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What Happened to Prog Rock?!?!

#123
wolf7883 said:
Well- There it is...What happened?:confused:

We used to have these musicians that were tops making these incredible groups like Emerson,Lake and Palmer, Rush, King Crimson, Pink Floyd etc. What happened to the genre. Where are the GREAT rock musicians that love indulging their skills to their fullest?

Now there is The Mars Volta, Tool---Every 5-6 years or so:rollno:...and then it gets really meager as far as progressive goes...Dillinger Escape Plan was cool but it's more hardcore/punk than progressive.

Maybe I'm living under a rock...Shout 'em out if you know 'em...Who are the progressive bands of today??? And if you don't know or can't find any...Why are they all gone???
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I come from the same school of Prog rock and I'd include YES and Jethro Tull in with the groups you've mentioned.

I've since moved on to Fusion stuff like Return to Forever, Chic Corea among many others more recently loving Jeff Beck.

My obsession with the Prog scene was born from Iron Maiden/Metallica in my early teens (not prog I know) which sent me over to Jethro Tull and on to YES, RUSH, PINK FLOYD, KING CRIMSON, GENESIS. While I was born in '73 (late to the game) I consider these groups the music of my youth....

For my own personal tastes I migrated away from the more metal end of the scene and more towards fusion, classical and jazz as I began to seriously study music and the bass.

I lost interest in the direction this genre has taken over the years while many of my friends moved on to listening to Dream Theatre and others. I've simply lost interest at that point.

EDIT: Just as I went back to Jethro Tull finding out they were a big influence on Iron Maiden...I also clearly remember watching a YES video where Steve Howe and Bill Bruford talked about Wes Montgomery and others. That really peaked my interest into Jazz. Maybe I've just always tended to move backwards in music instead of moving forward I've found a big attraction to taking the music I'm listening to and tracking back there influences, it's been very rewarding for me..
 
#124
derJackal said:
No Transatlantic love? Spock's Beard? You want 30 minute epics, Transatlantic is your band. :)

Big second, third, fourth on Porcupine Tree. Although Steve tends to be a bit melancholic in his writing, his drummer is a monster. But Gavin only appears on albums from 2002 on. I'd actually say start with In Absentia rather than Lightbulb Sun. though.
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+1 Transatlantic is superb, and the bass tone that Pete Trewavas gets on the latest release is top5 all time. I don't think prog really ever died. I like the Tree a lot as well. Also check out the Flower Kings..Kino (more pop prog), anything John Mitchell plays on. Marillion is still going. There are bands I haven't even had time to discover yet.
 
#128
mjwyoshi64 said:
So we've identified what has happened with the music, now I'm going to raise the following question. Is there a way to bring it back? Is there a specific underlying problem that can be fixed? Can prog music be written today in such a fashion that it isn't recognized as a knockoff of some other great band of the past?

Or is it just going to be relegated to be being the pretentious nerd music that guys like me get made fun of for listening to and we all need to move on to playing in Lady Gaga cover bands? Because I like prog a whole lot. Both the old and new and both for various reasons, but that doesn't change the fact that it's my favorite music and I would love to see it be respected again.
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That depends entirely on what the individual musician and/or individual band chooses to do. Anyone can create any type of music at any time - if he/she is creative and visionary enough. There are very few rules, and no real boundaries.

But will it attract a following? That's a very different question...

John is correct: There are all kinds of bands out there, many of which are creating truly amazing, beautiful, transcendent material. But because the world has changed in the past 40 years, most of them never get heard.

Thing is, most players are not that creative. It's very easy to fall back on established norms and expectations. Prog is now considered one of those established genres. What was considered musically revolutionary in 1968 is now considered old school. The world has changed... :hmm:

I don't know that anyone has any magic answers. But I'll give it one shot: If you focus of composing/performing self-consciously for prog as a genre per se, then in some ways you've already unintentionally violated the spirit of what it originally was. :hmm:

Focus on creating whatever style of music moves you most profoundly - and leave the classification to others (or indulge in it only for marketing purposes). If you're successful enough in promoting it that you can expose many people to it, if it has a distinctive and compelling voice, and it speaks to what's happening in the world now , it will find its own natural audience (easier said than done).

MM
 
#129
Marco A. Mayer said:
OK, if you say you haven't found anything progressive, I'll indicate 2 modern prog songs that will change your mind.



- Porcupine Tree's "Anesthetize"
Odd keys? Check.
Beach Boys-ish vocal harmonies? Check.
Crazy polyrhythms? Check.
Succesful experimentation? Check.

A great song that you can listen twice a day for 2 years and it will never get old.

- The Flower Kings' "Garden of Dreams"
It's a nearly one-hour-long composition that pretty much fits your definition of prog. Amazing.
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Hmmm OK, that's definitely more along the lines of what I'll call prog. Only had a chance to catch some brief samples but I'll try exploring the bands some more.
 
#130
Lots of great artistic, creative music out there (I like the term "art rock" as "prog" has become a somewhat confusing label)

My favorite "retro" kind of band that looks back to artists like Jethro Tull, Genesis, Van Der Graaf Generator, Pink Floyd, etc, but with a fresh modern twist would be Phideaux:

Link Removed
http://www.reverbnation.com/#/phideaux

For something more truly "progressive" and boundary pushing, I really admire the band Sleepytime Gorilla Museum. "Of Natural History" is a landmark album IMO. They push things into avante-garde territory which some might find abrasive but they are a very compelling and creative band.

for a great discussion forum.
 
#131
I disagree with whoever called Protest the Hero and BTBAM "post-ironic beardcore." I would also like to hear said person play their bass lines.

I also disagree with the person who said Muse and the person who said Enter Shikari...

I think "Progressive Rock" has been replaced with "Tech Metal" or "Post Rock."

