No way, as too many threads get kiboshed as it is. I think there are logical arguments to be made on both sides of the boutique issue. I do know this:
If you spend 4-10k on a bass, you better be able to play, or you'll look silly.
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Who prefers mass produced over boutique?
- Thread starter Cygnus X-1
- Start date
No way, as too many threads get kiboshed as it is. I think there are logical arguments to be made on both sides of the boutique issue. I do know this:
If you spend 4-10k on a bass, you better be able to play, or you'll look silly.
I've played some "boutique" basses and can see why they're "worth it" for some players. After saving money for a while, perhaps someday I too will own a boutique bass.
My current bass is a Yamaha BB3000MA (Michael Anthony sig). I wouldn't consider it mass-produced, but it certainly isn't custom either. The bass originally sold for over $2k, and I bought mine new on closeout for $800. It's the best bass purchase I've ever made. The sound is great, and the neck is very fast. Hipshot tuners (including D-tuner) and a solid Yamaha bridge (like a restamped Gotoh 201). I think I can see why they were originally selling for over $2k. More attention to detail IMO. It's the one bass I've owned I can't see myself ever selling...
My current bass is a Yamaha BB3000MA (Michael Anthony sig). I wouldn't consider it mass-produced, but it certainly isn't custom either. The bass originally sold for over $2k, and I bought mine new on closeout for $800. It's the best bass purchase I've ever made. The sound is great, and the neck is very fast. Hipshot tuners (including D-tuner) and a solid Yamaha bridge (like a restamped Gotoh 201). I think I can see why they were originally selling for over $2k. More attention to detail IMO. It's the one bass I've owned I can't see myself ever selling...
I never gave serious thought to buying a boutique instrument except for some weird double-necked beast made by Manson, but that was mainly for the novelty factor.
I've been more than happy with the production basses I have, so I haven't pined for a specially made instrument.
I've been more than happy with the production basses I have, so I haven't pined for a specially made instrument.
i paid 300 bucks for my dillon avalanche, Link Removed you might find it there, but im not sure. I can't....but the 5 string i got works beautifully. my next step is to get a Vinatge (company, not old vintage) 4 string, for slap. my first one, a redfox i paid 100$. a higher end bass would be great, but theres no point in me spending anymore then 300 on a guitar. i've got two, and i'll use my redfox as a project bass. i never lost anything with that thing, it's done me good. if i had a choice though, i'd get either a custom Ibanez, or a custom Epiphone. depending on what i'm looking at. i could justify spend 500-5000 on a bass, unless i miraculasly pull a mike dirnt, which wont happen anytime soon.
Of course, I understand that Jimmy is trying to line up a CNC machine to do the basic cutouts, etc., and I have no problem with that either
It's just so personal. I could be VERY happy playing a Lull, and quite frankly, the new updated Fender Standard models are darn good. It's all a matter of if an instrument speaks to you, and if you appreciate some of the things that make very expensive basses 'expensive' (mostly a very small shop doing a lot of stuff 'by hand', or at least running the machines in small batches, etc., and having proprietary pickups and pre's, etc. that have some R&D behind them to work together, etc., etc.).
I just find it an interesting discussion, and not a 'better or worse' sort of thing.
Of course, I think anyone who buys a $5,000 watch that doesn't keep any better time than a $10 cheapy is nuts... so I understand the other side of the 'argument'.
To the above: Same applies to cars. Must Ferrari and Lamborghini owners probably drive the same way as everybody else...
I haven't played that many boutique basses, but I personally prefer boutique basses. My current main bass can be considered somewhat boutique, even though it is a "production model" from a small luthier.
Some people can find all their needs in an inexpensive production model instrument while others need that "something special" that can only be had through going boutique. Whatever works for for you is what you should play.
Some people can find all their needs in an inexpensive production model instrument while others need that "something special" that can only be had through going boutique. Whatever works for for you is what you should play.
Life my Friends.
It’s all about enjoying yourself at all levels ( even if you become a Pro ) if you loose the ability of being grounded, you loose the connection along with everything else, specially yourself.
It’s all about the Music
A lot of Pro’s still have that old beaten gear they started with hanging around, and that instrument still calls them and speaks out aloud ( ie : Paul McCartney, Sting etc... ).
Rich or Poor, it’s all about playing the Music, not the gear
It’s all about enjoying yourself at all levels ( even if you become a Pro ) if you loose the ability of being grounded, you loose the connection along with everything else, specially yourself.
It’s all about the Music
A lot of Pro’s still have that old beaten gear they started with hanging around, and that instrument still calls them and speaks out aloud ( ie : Paul McCartney, Sting etc... ).
Rich or Poor, it’s all about playing the Music, not the gear
Some great posts. I'm glad to know that there are so many intelligent people. I often see forums where people are so close-minded, but for the most part, people seem thoughtful.
