Who's Gigging With A Single Barefaced One10?

[mmbongo]

You would at least have the opportunity to a/b the two before you flipped the One10 - you might be pleasantly surprised and flip the Markbass. I am a fan of Markbass amps through the Barefaced 10s but I don't think their speakers come close to the tone or power handling of the BF10.

I'd like to know the results of an A/B test as well, as I know the results of my own A/B test with the One 10 vs. my GK 210.

But as far as power handling...the Markbass cab is rated for almost twice the power handling as the One10.

Also keep in mind that the One10 is rated at 95db sensitivity vs. 101db on the Markbass. So the Markbass is going to be a LOT louder with the same power.

There's only so much you can get from a tiny box with a low powered driver that's designed to break up. The One10 is a nice cab for low power, but it does not defy physics here.

 

[theevilplankton]

That's what convinced me. 2 one10's together are about the same size as the 102p.

 

[lomo]

I'll bet heavily that the pair of One 10s will be substantially louder than the Markbass 210, as long as you are using an amp with enough power to remove the sensitivity difference from the equation (say...500 watts into 4 Ohms)

 

[mmbongo]

I'll bet heavily that the pair of One 10s will be substantially louder than the Markbass 210, as long as you are using an amp with enough power to remove the sensitivity difference from the equation (say...500 watts into 4 Ohms)

Adding a second One10 would make it 98db. The MarkBass would be 3db louder.

Again, these tiny cabs do not magically defy physics.

 

[pfschim]

Adding a second One10 would make it 98db. The MarkBass would be 3db louder.

Again, these tiny cabs do not magically defy physics.

this is all I was trying to say when I posted above. No matter what is said about any small cab, no matter how amazingly designed and spec'd it is, it cannot defy physics.

that, and if you are playing super quiet gigs (coffee shop/acoustic etc.) and/or have full PA support with good monitoring, you can pretty much use almost any cab and be fine.

 

[Jack]

Adding a second One10 would make it 98db. The MarkBass would be 3db louder.

Again, these tiny cabs do not magically defy physics.

I have not played either cab, but your statement assumes that both cabs are equally and honestly measured and specified. Given the industry as a whole I find this... unlikely.

All things being equal a 2x10 should be more sensitive than a 1x10. But it may not matter. Maybe the 2x10 can do 130dB maximum and the 1x10 can only do 120dB. Well if you need 125dB that's a problem, if you need 80dB it isn't.

 

[mmbongo]

I have not played either cab, but your statement assumes that both cabs are equally and honestly measured and specified. Given the industry as a whole I find this... unlikely.

All things being equal a 2x10 should be more sensitive than a 1x10. But it may not matter. Maybe the 2x10 can do 130dB maximum and the 1x10 can only do 120dB. Well if you need 125dB that's a problem, if you need 80dB it isn't.

All very true.

I'm also basing this on my first hand experience with my One10 vs. my GK 2x10, and also assuming the Markbass is at least in the same ballpark as my GK on sensitivity and max SPL, which it should be. Maybe even better, as my GK is about 10 years old.

 

[Tim1]

All very true.

I'm also basing this on my first hand experience with my One10 vs. my GK 2x10, and also assuming the Markbass is at least in the same ballpark as my GK on sensitivity and max SPL, which it should be. Maybe even better, as my GK is about 10 years old.

You have a better reference point than I there. I do know the Barefaced One 10 was "louder" than my Markbass 112, but I do not own a five string to test the low B. Also I match my One 10 with a Mesa D800+, and a touch of the HPF is indeed a wonderful thing with this cab when you want loud.

 

[mmbongo]

You have a better reference point than I there. I do know the Barefaced One 10 was "louder" than my Markbass 112, but I do not own a five string to test the low B. Also I match my One 10 with a Mesa D800+, and a touch of the HPF is indeed a wonderful thing with this cab when you want loud.

Yeah the HPF goes a long way to helping out the One10! That's the best feature of the Mesa Subway amps.

