versions of PT there's another source of compatible interfaces.

M-Audio is still Avid to me......

For "the same money"?
I don't think so . . . to get significantly better AD/DA performance than the 002 or 003 you have to pay significantly more $$ . . . like for the 192 or something from dB Technologies or Weiss or ?

For 400 less than a 003 , you can have an HD192 from MOTU wich sounds WAY better than the 003.

Benchmark and Lavry are some other stuff that sounds better than a 192. But you can't use it with PT without a Avid I/O unit.

The best system at the studio where I work at has a relatively new G5 with dual 2GHz processors, 4 GByte of RAM, 3 HD Accel cards, a SYNC I/O (to sync up the Studer analog 24 track), 2 192 interfaces (with 24 I/O) and 2000 GB of hard disk storage. I find that I don't run out of processing speed, TDM or ANYTHING . . . bottom line, IT WORKS!

The studio IS a "professional studio" - over $1 million invested in 2 rooms, plus mastering. Gold and Platinum records, Grammy nominations with several wins, other awards, too.

Of course if money is no object , I would have an hell of a studio , but PT wouldn't be at the front end.When people go in your studio they probably tracks / mixes there , so PT or anything else , it wouldn't change a thing for you.

A monopoly is NEVER a good thing. It slows down the evolution of that market. I do my part by not using Avid products (I Bought my Oxygen8 and Sibelius software before they were bought) and any Microsoft product.

 

[deaf pea]

So your telling me that I buy a Apogee PCI card , put it in my G5 , I boot PT , and I'm gonna be able to have sound without having to but an Avid interface ?
Sorry I didn't know that.....

No, Apogee doesn't make PCI cards . . . they make AD/DA interfaces. You could buy PT TDM 7.xx which comes with the PCI card and the software. Then you hook up your Apogee interface(s) to the Avid PCI card and you've got it working.
But it's NOT cheap. The Apogee 8 channel I/O interface costs about twice what the Digidesign 192 costs . . .

EDIT: You need to understand that a lot of the processing takes place on the PCI card, NOT in the CPU processor. That's part of the reason that PCI card equiped system can be more powerful than a native system (because of the processor limitations)

Of course if money is no object , I would have an hell of a studio , but PT wouldn't be at the front end.When people go in your studio they probably tracks / mixes there , so PT or anything else , it wouldn't change a thing for you.

That would be OK if you are only doing your own projects, or if all of your clients are really sure that they want to do ALL of their work, from brginning to end, at YOUR studio. But if a client decides, after doing all of his recording and editing at your place, that he/she wants to mix with hot engineer "X", you'll have to provide the client with a PT compatible rendering of ALL of the edits, etc., because hot engineer "X" works with PT . . .
A more likely situation would be that the tracking and mixing is done in a "more capable" professional studio and the overdubs and editing is done in the artists' home studio.
IMO IME YMMV etc.

EDIT: BTW, I listed the equipment that I use, daily, for comparison. It is NOT, by any means, a "if money is no object" PT set-up. I think that what we have here at the studio is the "basic minimum" PT set-up for a professional studio.

 

[Charling]

so, out of interest, why is it so difficult to transfer from a logic/cubase to PT studio? The first and most logical way I would use when transferring between any two studios would be to batch export as wav or aiff from cubase with 0 start points then import them into the DAW of the other studio.

whats to stop you doing that with protools? I know it uses wav and aiff, and with a zero start point surely any timing issues would be avoided..

is it just that protools uses different encoding and cant read wavs etc made on other programs?

 

[Aaron]

is it just that protools uses different encoding and cant read wavs etc made on other programs?

It shouldn't be a problem if you only need the audio and nothing else from the session (fade files, plug-ins, aux tracks, unusual routing, etc.) But if you need other aspects of the session, you could run into some trouble.

 

[andrewd]

If you're serious about logic, check out the apogee ensemble. It's designed for logic in a similar way that the digidesign interfaces are designed for protools

Invalid Link Removed

 

[groovejam]

Yeah, I probably will be doing alot of transfering, I would much rather have a Motu Logic setup but because of the school I'm going to I'll probably end up spending more money on lesser quaility...

 

[BassJunkie730]

Nothing....

 

[groovejam]

Nothing....

??

 

[charic]

I prefer pro-tools for its simplicity of use and impressive features for editing. Plus the amount of plug-ins available. Im fully trained on logic and pro-tools. I prefer protools as it uses 2 windows only and logic uses 9. Its nice clean appearance impresses most people. When i show most people logic they just say "HUH?" . As previously stated it depends which works for you. But pro-tools for me cheers

 

[deaf pea]

so, out of interest, why is it so difficult to transfer from a logic/cubase to PT studio? The first and most logical way I would use when transferring between any two studios would be to batch export as wav or aiff from cubase with 0 start points then import them into the DAW of the other studio.
whats to stop you doing that with protools? I know it uses wav and aiff, and with a zero start point surely any timing issues would be avoided.

That IS the way to do it . . . but with a 12-15 song project that won't be done "instantly". It DOES take time . . . and, as they say, time IS money . . .

BTW, once you're in the "new" system, you'll need to at least set up a "rough" mix for each song before you can even START doing something new (like an overdub, or a "real" mix, or whatever) . . .

It shouldn't be a problem if you only need the audio and nothing else from the session (fade files, plug-ins, aux tracks, unusual routing, etc.) But if you need other aspects of the session, you could run into some trouble.

good point . . .

but I wouldn't say that you'd necesarily run into "trouble", but it WILL take much MORE time to do those "rendered" files ("bounces" in PT speak) . . .