I've been in all the boats myself. In my collection right now, I have a Nordy and Skyline. The Nordy is at least twice as expensive as my Skyline. Normally I wouldn't justify that, but for some reason, the Nordy's wood combo and quality just has this feel and sound my Skyline doesn't, even though the Skyline is great. It's not the money, but it really is what I'm feeling and hearing. I used to say I'd never pay more than $1k for a bass, but lately, I've been playing higher end stuff and I've fallen in love with the overall sound and feel, though I still find much charm in my $300 Yamaha.
One distinction though I must add is that it seemsa little harder to find a good 5-string with a good B in the mass produced lines, especially in the lower-end range. Duh. But for me, I think a good 5 string that works and fits for me (given the nature of its physics) is generally harder to find which is why I'm willing to pay a little more for it. I will admit that in the last 10 years, good affordable 5s have sprung up more than ever, but that low B adds an incredible amount of variables to the search. Sure, any good jazz is relatively easy to find, but a good 5 string J? I can get by on a $400 MIM 4 stringer, but the $400 MIM 5 strings are a little more unwieldy to me.
I know I made a slight detour from the OP.
But yeah, like everyone said, but be true and honest to yourself and needs. And I liked that comment about making and "us and them" distinction. There shouldn't have to be.
I've been in all the boats myself. In my collection right now, I have a Nordy and Skyline. The Nordy is at least twice as expensive as my Skyline. Normally I wouldn't justify that, but for some reason, the Nordy's wood combo and quality just has this feel and sound my Skyline doesn't, even though the Skyline is great. It's not the money, but it really is what I'm feeling and hearing. I used to say I'd never pay more than $1k for a bass, but lately, I've been playing higher end stuff and I've fallen in love with the overall sound and feel, though I still find much charm in my $300 Yamaha.
One distinction though I must add is that it seemsa little harder to find a good 5-string with a good B in the mass produced lines, especially in the lower-end range. Duh. But for me, I think a good 5 string that works and fits for me (given the nature of its physics) is generally harder to find which is why I'm willing to pay a little more for it. I will admit that in the last 10 years, good affordable 5s have sprung up more than ever, but that low B adds an incredible amount of variables to the search. Sure, any good jazz is relatively easy to find, but a good 5 string J? I can get by on a $400 MIM 4 stringer, but the $400 MIM 5 strings are a little more unwieldy to me.
I know I made a slight detour from the OP.
But yeah, like everyone said, but be true and honest to yourself and needs. And I liked that comment about making and "us and them" distinction. There shouldn't have to be.
Well, for me, it's a matter of not being able to afford a boutique bass to begin with but having said that, I would suspect that there are some really impressive mass produced basses out there and conversely, probably a few boutique "duds" as well. IMHO, it's about playability and price. If I had the money for a boutique instrument, I would probably get one just to see if it was "worth it"
It's amazing how divided the bass community can be. There are obvious benifits and drawbacks to every peice of gear. However, there is very little intelligent conversation discussing them. I consider myself open minded and would never dismiss anything based on price, rumors or speculation. I used to jump in on these threads, but it's not really worth it. I don't feel the need to justify my gear to anyone. If someone wants to judge whether I 'deserve' my gear or not can come hear me play and decide for themselves. I've been a student of music for many years--and will continue to be for many many more--but, in the meantime, my phone is still ringing.
Very interesting read.....
Optimally I like to play an instrument before I buy it, if it passes that test I will bring it home and play it in my basement with my equipment and A/B it to my other instruments, different amp rigs, record it etc. My hands and my ears know what things should feel and sound like in this environment. If I still like it it goes out on gigs for a while, I won't make my decision if I plan on keeping it too soon as sometimes things grow on you and change over time.
In many cases it's tough to find basses in a local store by many of these smaller builders, even in and around NYC. And of course the true custom shops it's almost impossible to find a bass to play except when you get lucky and find a used one in a local retailer. Of course the less expensive basses are all around but in the big retailers usually are set up poorly and many times you need to go through them with a fine touth comb to find anything playable.
In any case I don't prefer mass produced or boutique basses I prefer the ones that sound and feel the best to me. When I can't play it first I go by reputation and that most of the time costs more money.
I hope that makes sense!
Optimally I like to play an instrument before I buy it, if it passes that test I will bring it home and play it in my basement with my equipment and A/B it to my other instruments, different amp rigs, record it etc. My hands and my ears know what things should feel and sound like in this environment. If I still like it it goes out on gigs for a while, I won't make my decision if I plan on keeping it too soon as sometimes things grow on you and change over time.
In many cases it's tough to find basses in a local store by many of these smaller builders, even in and around NYC. And of course the true custom shops it's almost impossible to find a bass to play except when you get lucky and find a used one in a local retailer. Of course the less expensive basses are all around but in the big retailers usually are set up poorly and many times you need to go through them with a fine touth comb to find anything playable.
In any case I don't prefer mass produced or boutique basses I prefer the ones that sound and feel the best to me. When I can't play it first I go by reputation and that most of the time costs more money.
I hope that makes sense!