Dillinger Escape Plan's new album was CRAZY. $0.02

Check out a band called Rooftops, crazy instrumental stuff.
 
#135
peterpalmieri said:
I come from the same school of Prog rock and I'd include YES and Jethro Tull in with the groups you've mentioned.

I've since moved on to Fusion stuff like Return to Forever, Chic Corea among many others more recently loving Jeff Beck.

My obsession with the Prog scene was born from Iron Maiden/Metallica in my early teens (not prog I know) which sent me over to Jethro Tull and on to YES, RUSH, PINK FLOYD, KING CRIMSON, GENESIS. While I was born in '73 (late to the game) I consider these groups the music of my youth....

For my own personal tastes I migrated away from the more metal end of the scene and more towards fusion, classical and jazz as I began to seriously study music and the bass.

I lost interest in the direction this genre has taken over the years while many of my friends moved on to listening to Dream Theatre and others. I've simply lost interest at that point.

EDIT: Just as I went back to Jethro Tull finding out they were a big influence on Iron Maiden...I also clearly remember watching a YES video where Steve Howe and Bill Bruford talked about Wes Montgomery and others. That really peaked my interest into Jazz. Maybe I've just always tended to move backwards in music instead of moving forward I've found a big attraction to taking the music I'm listening to and tracking back there influences, it's been very rewarding for me..
Click to expand...

Totally hear ya dude!!! I like to check out those who influenced my influences too!!! I find myself listening to stuff I probably would have bypassed had I not found out Someone I admire was inspired by it.
 
#136
Yes were really amazing for a few albums back there in the 70s. No-one's drum sound has ever come close to matching Bill Bruford's. That tangy, ringing snare, the melodic, perfectly-tuned toms. Could almost make me wanna be a drummer.

P.S.: Someone above mentioned classical music. Exactly -- I think you would have to have at least a passing understanding of classical music and its architecture, in particular, to get prog.

P.P.S.: I'll even cop to liking Yes's more pop-oriented stuff. "90125" is one of those albums I still throw on the turntable here and there.
 
#137
hrodbert696 said:
OK, still wouldn't call myself an expert, but been youtubing some of these bands people are calling "prog" now and I'm sorry, still don't hear it (speaking as an old fart 70s prog fan). I hear a lot of basic indie rock and a lot of speed metal, some of it running for eight or nine minutes and some of it with some great chops, but I don't hear the things I thought made the 70s bands "progressive" -- classical and jazz influence, experimentation with odd keys and time signatures, and vocal harmonies like only former brit choirboys seem to know how to do. Not that it's bad music, I just think calling it "prog" stretches the label to the point of meaninglessness. I suspect a lot of these bands adopt the prog label mainly to advertise that they're better musicians than the average metalhead. But I'll keep exploring and see if I find anything that changes my mind.
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I dunno- I think "Progressive" means that the song progresses into something else, and that the music is pushing the boundaries of normal rock music. If it stays the same, then it's not really "progressing".
 
#138
wolf7883 said:
I dunno- I think "Progressive" means that the song progresses into something else, and that the music is pushing the boundaries of normal rock music. If it stays the same, then it's not really "progressing".
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I'm not saying that it has to sound like 70s Yes to count as progressive - for music to evolve is good. What I mean is that, if we're going to use a genre label, there should be some criteria for the label that meaningfully define what music IS in that genre and what is not. Otherwise, we could all say we're playing baroque or something because all contemporary music has evolved and stretched the boundaries from what Bach used to do -- the "baroque" label would lose all meaning.

For my understanding of "progressive rock," those criteria would be:

1) Overt influence from classical and jazz music
2) Stress on virtuosity of individual band members (plural, not just a star soloist).
3) Frequent experimentation with unusual meters and keys across the overall body of work.
4) Length of a song determined by the logic of the piece rather than the commercial 4-minute radio slot (this may mean songs 90 seconds long or 20 minutes).
5) Extensive use of vocal harmonies rather than a single lead singer.
6) The above done with an otherwise recognizable rock band setup (electric guitars and bass, keys, drum set, etc).

I'm throwing these out as debate points, I'm curious to see if there's consensus around them or not. I suppose #5 would be the most doubtful myself, it would make exclude bands like Rush from "prog" if strictly adhered to. I kind of think of Rush as a transition band from progressive music per se to the more speed-metal stuff we hear more now. Maybe I'd say that a band should hit better than half of these for me to call it a full-fledged progressive band.

To reiterate my earlier impression, there seem to be a number of contemporary bands who are called "progressive" because they play long compositions with a lot of sixteenth notes (criteria 2, 4 and 6, so to speak, but not 1, 3 or 5). To me that's not really it. Not that they're bad bands, I'm just finicky about keeping categories distinct and meaningful.
 
#139
hrodbert696 said:
For my understanding of "progressive rock," those criteria would be:

1) Overt influence from classical and jazz music
2) Stress on virtuosity of individual band members (plural, not just a star soloist).
3) Frequent experimentation with unusual meters and keys across the overall body of work.
4) Length of a song determined by the logic of the piece rather than the commercial 4-minute radio slot (this may mean songs 90 seconds long or 20 minutes).
5) Extensive use of vocal harmonies rather than a single lead singer.
6) The above done with an otherwise recognizable rock band setup (electric guitars and bass, keys, drum set, etc).
Click to expand...

BTBAM and Dillinger meet all the requirements except for #5. I like Between the Buried and Me a lot better though. Check out this song. This is only part one, but I think this song is BTBAM going all out, a sort of "This is what we do" kind of thing.

 
#140
I am very happy for this thread. I have listened to a lot of bands from here and found some sweet ones. Animals as Leaders, Rx Bandits, Protest the Hero, Zechs Marquise and Scale the Summit have made it into my iTunes library.
 

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