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why 10s for bass?

#62
JimmyM said:
You left out the 410 that does 28 hz (HLF). Helps to make your point.
Click to expand...

Supporting a point with bass cab company specs isn't going to lead to much true enlightment anyway - though Ampeg has played less fast and loose with the actualities than the vast majority of cab manufacturers.

-10 dB figures are pretty much useless to get a real handle on how things actually are, anyway. Especially at the low frequencies where the energy requirements are fighting with the realities of xmax/excursion, and the human ear suffers insensitivity described by the Equal Loudness Contour.

Really the only thing that comes close are graphs at describing spectral balance, because a cab with a true -3 dB figure at 50 Hz when compared to one with a -3 dB figure at 45 Hz could actually have considerably more cumulative output below say 125 Hz, a bigger mass there... and also have the xmax to actually keep producing it as the wattage gets raised and raised while the other cab is now ensconced in Fartsville's cheapest fleabag dive.
 
#63
My first bass amp was an Acoustic 360 with a 18" Cerwin Vega folded horn speaker, it was all bass, very little treble. It took 30' for the sound of the cabinet to develop.

I remember playing, back in the 70's, thru an Ampeg SVT 8-10" 300 watt rms bass amp and it sounded so good. Those 10's developed so quickly and had so much punch, it sounded awesome.

Today, I play thru a Carvin BRX10.4 Neo cab and it's so punchy, articulate and full sounding that I can't see myself ever going back to anything but 10" speakers.
 
#64
vinxbass said:
My first bass amp was an Acoustic 360 with a 18" Cerwin Vega folded horn speaker, it was all bass, very little treble. It took 30' for the sound of the cabinet to develop.

I had one of those around 1980, loved it. Luckily, I had roadies at the time.:p With an old Jazz bass the lows could be controlled and the high end was so sweet. I was using the 360model on my Line 6 the other night and got a nice compliment from a guitard in the crowd re my tone.:cool:
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#65
Because 10's sound better when you are standing 2 feet away from them in the store, trying out different cabinets. Which is really beside the point. But this is the way most people choose a cabinet. So manufacturers have noticed this and have adapted by offering multiple 10's. (In case you couldn't tell, I favor big speakers);)
 
#68
behemecoytl said:
what is it about 10inch speakers that makes them good for the low end?
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In over 30 years of playing, the reason why I always go back to tens after trying fifteens every so often is because tens sound better to me at the gig. I like a punchy growly sound with harmonic richness and aggressive edge, and bass guitar cabs loaded with tens usually do this much better than those loaded with fifteens. I also hear tens better at the gig because they sit nicely in the mix... IME, fifteens are more "blurry".

The above contains some pretty big generalizations, as well as my personal preference. There's no right or wrong here, only personal preference.
 
#71
behemecoytl said:
it seems like 10inch speakers are the most popular size for bass speakers right now, while it 12inch speakers are among the most popular for guitar... this seems counterintuitive to me, although I know that bigger is not necessarily better for bass.
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In my observation, there's nothing new about the dominance of 10-inch bass speakers, which have been very popular for at least the past 25 years or so. If anything, the recent trend has been going the other way, with 12-inch drivers coming on strong, and 15-inch drivers making a comeback... :hmm:

MM
 
#73
But...which cab actually gives one very low freq with good control?
No good having it all low and Boomy I recon.
I have tried some of this kind .
They went low, ok, but sounded absolute rubbish, with no deffinition.
Low on it#s own doesn't really do it, does it?

Any recommendations ? :)
 
#74
cnltb said:
But...which cab actually gives one very low freq with good control?
No good having it all low and Boomy I recon.
I have tried some of this kind .
They went low, ok, but sounded absolute rubbish, with no deffinition.
Low on it#s own doesn't really do it, does it?

Any recommendations ? :)
Click to expand...

Here's one which I just saw in another thread: [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]
 
#75
Nice to know the science has kicked in toward the end of this thread, people seem to like asking quasi-scientific questions to have people respond with entirely non-scientific answers. Of course alot of generalisations exist with the whole speaker size thing- 10s are punchier, 15s are warmer etc etc - but playing up to them only causes them to perpetuate themselves and lets lame speaker companies like Ampeg say stupid crap like bigger speakers "simply can't respond to transient peaks as quickly as our tens" and get away with it.
 
#76
cnltb said:
But...which cab actually gives one very low freq with good control?
No good having it all low and Boomy I recon.
I have tried some of this kind .
They went low, ok, but sounded absolute rubbish, with no deffinition.
Low on it#s own doesn't really do it, does it?
Click to expand...
If it's boomy it isn't low. Boom doesn't come from the bass, it comes from the midbass, usually the result of putting drivers into too small a box. Driver size has nothing to do with it. As for lack of definition, that comes from lack of midrange, which has less to do with driver size than a poorly engineered cabinet design.
lets lame speaker companies like Ampeg say sill crap like bigger speakers "simply can't respond to transient peaks as quickly as our tens" and get away with it.
Click to expand...
A very high percentage of advertising relies on the consumer not understanding how the advertised product works, if indeed it works at all.
smilingbob.jpg
 
#78
PeterT55 said:
Someone mentioned the old Acoustic cabs w/18" Cerwin Vega speakers in them,.....those were some of the best, balanced sounding cabs I ever heard from back in the day,.....tight, warm, projecting, you name it,....
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Jaco cabs! They didn't get much highs or upper mids though, and had that boxy folded horn tone. But man they got a big oomph!
 
#79
billfitzmaurice said:
If it's boomy it isn't low. Boom doesn't come from the bass, it comes from the midbass, usually the result of putting drivers into too small a box. Driver size has nothing to do with it. As for lack of definition, that comes from lack of midrange, which has less to do with driver size than a poorly engineered cabinet design.

A very high percentage of advertising relies on the consumer not understanding how the advertised product works, if indeed it works at all.
smilingbob.jpg
Click to expand...

My point was not that boomy comes from low, but that I have not really heard a cab that did very low well controlled.
I should probably have been clearer.-sorry!
I would basically be looking for a cab, that combines the right speakers with the right cabsize to accomplish top and bottom and a good midrange...a fullrange cab, really...:)
 
#80
Alembicplyr said:
I was always of the opinion of the more drivers, the more DB.
Seeing that 10's generally use up smaller parameters, you could pack a few more in, than say 15's. Would this be somewhat true?
Click to expand...

Sadly not. If the frequency response and total cone area are the same then so will the sensitivity (if both cabs are fully optimised). If you fit a greater cone area into a smaller cab then you'll gain midrange sensitivity but lose low frequency sensitivity, which is why 8x10"s tend to be louder but have less bottom than an equal sized 2x15".

Alex
 

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