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What exactly is "tube warmth"?

#101
Oh, and my ears aren’t « clean » neither ;) I have a bit of hearing loss and a new kind of « distortion » in my left ear since this summer (drilling metal without ear protection, even if was for only a few minutes… until I put my earmuffs!).

Anyway, genetically, we have hearing problems in the family and I am a music teacher beginning since 26 years. Ah those lovely shimmering xylophones and recorders in big rectangular empty classrooms!

Just to say that I’m not sure I could differentiate « warmth » from a kid scraping his nails on my chalkboard… but I love tubes, they glow!
 
#102
Patrice B said:
I should had put the obligatory « IMHO ». For me, it’s clean as I only play in my basement home studio at decent levels. Even tried it with my iTunes library with my YBA-3 to have big stereo sound.

A little 5 watts tube amps cranked to max with my Telecaster is my definition of « not clean »…
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Ironically, once the svt starts to saturate, most part of generated harmonics are odds.
And ironically some human ears WANT to hear something stupid as "warm" sound where there is something totally different regarding harmonics arrangement of even and odds.
 
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#104
Danny C said:
Arkham Oracle into a Mesa WD800 gets me the warmth and tube compression I desire. And for more icing in the EQ department I also use a Barber Linden after the Oracle...sound the way I always imagined bass should sound. Completely done chasing tone. I have no idea if I answered your question but I started babbling just cuz I'm so friggin happy.
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Yes. Compressor/EQ into Tube Pre/DI into WD800 = Wonderful sound with a controlled tubey feel.

Same Comp and Pre into a Walkabout = FAT and loose tube dominated output.
 
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#105
Knavery said:
I've always found "warmth" from a tube amp easier to discern with a guitar rather than a bass. I've played both for years and still can't tell if someone is playing bass through a tube amp. I sure can tell with a guitar though.
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Agreed, and since the company I work for and some of the R&D work I do is on the guitar side, I have more data with regards to what perception is and how it related to what is actually going on.
 
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#106
MDBass said:
You’re a wealth of knowledge Andy, and TalkBass is lucky to have you posting here regularly.

I’ll just point out that I never said anything about tube amps only producing even harmonics.

Since even harmonics sound “warm”, and odd harmonics do not, I suspect the answer to “where does ‘tube warmth’ come from” has much more to do with the even harmonics tubes produce than the odd harmonics they also produce.
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It's not just the even harmonics, there is MUCH more going on of which the even versus odd harmonics is a small part of.
 
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#107
ImTheOnlyOne said:
Yes. Compressor/EQ into Tube Pre/DI into WD800 = Wonderful sound with a controlled tubey feel.

Same Comp and Pre into a Walkabout = FAT and loose tube dominated output.
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Some players (actually many ore than most would realize) actually prefer something a little tighter than they perceive for bass. We have seen this with the damping control on the WD, depending on the speaker cabinet, the bass and the room.
 
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#111
I played a Sunn 200S tube amp for years and then switched to a Peavey MKIV SS. The difference in tone and feel was profound. In those days SS amps had a much harsher tone especially when they were cranked compared to tube amps which sounded smoother and more pleasant. My next amp change was to go with a Alembic F1-X tube preamp and a variety of PA power amps. This combination gave me a similar tone of the Sunn tube amp but had the quick and uncompressed feel of a SS amp. Todays SS amps arn't near as harsh and unpleasant as the older ones. But, there is a large dedicated group of bass players who prefer tube amps and are willing to pay a premium price for them. I am completely satisfied with my Fender 500C class D SS amp. It's warm enough for me.
 
#114
mr_musica said:
This must have been asked before, but I couldn't find any specific threads.
I was checking some videos comparing class D and tube amps. And even the reviewers said that tube amps gave some type of "warmth" to the sound. I know what the word means, but I have trouble putting in context of sound.

So, does anyone know what exactly is the "warmth" that tubes have? is it a boost in some frequencies? is it volume or dynamics related?

I can hear some differences in the amps that are compared in videos, but is there a physics definition of what we describe as "warmth"?
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Play an SVT at high gain inside a cold hut in winter and stay close to it … you should be able to experience some tube warmth … :D:laugh::laugh:
 
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#116
mr_musica said:
This must have been asked before, but I couldn't find any specific threads.
I was checking some videos comparing class D and tube amps. And even the reviewers said that tube amps gave some type of "warmth" to the sound. I know what the word means, but I have trouble putting in context of sound.

So, does anyone know what exactly is the "warmth" that tubes have? is it a boost in some frequencies? is it volume or dynamics related?

I can hear some differences in the amps that are compared in videos, but is there a physics definition of what we describe as "warmth"?
Click to expand...

Tube warmth is like a good Pupusa. Pupusa con hongo.
 
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#118
dbsfgyd1 said:
I have Eden Amp Types. One is powered by mosfets, a hybrid-tube preamp-power amp, a 300 watt all tube amp, and a WTDI which I have used with several different different non-Eden amps. To me, they all sound very warm.
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Another Eden player, I feel we are a dying breed.

I have a WT-400 I bought new in the 80s, which is my gig amp of choice, and 2 Eden WXT Class D heads, a 500 watt and a 300 watt, which are way easier to lug around.

While the Class Ds are warm for Class Ds, they miss something that the WT has. To address that I use various preamps, some with tubes. These are difficult things to describe, but I do find that they compliment the Class D sound, where I don't really need them for the tube head.

I've always liked your avatar BTW.
 
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#119
mr_musica said:
This must have been asked before, but I couldn't find any specific threads.
I was checking some videos comparing class D and tube amps. And even the reviewers said that tube amps gave some type of "warmth" to the sound. I know what the word means, but I have trouble putting in context of sound.

So, does anyone know what exactly is the "warmth" that tubes have? is it a boost in some frequencies? is it volume or dynamics related?

I can hear some differences in the amps that are compared in videos, but is there a physics definition of what we describe as "warmth"?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, a lot of us made some good efforts at defining what "warmth" in an amp means to each of us. But "warmth" in this context is a term made up to describe something subjective. There is no physics term for what we attribute to this feeling of warmth. The way we use it sometimes even evokes an emotion. No room for any of that in physics.

In physics, if something is warmer, it might mean a relatively higher degree of molecular activity aka temperature as measured by a thermometer.

And why "warmth"? Why not snuggly or cozy?
 
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