What happened to Hadrien Feraud?!

[Phil Smith]

It's interesting-my wife just came back from her Jazz Piano lesson yesterday and told me her teacher (a great Jazz Pianist who has played with a Major Jazz Guitar Star that I will not name for confidentiality's sake) had played with JM on a project with said MJGS. He told her that JM was extraordinarily hard to jell with for the studio band, played very loud and very busy, played like he wasn't interacting with the players but just blowing chops over everything etc. After a quick huddle and strategy session they managed to get some good stuff but it was a bumpy takeoff for sure. It blew her mind because JM is her (and one of my) favorite guitarists.

In your opinion Roy, where's the analogy in this story? Note I'm not trying to be snarky here, I just want you to elaborate so I can understand better where you are coming from.

Here's another perspective-Kai Eckhardt has said in some interviews that JM could be difficult to work for. I have another Drummer Friend who has done the gig and told me in confidence it could be difficult. If you look at the great bassists JM has had (Hadrien, Jonas, Matt Garrison, Kai, Dominique Di Piazza, Jeff Berlin for a couple of tours etc.) he tends to hire a young band, groom them and then turn them over. It's certainly his prerogative as a leader and Joe Zawinul would do the same thing from all I have heard.

Again what are you saying here as in what does that mean to you?

I personally love the crabs in a bucket analogy-not so much as a personal attack on anyone but more a misbehavior we are all guilty of from time to time (especially on internet forums like TB). My wife is a member of a nutritional forum with a large number of women members and they're nowhere near as snarky as guys. I think it's the testosterone and the Inner 8th Grader in most of us, myself included.

I would agree this thread could have done without a lot of the attacks that took place but there are lessons to be learned in all of that. It's okay for someone to not be into what you're into or believe what you believe, you don't need to attack them or denigrate them because of it. One shouldn't be so blinded by the talents of an individual to the point that they need to jump on anyone that disagrees or says anything no matter how factual to the contrary.

 

[JimmyM]

How do you know Jauqo doesn't have the ability to play like that? I've heard Jauqo do some really badass stuff on bass that's totally on par with what Hadrien does IMHO. Sure, he's way outside the norm sometimes, but that's what living with Ornette Coleman will do to you

As for JM, that may be, but on HIS gig, HE rules, and that's how it go, and you can either take the gig or not.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

How do you know Jauqo doesn't have the ability to play like that? I've heard Jauqo do some really badass stuff on bass that's totally on par with what Hadrien does IMHO. Sure, he's way outside the norm sometimes, but that's what living with Ornette Coleman will do to you

Oh Jimmy, you're really going to get me killed

 

[JimmyM]

Oh Jimmy, you're really going to get me killed

Whoops...sorry J...oh well, better to die with honor than live in fear...at least that's what all of us who live in fear say

 

[cnltb]

I must be missing something...
Where does Ornette Coleman into all this?

 

[JAUQO III-X]

better to die with honor than live in fear...at least that's what all of us who live in fear say

 

[JimmyM]

I must be missing something...
Where does Ornette Coleman into all this?

Your inability to tell a joke from a serious statement is why we have had a few words in the past. It has nothing to do with anything except to explain why Jauqo's playing sometimes comes across as "outside."

 

[cnltb]

Your inability to tell a joke from a serious statement is why we have had a few words in the past. It has nothing to do with anything except to explain why Jauqo's playing sometimes comes across as "outside."

my inability to tell a joke from a serious statement???

words in the past???

...enlighten me on that one please.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

Where does Ornette Coleman into all this?

I know that this is a Hadrien thread but if you want to know my connection to Ornette you will find it in the interview below.

Link Removed

 

[cnltb]

I know that this is a Hadrien thread but if you want to know my connection to Ornette you will find it in the interview below.

Link Removed

Thanks, sure do .


@JimmyM: See? It's that easy.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

Thanks, sure do .

You're welcome.

 

[cnltb]

You're welcome.

...and now I know how Ornette Coleman comes into all this!

... and @JimmyM: See? it had nothing in the least to do with anyones "inability to tell a joke from a serious statement".

 

[Roy Vogt]

In your opinion Roy, where's the analogy in this story? Note I'm not trying to be snarky here, I just want you to elaborate so I can understand better where you are coming from.



Again what are you saying here as in what does that mean to you?



I would agree this thread could have done without a lot of the attacks that took place but there are lessons to be learned in all of that. It's okay for someone to not be into what you're into or believe what you believe, you don't need to attack them or denigrate them because of it. One shouldn't be so blinded by the talents of an individual to the point that they need to jump on anyone that disagrees or says anything no matter how factual to the contrary.