 

[lomo]

Adding a second One10 would make it 98db. The MarkBass would be 3db louder.

Again, these tiny cabs do not magically defy physics.

The difference in sensitivity does not mean the Markbass will be louder, as long as enough power is available to drive both rigs to their respective potentials. Sensitivity is not a proxy for volume unless it's a scenario in which the power available is well below max. Of course these cabs do not defy physics, but they do use better drivers than many other cabs, allowing them to get pleasantly louder beyond the point where other cabs compress. I have owned a pair of BF One 10s. The only reason I flipped them is that I missed more high end when playing ABG with piezo. They were considerably louder than expected for a single 10, let alone one that weighs <15 lbs!!! The BF One10 is louder than the 22lb Genzler 10-2 array that I got as a replacement, but the latter is a better match with my ABG. Having said that, I do miss them, and have toyed with the idea of getting a BF 210. In the end, I am sure the MB 210 will work for the OP's application for less $, but if one wanted to spend more $ to get lighter and modular, I'd still go with the BF pair. YMMV.

 

[alaskaleftybass]

Problem is, in the January sales (they've come early), I've seen a Markbass TRV 102P 2x10 at a real reduction.

That would fit easily in the car, and it's pretty close to what another BF One10 would set me back.

Puts me in mind to go for that, and flip the One10 when I get it (already paid a deposit....). It's overall, a much cheaper option.....and it's a ready-built light 2x10......

It sounds like Alex is a good guy. I'd email him and see if he's willing to release the deposit to you-- since there is a demand for Barefaced he wouldn't really be out anything. Even if you decide on a larger Barefaced you're going to be waiting what-- two more months? If you do hold out, at least get the Tw010 or the Midget with a 12." They're still very small but produce much more than the One10.

In all honesty, with respect, you can't honestly believe that a 110 cabinet as small as it is will support your professional gigs. It is just physically impossible for it to produce what a 2x10," 12" or 15" speaker will do. The Markbass sounds like a better deal for you, that will cover just about anything you throw at it. And if it fits in your new toy, just bear in mind, so will a Fender or a GK 112 Neo. But for your sake, don't embarrass yourself by ever arriving at a gig underpowered. Honestly, when you see the One10 you'll see how really tiny it is.

 

[lomo]

.....in the end, the One 10 is aimed at the player who wants max old school sound per pound in the absolute smallest/lightest package, and is willing pay a premium for it.

 

[el murdoque]

Good to hear your experience with the One10. I’m sure it’s a great cab, but a little less magic. I think we’re hitting the wall of physics on how small and light cabs can actually go.

I just had the pleasure of swapping a one10 for a Super Compact - and what the Super Compact does is nothing short of magic. I A/B'ed it with a high quality 212 cab and the Super Compact was louder in the lows with the amps master dimed. The one10 sacrifices a bit of that performance because it is tiny, but it still does a lot more than it should.

 

[Downunderwonder]

It sounds like Alex is a good guy. I'd email him and see if he's willing to release the deposit to you-- since there is a demand for Barefaced he wouldn't really be out anything. Even if you decide on a larger Barefaced you're going to be waiting what-- two more months? If you do hold out, at least get the Tw010 or the Midget with a 12." They're still very small but produce much more than the One10.

In all honesty, with respect, you can't honestly believe that a 110 cabinet as small as it is will support your professional gigs. It is just physically impossible for it to produce what a 2x10," 12" or 15" speaker will do. The Markbass sounds like a better deal for you, that will cover just about anything you throw at it. And if it fits in your new toy, just bear in mind, so will a Fender or a GK 112 Neo. But for your sake, don't embarrass yourself by ever arriving at a gig underpowered. Honestly, when you see the One10 you'll see how really tiny it is.

all tens are not created equally. From what others say about it the crazy little thing takes a lot of power and turns it into bass, albeit shy on the lowest lows. Nobody is filling a hall with one.

