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The problem is that they are all right in what they are saying. Metal guitarists are a problem in so many ways, not the least of which is that they are metal guitarists. You have to convince them that they need to cut their lows in order to give you some sonic space. Otherwise, get yourself about 4 SVT heads and 4 8x10 Ampeg refrigerators and simply overpower them. They won't get the point (you know, because they are metal guitarists), but it will be fun for you.
But is the joint sound of the bass and the lower register guitars a bad sound for the genre, even if the bassist feels that he doesn't occupy a frequency area by himself?
Jazz Bass gets my vote! I use a GK 400 & 800rb, I boost the low mids to about 2:00, lows at 1:00, cut highs & high mids to about 11:00(depending on the cab) Sounds great and always cuts through without sounding out of place in the mix. Ymmv. Works for me.
I pretty much always use my P+J (2012 American Pbass Deluxe) with Tapewounds and run it everything passive and volume up all the way direct through a Radial and it sounds like pure sweetness in the mix.
I wish the phrase “cuts through the mix” was never introduced.
And to date I’ve not found a bass in good repair that I could bring to the game that wouldn’t do the trick with a little tweaking of both the instrument and my playing mechanics.
The tone is in one’s hands to a large degree. A bit of electromechanical instrument and amp manipulation will finish the job.
And to date I’ve not found a bass in good repair that I could bring to the game that wouldn’t do the trick with a little tweaking of both the instrument and my playing mechanics.
The tone is in one’s hands to a large degree. A bit of electromechanical instrument and amp manipulation will finish the job.
D
USA EBMM Sterling (not a SBMM).
Ceramic magnet humbucker in series = hot knife.
Because those EBMM Stingrays with their Alnico humbuckers cant cut thru a mix at all right?
Well, let's see...My choice would be a Fender Jazz Bass, either a '65 or an '82-83. Those are the two basses I've used since 1966 and they cut through just fine. Part of the reason they sit so nice in the mix and have such great definition is that I boost the low-mids at ~250Hz. I dime the controls on both volume knobs and the tone knob on my bass and I run everything else flat on my Eden amp. It also records wonderfully well with that setting.
I recently did a recording session where I used a WTDI with my bass. That is a DI box with an Eden Preamp and adjustable compressor built in. Didn't have the option to adjust the low-mids at 250Hz with it, so I ended up boosting them slightly at 500Hz. That worked well enough in the recording that the engineer came back out to see what I was using that sounded so good. Nope, never had a problem sitting in the mix with good definition from my Fender Jazz basses.
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Me too.
"Cuts through", often asked in a matter that suggests like it were an easy subject, and/or something you can buy to achieve... There. Is. No. Such. Thing. (read over again, if you did not understand)
All this "P-bass, boost your mids, cut lows and set highs at 11 o'clock" -nonsense should have died by late-80´s, latest. It has no real value, because the matter is way more complicated.
First, try to establish what "cutting through" means to *you*. Does it equal "stand out"? "Co-exist"? Is it to poke through the mix with e.g a harsh/brash sound that has obtrusive peaks in it's frequency content? Why would you want this? Is it to find a way to have your playing audible in a busy mix, in the nicest and in a way that most serves the song and the mix?
To be heard in a mix is a context thing, for every instrument and sound source. It's about COMPLIMENTING CONTRAST.
Green object does not stand out from a green background, and a muddy bass sound will blend into murky guitars. Obviously this kind of scenario is first up to aesthetics. If this is desirable, problem solved.
If it's not, you need to find out what is wrong, and how to correct it. Some of the problem lies either in your choice of instrument, sound aesthetics and playing. The rest of it is the rest of the instruments in the mix.
I'll give some examples:
Ex 1. A band has two guitarists, who both play loud downtuned guitars through maxxed distortion pedals and oversize cabs, and refuse to cut maxxed lows (morons!) on their amps, it's quite certain the bass has no room in the low end. To be honest, I don't the bassist being much more than a "token bass player" in these kind of situations. Add a heavy left hand on the keys player, and it's a lost battle. Actually, overly distorted guitars are good filling up ANY frequency range because the sound is so saturated and flat in dynamics.
