Double Bass What is PC Doing Here? (Descending Dom7 Chords)

[Whousedtoplay]

This is my "play along" version (that started my whole journey on investigating this segment). I rehearse to this version a couple times per week.

Would you like to try the following rendition of the song as your "play along" version?

 

[fu22ba55]

Would you like to try the following rendition of the song as your "play along" version?

That version puts me a little bit out of my depth.

I transcribed this (Don Bagley) version a couple years back. More my speed:

Here's a PDF of my transcription. (with no changes written above). It's in G Major (instead of F).

 

[Whousedtoplay]

That version puts me a little bit out of my depth.

I transcribed this (Don Bagley) version a couple years back. More my speed:

Here's a PDF of my transcription. (with no changes written above). It's in G Major (instead of F).

A very cool arrangement!
Have you listened to the live version of Julie's BBBB?



There is a bass transcription of that live rendition:

Transcriptions/ByeByeBlackBirdJulieLondon.pdf at master · shunjilin/Transcriptions

 

[fu22ba55]

Have you listened to the live version of Julie's BBBB?

Yes I heard this version when I transcribed mine (the color TV version), and I think I preferred the color TV version to transcribe. Intresting to see the differences / development in Bagley's choices.

I think there's a ton of these versions floating around. This was (probably) part of her and Bagley's regular repertoire / schtick.

(and props to shunjillin for the transcription, but their music notation software needs to understand that 8th notes are swung, instead of marking every single 8th note as part of a triplet. A bit gnarly to read.)

Here's another version I love that I want to dissect a bit more. Marc Johnson & Jack Dejohnette backing (Johnson's now wife) Elaine Elias:

 

[oren]

I don’t know if this is at all relevant, but I just listened to one of the original recordings of BBB, Gene Austin from 1926 (according to jazzstandards.com there were two hit versions in 1926), and there is definitely not a chromatic descending sequence (but there is a verse in front of the song, and also one after the first chorus, which I’ve never heard anyone do). So I surmise that the chromatic chord sequence was somebody’s substitution that lots of people have liked and adopted.

This is one of those cases where it would be instructive to take a look at the original sheet music for the tune. I couldn’t find it online, but probably some libraries have it in their collections.

 

[fu22ba55]

I don’t know if this is at all relevant, but I just listened to one of the original recordings of BBB, Gene Austin from 1926

I think this thread abandoned "relevance" a couple pages ago. The floor is open.

I have heard this version: I have a huge playlist somewhere on a vintage iPod that has just the heads to about 300 standards, and I always try to grab the most seminal version I can find. I've got this Austin version in my playlist! Old timey!

So I surmise that the chromatic chord sequence was somebody’s substitution that lots of people have liked and adopted. [...] This is one of those cases where it would be instructive to take a look at the original sheet music for the tune.

The Chuck Sher "New Real Book" series (as opposed to Hal Leonard) is great becasue it does include the (ignored/forgotten) verses to a ton of older standards, that would otherwise be lost to history. Not for this tune though.

 

[fu22ba55]

Lifted the original segment from Ebay thumbnails (Key of G):

With ukelele chord boxes!

Vintage 1926 Bye Bye Blackbird Sheet Music The Khorassan Four Cover Photo | eBay

 

[Whousedtoplay]

I don’t know if this is at all relevant, but I just listened to one of the original recordings of BBB, Gene Austin from 1926 (according to jazzstandards.com there were two hit versions in 1926), and there is definitely not a chromatic descending sequence (but there is a verse in front of the song, and also one after the first chorus, which I’ve never heard anyone do). So I surmise that the chromatic chord sequence was somebody’s substitution that lots of people have liked and adopted.

This is one of those cases where it would be instructive to take a look at the original sheet music for the tune. I couldn’t find it online, but probably some libraries have it in their collections.

Please, check this link:

Invalid Link Removed

 

[fu22ba55]

Please, check this link:

Y'know... there's good stuff on the internet, and there's bad stuff on the internet. But when Tim Berners-Lee invented the WWW (not the internet) in 1989, I wonder if he had any idea what kind of a OCD-feeding, quicksand-rabbit-hole he was creating.