No, it's not appropriate, either, but let's face it...being able to spend $5000 on a bass is a lot better social position to be in than not being able to spend $5000 on a bass. So unless you live in a trailer and eat ramen noodles to afford your basses, you can take a couple shots
But in all honestly, if I was a mod, I'd close this thread and any like it. All it does is set up an us vs. them mentality.
There's this Jedi mind trick I learned a long time ago... if you leave a thread and never return, effectly it is closed.
Just keep repeating: "This isn't the thread I'm looking for".
Back on subject (you're not still here, are ya?
), for me it has always boiled down to priorities and fun factor. I learned a long time ago when I had nothing that I couldn't have everything. So when I did get in a position to get things, I got things I wanted. In the case of bass gear, that came a long way down the road, after I'd put in the shed time. As such, I think I really have a level of appreciation for the instrument that many never reach. If anyone takes that the wrong way, cool.A good bass is a good bass and it could be a $50 pawnshop special or a custom ordered Hedonistica Mk VIII. I have fun with all sorts of instruments, I just had a lot of fun with a Ministar Basstar fretless travel bass (street price $199). By the same token I have a ball with my Brubaker KXB-6 Custom with a ramp and by some standards ridiculously low action.
Playing bass is fun to me and I can't get worked up if someone else has an opinion about what I like or do. It's much harder to build an instrument that'll work with consistently low action. It can be hard to find one with excellent string to string response, particularly with a lower than E string. At let's face it, esthetics isn't exactly an evil thing... what's wrong with playing an instrument you think looks great? And sometimes esthetics costs.
I like bass and sports cars. I've figured out a way to indulge in both without spending as much as others might on "lesser" (fun) cars, clothes, CDs and other such stuff. I was driving a 15+ year old car when I got my first custom bass. Some of my friends were amazed that I had a custom bass and a sports car and even wondered how I could afford it. When I looked at the $5k I spent on the car (1967 Porsche 912) and the $500 I spent on the bass (1978 Tobias) and then looked at them with their early 80's Trans Ams and Cutlass Supremes... well, it was funny how much they just didn't get.
Priorities allow you to do things you might not normally think you can. So you can think... or hate. Thinking's more fun IME.
I like your approach. Lord knows, I have bought basses that I loved at the shop that did nothing for me at home.
john turner
You don't want to do that. Trust me.
No, it's not appropriate, either, but let's face it...being able to spend $5000 on a bass is a lot better social position to be in than not being able to spend $5000 on a bass. So unless you live in a trailer and eat ramen noodles to afford your basses, you can take a couple shots
But in all honestly, if I was a mod, I'd close this thread and any like it. All it does is set up an us vs. them mentality.
normally i'd agree with you there, and nuke it as a matter of principle, but i think at the root of this discussion (under the bruised egos on both sides) is a lot of good information.
if folks can keep their own rubbing off other folks' rhubbarbs, then maybe this can continue and be somewhat positive. maybe.
.
Us vs. them is completely voluntary. Just be happy for what you have, work harder if you're trying to achieve more and be happy for others, period. Whatever they may prefer.
What people ''deserve" and the need to justify some things just never made sense to me. I'd take anything I own to a bar gig. I'd also take anything I own to any other gig. There's no barometer for what has to go where.
Dings? if they really bother you that much, you probably shouldn't own things you're that worried about dinging. For your own sake.
I've owned a few coffee tables in my day and so far not one of them has looked like a boutique bass. Who are these people with their fancy coffee tables and what makes them think they're any bette... ooops.
What people ''deserve" and the need to justify some things just never made sense to me. I'd take anything I own to a bar gig. I'd also take anything I own to any other gig. There's no barometer for what has to go where.
Dings? if they really bother you that much, you probably shouldn't own things you're that worried about dinging. For your own sake.
I've owned a few coffee tables in my day and so far not one of them has looked like a boutique bass. Who are these people with their fancy coffee tables and what makes them think they're any bette... ooops.
This is a strange thread. Why not ask guitar players why they'd rather play Fender Strats and Teles and Gibson LPs and SGs over boutique guitars. 90% of guitar pros would wonder at the question. We bass players may be more flexible, but at least 50% also scratch our heads at the need. The vast majoiry of great guitar tone in tunes come from those pretty standard axes. Same for great bass recordings. Unless boutique IS your sound, why would one pay $3-6K for one?
I like your approach. Lord knows, I have bought basses that I loved at the shop that did nothing for me at home.
Your not kidding! Usually you realize that 1 day after it can be returned. Every month or so I hit the local GC and Sam Ash and make sure I play everything including the Squires to see if any of them are whispering my name.
After looking through all the comments, it seems to me that no one has stressed how personal the selection of an instrument can be. From $100-tens of thousands, I played an instrument that a friend or colleague has treasured as their most prized possession and been unimpressed, and vise-versa. Obviously the deciding factor many of us face when selecting a instrument is money but, as many of us have seen, money in not always the deciding factor on the instrument.
That may have been the best thing I ever read from you, Brad.
I really wish we were more happy for each other, and not so bent on dogging each other's choices. Whether it is something I would want or not, I certainly respect the choices of my fellow TB'ers.