Phil, I guess among other things it may mean that a busy, notey guitarist with volume issues and a busy, notey bassist with volume issues may be at cross purposes. That may be the big takeaway from the JM and HF saga. Another thing would be that sometimes those we label Icons have their own issues, so Hadrien may be one of a long line who have gone through the gig, much like Buddy Rich's band back in the day. Certainly, that was my point in the JM anecdotes. Again I had several friends who did tenure in Buddy's gig and he fired several really excellent bassists at different points simply because the chemistry had ceased to work.
Having done my share of tours I can totally vouch for the fact that fellow musicians can both be great players but not jell in much the fashion that Hadrien and Gary Husband didn't appear to.
I hope this clears things up a bit. There always seems to be a good bit of schadenfreude that goes along with the news that a controversial player gets sacked from a gig or moves on or gets replaced. As I've made clear in many, many posts it's not my favorite thing.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Well, I guess you have a point. You think people would do a gig with a singer like her for free?
HF sure wouldn't need to do it to gain exposure I guess.

Yes, some people most definitely would... and I'm not saying that's the case in this instance.

And don't take this as a slam on her in particular... being contracted to do a gig and actually getting paid for said gig do not neccessarily go hand in hand. Getting stiffed can happen at any level.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Ok...seriously....you dont wish to have a brilliant technical command of your instrument. A tremondous knowlage of music that would align you with some of the best players like JM asking you to play on their record and tour with?
To have the ability to pretty much play just about whatever you would hear in your head?
Sorry Brad, dont buy it.

I knew someone wouldn't, Mike. And that's okay.


Here's why... I'm talking about reality and apparently either mine differs from yours or you aren't looking at it with a clear eye.

First, I haven't heard that he has the ability to play anything, period. I'd even go so far as to say that for better or worse he doesn't have the same music in his head as I have in mine.

Think about it. Now while you might be willing to trade that for his skills, I'm not. I'm at the place I am because of the journey. The same reason he's in the place where he is. Is that also unbelievable?

Look at the reality/facts of it:

1. Do I want to gig with John McLaughlin? Nope. It's not a dream of mine to do that gig. He has a history of going through musicians so it likely it wouldn't be permanent.

2. I'm a married guy in my fifties who has no desire to tour... none.

3. Believe it or not I play what's in my head now. Ask people who know me.

4. I got trade shows/seminars/etc. out of my system a while ago. That would bore the crap out of me.

4a. Sycophants bore me too

Subjective- but he's one of the hottest players out right now.
To play like that doesnt mean you HAVE to.

No offense... maybe it does. Think about it... when doesn't he play like that? And when do people not expect him too?

Thats like playing pickup basketball and saying, I dont wish I played like Kobe Bryant.

At my age what good would that do me, Mike? Other than impress my friends, which I'm not all that pressed about anyway?


Again, you're looking at this from the "dream perspective", I'm looking at my reality.

Bad judgment is bad judgment....he was bounced from a gig. He spun it his way.

And like someone else has said, to have a cat like him actually post on here....cmon people. We should be happy he would take the time to communicate with us on a someone personal level like this.

Yes I am happy about that... even when they lie to me and call others out based on a lie. Sorry, I expect better from cats like that. That's why my bass ended up stolen. So sue me.

Yeah, mods, shut this down.
We have a top shelf world class player who posts on here. End this mess please.

As if he's the only one.

 

[Brad Johnson]

I don't think many people are paying attention to that elephant.

No joke.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Obviously Hadrien came on and made some bullsh1t statements about it had nothing to do with his volume and he was called out on it and scurried away like a hurt deer. Do I think he has integrity based on that? Nope A big ego trying to lie and defend something that wasn't true...yup. The guy got in over his head here and had a bullseye on his back right out of the gate. It just seems like this thread took a direction way outside what has happened to Hadrien Feraud

Do you think the lie had anything to do with that? So much for right out of the gate.

 

[Roy Vogt]

For the record, I've seen JM three times with three different rhythm sections. The One Truth Band with TM Stevens and Woody "Sunship" Theus, the Royal Festival Hall Trio with Kai Eckhardt and Trilok Gurtu and finally the Five Peace Band with Brian Blade and Christian McBride. To my ears, JM always played brilliantly and these were all great rhythm sections.

 

[Brad Johnson]

No, but when someone says they dont want to have great ability on many levels, it doesnt make logical sense. At all.
But I guess if your goal is to just hit 5.3 out of 10 and strive for mediocrity, then go for it.
One may not desire to play like that in that vein or style, but to wish too NOT be on that level......well.......

Again, your reality differs greatly from mine since you appear to think that mediocrity is the alternative to having his "skills".


Anthony Jackson's skills I could use. Hadrien's, not so much. No offense, just basing this on what I choose to do. But so many folks are busy projecting and can't seem to see that.

I don't want to be Jaco either.

NO one wants to be like me....err..wait....

I understand.
At the same time to come on and just "dis" because youre not a fan doesnt make sense either.
But it happens all the time.

I didn't come and dis him. I talked about a particular situation.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Don't get me wrong. I don't think he's end all/be all....thats a subjective decision on a listener.
And to not want to play in that manner or fashion I get as well. I don't aspire nor want to play like Victor Wooten, but wish the hell I could.

I don't buy it. Here's why...


See the fallacy in that line of thinking?

I'd rather be like Will Lee myself.

Daylight.

You mean you were not..... talking about me?!?????



It kinda did. Or at least turned that way.

Nope. Funny thing is the people who really took this thread south are the ones complaining the most about the direction."Pay no attention to what actually happen, adore him, you're just jealous". Etc.