This thread is starting to become self-aware and go full Skynet.

 

[Don Kasper]

Don,

I've listened carefully what the bass is playing on that last Bbmaj7.
I would tend to speculate (that spot is, kind of nebulous) the bass jumps from C directly to F and follows up with his wide "vibrato" of G-F-G-F...
It's more like, Bbmaj9(add #11)/F

Sorry - I don't think PC's "nervous noodling" (almost a "trill" G-F-G-F..., After hitting the Bb....which I DO HEAR there) alters the last chord. I still hear the last chord as "Bbmaj9.....".
(I'm not saying you are wrong, Who...., just that I would not call that chord anything different.)
Thanks.

 

[kennym57]

It seems to me (and I'd have to do some serious listening to make this any more than an impression) that at this general period there were a lot of places where MIles and his bands would pick a more major sound over a more minor sound. If that was kind of a "Miles thing" it would also explain playing E natural over an ostensible A half dim chord. If the whole band is playing E natural over a written A half dim, is it still an A half dim?

That famous "Love for Sale" also has Miles throw in a couple bent major thirds over ostensible minor chords on the melody - it sounds fabulous even though it's not theoretically correct. And PC was on that band too.

 

[kennym57]

I think Sam Jones was the bassist on Love for Sale, with Cannonball. Album is "Something' Else"

 

[Whousedtoplay]

Sorry - I don't think PC's "nervous noodling" (almost a "trill" G-F-G-F..., After hitting the Bb....which I DO HEAR there) alters the last chord. I still hear the last chord as "Bbmaj9.....".
(I'm not saying you are wrong, Who...., just that I would not call that chord anything different.)
Thanks.

(I think I'm aurally depleted. )
(Most, probably, I'm seriously wrong. )

Here are those last EQ-ed bass notes of C to F, just at a very slow tempo.

https://www.talkbass.com/attachment...1/?temp_hash=0fb0383e2641e353f4d9f25d2a7526da

Here is another version of that end, with different EQ concepts:
https://www.talkbass.com/attachment...2/?temp_hash=13c614337eca4b2e2a499728e74b87a5

 

[Whousedtoplay]

That version puts me a little bit out of my depth.

I transcribed this (Don Bagley) version a couple years back. More my speed:

Here's a PDF of my transcription. (with no changes written above). It's in G Major (instead of F).

I've slowed down your provided track and my (old) aging amateur ears started adding some "aural visions".

I would hear a lot of pick-up notes, but when my brain started hallucinating about embellishments in M5 and M6, I've said to my self, "ENOUGH!".

To sum up.

The patient, WUTP has OD-ed on music.

 

[Don Kasper]

Here are those last EQ-ed bass notes of C to F, just at a very slow tempo.

https://www.talkbass.com/attachment...1/?temp_hash=0fb0383e2641e353f4d9f25d2a7526da

OK...C to F it is, then.
It's worse than I thought. (The piano must be playing the low Bb??)
Good work, Who....
Thanks.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

It's worse than I thought.

???

 

[Don Kasper]

???

PC is not supporting the pianist's changes...I would not second guess Red Garland's harmonic choices by playing an F under that Bbmaj7 chord at the end.
But that is me. IMFO.
Thank You.

 

[Whousedtoplay]

PC is not supporting the pianist's changes...I would not second guess Red Garland's harmonic choices by playing an F under that Bbmaj7 chord at the end.
But that is me. IMFO.
Thank You.

Thank you for being nice to me.

 

[turf3]

I think Sam Jones was the bassist on Love for Sale, with Cannonball. Album is "Something' Else"

No, that's the band with Cannon leading. Miles as leader recorded an absolutely killer Love For Sale, with Cannon, Trane, and I am pretty sure PC. It was never released till '78 or so, on the compilation "Circle in the Round", and since then it's appeared on a couple other collection records.

 

[Joshua Pickenpaugh]

Please, check this link:

Invalid Link Removed

I don't see any repeat to go back and play the second verse in the original sheet music; the repeat just takes you back to play the chorus again leaving that second verse unplayed. Am I missing something here?

Fascinating. I wasn't aware that tune that's normally played today was the chorus of the original recording, leaving out the original verses.