 

[Dirk Diggler]

Any modern software will allow importing and exporting these days.
As long as you know what you're coming from and going into it's easy.
And they all will work well, I've tried many. But I am still an M-powered user of PToolz currently. Mostly for the ability to move projects easily to and from various studios. Also much better Hyperthreading support in the recent versions. And as said before no issues between PC and Mac as long as it's checked in the save.

Dirk
p.s.
Roger "Moogy" Powell to be precise.

 

[Charling]

That IS the way to do it . . . but with a 12-15 song project that won't be done "instantly". It DOES take time . . . and, as they say, time IS money . . .

BTW, once you're in the "new" system, you'll need to at least set up a "rough" mix for each song before you can even START doing something new (like an overdub, or a "real" mix, or whatever) . . .



good point . . .

but I wouldn't say that you'd necesarily run into "trouble", but it WILL take much MORE time to do those "rendered" files ("bounces" in PT speak) . . .

ok, cool. as I say, thats the way I would do most projects anyway regardless of what type of system they are going to be moved to. I mean, it takes cubase (on the two setups
I use) maybe 20 minutes to export a session as wavs with inserts/sends/audio part edits/fades etc and if a client asked for seperates to take to a different studio thats what I would give them anyway. id just run them off while they pack up their gear, so I'm not sure I see the major worry with changing systems!

You would have to do that if you went from cubase to logic, from DP to sonar from sonar to pt anyway so I guess I dont see it as worry really!

 

[deaf pea]

You would have to do that if you went from cubase to logic, from DP to sonar from sonar to pt anyway so I guess I dont see it as worry really!

Yeah, but going from PT to PT and back again to PT, then again to PT . . .

if you get my point . . .

it IS less time consuming . . .

 

[fokof]

No, Apogee doesn't make PCI cards . . .

http://www.apogeedigital.com/products/symphony.php
If I put that in my G5 , I can boot PT ?

You need to understand that a lot of the processing takes place on the PCI card, NOT in the CPU processor. That's part of the reason that PCI card equiped system can be more powerful than a native system (because of the processor limitations)

Just to clarify : those type of PCI ( Ensemble by Apogee ) or those from MOTU ( PCI424 ) don't process at all. It's only I/O for audio.
It's all designed for native systems , and the PCI are for all the other platform than PT.

.... because hot engineer "X" works with PT . . ..

Well they work with PT because that's what's there in the studio , not because it's their choice , ask Bob Katz.......

 

[deaf pea]

If I put that in my G5 , I can boot PT ?

No, THAT PCI card is an I/O PCI card designed for use with their interfaces and Apple's MacPro or LogicPro . . . as I said "No, Apogee doesn't make PCI cards . . . they make AD/DA interfaces. " I guess I SHOULD have said that Apogee doesn't make PCI "processor" cards . . .

Just to clarify : those type of PCI ( Ensemble by Apogee ) or those from MOTU ( PCI424 ) don't process at all. It's only I/O for audio.
It's all designed for native systems , and the PCI are for all the other platform than PT.

I thought it was obvious that I, as a PT HD user, was talking about the processing that happens on the HD Accel PCT cards . . . I DID mention that I WASN'T talking about ANY of the "native" systems . . .

Well they work with PT because that's what's there in the studio , not because it's their choice , ask Bob Katz.......

There ARE several "top" mix engineers who have equiped their personal studios with PT . . . there are also those who use NUENDO, and RADAR, and probably other platforms, too.
But PT-HD IS the "professional standard" in random-access digital recording/editing/mixing software . . .

YOU may prefer something else, but you CAN find PT-HD in ALL of the "top professional studios" in the WORLD . . .

 

[fokof]

YOU may prefer something else, but you CAN find PT-HD in ALL of the "top professional studios" in the WORLD . . .

I know, I agree with you , and I think it's a shame.
If we all do our part and start using other stuff , Avid is gonna lose that monopoly position and maybe they are gonna start to make their products ( PT ) compatible with other stuff.
Since they are in the leading chair , they don't have to do this.People "have" to buy their interfaces to run PT.

Like I said in my first answer, because the cpu are now so powerfull , we don't need those PCI processing cards ( axcel ) anymore.

 

[deaf pea]

I'm not trying to pick a fight with you, either . . .

but I feel it neccesary to correct some of the inacuracies in your post . . .

Avid is gonna lose that monopoly position and maybe they are gonna start to make their products ( PT ) compatible with other stuff...People "have" to buy their interfaces to run PT.

NOBODY has to buy a Digidesign interface to use PT, but the other options are MORE EXPENSIVE than those Digidesign interfaces!

With the "professional" system, PT-HD, the software comes "bundeled" with 1,2 or 3 Accel PCI processor cards . . . you DO have to use AT LEAST one Accel PCI processor card for PT to work, but you CAN use another companies' interface(s).

And PT IS compatible with LOTS of products (CPUs, Plug-ins, hard-disks, etc) . . .

And, IIRC, none of the OTHER platforms are "compatble" with each other - you can't open a Cubase "session" (song) with Logic, for example . . .

...because the cpu are now so powerfull , we don't need those PCI processing cards ( axcel ) anymore.

Maybe YOU don't need the extra processing available through the use of Accel cards, but I DO!
And, as I've said, I use a relatively fast, dual-processor G-5 with lots of ram and 3 Accel cards (HD-3).
I DON'T use all of the available resources . . . but I am OFTEN using as much as 60-70% of the "extra" power that the 3 Accel cards provide . . .

as always, YMMV, IMO, IME, etc . . .