 

[Tim1]

I do not claim to be a physicist at all, so take whatever I say as you wish. We comment on "the laws of physics" as being fixed. I have no doubt they are, and that Alex is well aware of this.
In simplistic terms as I understand it to get more volume from, say, a traditional ten inch speaker we add another to enlarge cone area and air movement. Plus we can play around with voice coils, cone material, resistance, cabinet design etc. Again this is as I understand it but it makes sense to me. What Alex has done, as well as innovative cabinet construction, is to design from the ground up a new speaker. To me the significant break through of this speaker is that it moves considerably more air because it has much greater front to back movement than others (I think he calls it "pistonic displacement"???). This makes sense to me. You can move more air by adding speakers or by increasing the movement of a single speaker. As kids we used to do it when we made fans out of paper.
So this is the way I have explained to myself why the One 10 is so much more magically efficient than other tens - it can safely move forwards and back much more than other speakers and just as fast.
I recognize I may open a can of worms by posting this but hey, it is the holidays and always happy to learn.

 

[mmbongo]

I do not claim to be a physicist at all, so take whatever I say as you wish. We comment on "the laws of physics" as being fixed. I have no doubt they are, and that Alex is well aware of this.
In simplistic terms as I understand it to get more volume from, say, a traditional ten inch speaker we add another to enlarge cone area and air movement. Plus we can play around with voice coils, cone material, resistance, cabinet design etc. Again this is as I understand it but it makes sense to me. What Alex has done, as well as innovative cabinet construction, is to design from the ground up a new speaker. To me the significant break through of this speaker is that it moves considerably more air because it has much greater front to back movement than others (I think he calls it "pistonic displacement"???). This makes sense to me. You can move more air by adding speakers or by increasing the movement of a single speaker. As kids we used to do it when we made fans out of paper.

I don't think that applies to the 10" driver, as it has different design goals than the 12" cabinets. The 10's are not made for maximum low end from the smallest cabinet like the 12's are. And neither of his speakers are designed 'from the ground up' as they are just modded Eminence drivers. The 12 is based on the Kappalite LF that most other cab manufactures use. You can't really 'make it move more' because the LF already has the largest Xmax possible while using that frame. Both drivers do use a different outer dust cap to change the mid voicing. Also keep in mind that if you do increase Xmax, you lose sensitivity and upper end response. It's all a tradeoff.

 

[Tim1]

I don't think that applies to the 10" driver, as it has different design goals than the 12" cabinets. The 10's are not made for maximum low end from the smallest cabinet like the 12's are. And neither of his speakers are designed 'from the ground up' as they are just modded Eminence drivers. The 12 is based on the Kappalite LF that most other cab manufactures use. You can't really 'make it move more' because the LF already has the largest Xmax possible while using that frame. Both drivers do use a different outer dust cap to change the mid voicing. Also keep in mind that if you do increase Xmax, you lose sensitivity and upper end response. It's all a tradeoff.

Thanks for that, all part of the learning process. Yeah, did wonder whether the One 10 was developed along the same principles of the 12.
The One 10 still remains the "loudest" ten I have played and I am a huge fan of its baked in character. That said, I usually gig with the Four 10.....
I see at some stage I am going to have to try a BB2.

 

[Dp1363]

Once you go BB2 nothing else will compare.

 

[Stu_Bass]

Other cabs may get louder but won't necessarily sound as good. How about the SC? Maybe he would apply your deposit towards it.

 

[kasbrey]

You have a better reference point than I there. I do know the Barefaced One 10 was "louder" than my Markbass 112, but I do not own a five string to test the low B. Also I match my One 10 with a Mesa D800+, and a touch of the HPF is indeed a wonderful thing with this cab when you want loud.

I have 2 One10's and have owned most 1x12s that Markbass have made . I think that the NY112 has a lot more heft than a single One10 and the Club and Traveler 1x12s have even more. I have also gigged a single Traveler 102 and the small cab size makes it a bit shy on bottom end in comparison to 2 x BF110s but will match them for volume. The Markbass STD 102HF is a lot louder (and bigger). The One10's do sound nice though (I just wish they had a tiny bit more top end).