Ex 2, studio. Every player insist that their instrument be very prominent all through the freq range, and "sitting on top of everything else". Everything cannot be loudest, or everything will suffer.
Ex 3. Bass player insisting playing his EB-0 with 12 year old flats in a busy, modern mix. Well, as long as a playback system has good lows in it, at least the LOW END of the bass can be made prominent. Listening to the recording through laptop speakers or Apple Pods, the low end will be completely lost, leaving nothing.
These scenarios have fixes. I'll list some below:
-Arrangement. Leave space for bass, and write lines that compliment the song, and, at least every once in a while, contradict the rest of the instruments.
-Instrument choice. Choose an appropriate instrument for the genre at hand, one that naturally lives well in the mix. This is before any EQ'ing.
-In cases of dense mixes, make sure your signal has enough content in mids and highs, as well as a healthy low end. No need to "boost the **** out of your mids" or any other extreme stupidity. Careful sculpting, to make your sound compliment the band sound, and not step on any toes. Mud can be cured by adjusting playing technique, and careful control of amp's bass knob.
-Have other band members respect your range. The audible frequency range is not infinite, and you all have to fit into it.
- When your ears get more trained, you will find that the biggest problems usually are at a very narrow band of the frequency spectrum. Buy, and learn to use a parametric EQ. It is capable of handling very narrow bands of sound that have weird resonances etc. These weird things happen on all instruments, and the build-up of them in a mix is a true thing.
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The phrase "cut through the mix" is perhaps the wrong description to use. You don't want to dominate a mix because that doesn't really sound good to anyone except perhaps yourself.
"Sits nicely in the mix" would be a better one. I think both are trying to say the same thing. We've all heard songs where you can see that the bassist is playing something but you can't actually hear each note. It all sounds like a bit of a roar. That's typically what happens when you set your EQ like a smiley face - boost bass way up, boost treble way up, and cut the low and high mids. That EQ sounds great if you're playing a solo or practicing by yourself, but as soon as you start to play in a group, you disappear and sound like an indistinct roar.
That's because the kick drum owns that bass register you just tried to boost over him and the guitars and keys will kill you on the treble every time. They'll often also own the high-mids too. The low mids belong to you and a slight boost in them around 250Hz to 500Hz (I prefer ~250Hz) will give you that definition in the mix that we're really talking about. You'll hear the bass and every note it plays.
Back in the 60's and early 70's we didn't even have one mid control, let along a low-mid and high-mid. And we liked to use 215 cabs back then too. Everything was a bit "wooly" back then. A perfect example of that is Hendrix All Along the Watchtower. Some of it is fine, but a lot of it is kind of a blur. You can hear the bass moving pretty well through most of the studio recording but you'll have a tough time picking out exactly which notes he's hitting when he's playing 3 or 4 notes in quick succession. Mostly it's an indistinct blur.
Listen to this old Hendrix recording and then listen to the one below it and you should immediately hear the difference as the original one just roars along. Then listen to the second one and notice how nicely it sits in the mix with good definition, even when he starts ripping out some really nice fills during the guitar solo:
With the EQ choices we have on our amps now, you can pretty easily adjust most basses to "sit nicely in the mix". You don't really want to be too "dominant" but you want to distinctly be heard.
IMO, fiddling with your EQ may be the best cheapest solution or cutting through the mix.
"Cutting through the mix..." why would I want to do that? I've spent my entire bass playing life trying to blend in with the band and support the singer. I can't stand going to a show or concert where the bass stands out. I've seen many major acts, right back to seeing the Beatles and Stones, and while the bass stands out on record, it sure doesn't when they play live. To me that's the way it should be. Maybe I'm weird or something....
D
So, you don't want to hear the instument you play? Sorry, but it sounds really weird to me.
Hahaha... yep, since 1963. Some records I played on had very prominent bass. and I never really liked it. To me, bass is just a support instrument. Yes I dig Jaco etc, but live I dig the likes of Lee Sklar who just sits IN the mix, not cutting through. I think I'm definitely weird.Yes you are...and....you're a bass player????!!
