Well, that and maybe the fact he was playing .13s on a Strat for most of his career...
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Why do a lot of bands tune to E flat?
- Thread starter flareaga
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Well, that and maybe the fact he was playing .13s on a Strat for most of his career...
This tuning down thing frankly gives me the *****, and I've never seen the point. Even the lightest of modern guitar strings seldom break these days, so the bending strings thing is a crock, and given the variety of song keys, so is the vocal range excuse. Maybe some people think "it just sound cooler", but I'm not one of them.
I keep an acoustic guitar tuned down a tone, because i find i can sing more of the songs i want to sing if i drop them a tone.
Also tuning down makes string bending a little easier for guitarists because of the reduced string tension.
Also tuning down makes string bending a little easier for guitarists because of the reduced string tension.
Tuning down to Eb is a rock thing.
Rock songs are written on guitars so will more often than not be in E or G.
Rock songs are sung by men who struggle to hit the higher notes.
So the compromise is stuff using open chugs and riffs off the E string tuned down to suit the male singer.
There is nothing in this about cooler, darker, more rock-like, sounds or feel. It may be that tuning down sounds better to you but that is just because it sounds more like all the rock records you grew up with that were also tuned down.
There is no magic in any of this. Just lazy guitarists and lazy singers.
Rock 'n' Roll.
Rock songs are written on guitars so will more often than not be in E or G.
Rock songs are sung by men who struggle to hit the higher notes.
So the compromise is stuff using open chugs and riffs off the E string tuned down to suit the male singer.
There is nothing in this about cooler, darker, more rock-like, sounds or feel. It may be that tuning down sounds better to you but that is just because it sounds more like all the rock records you grew up with that were also tuned down.
There is no magic in any of this. Just lazy guitarists and lazy singers.
Rock 'n' Roll.
I have this same issue (need to check out that Pitch Shift function) because I like a few songs that are in E-Flat but want to perform them in standard tuning with my band. But when I practice I want to practice them with the record in standard tuning.
For me, it is a big decision, and a band needs to either be ALL in half-step, so everything is played liked this (ie even if it was normal originally not it is a half step down) or all normal. Because I stopped carrying TWO basses to gigs a long time ago, I don;'t switch, messes up my feel. Its one P-bass all night long and I love it, no F*Cking with tone controls, or changing my amp.
For me, it is a big decision, and a band needs to either be ALL in half-step, so everything is played liked this (ie even if it was normal originally not it is a half step down) or all normal. Because I stopped carrying TWO basses to gigs a long time ago, I don;'t switch, messes up my feel. Its one P-bass all night long and I love it, no F*Cking with tone controls, or changing my amp.
That's what I feel. And buying a 5-string bass to compensate is not the be-all end-all answer. More than likely, the 5-string will get tuned down a half-step, too.
Great point about the band being ALL-IN. Either it's all that way or no deal. Just like you, I'm not gonna be swapping basses every 3 songs.
Let it be known that it's not necessarily about having a 'lower' vocal tessitura. Many singers (mine included) simply feel more comfortable singing in flat keys (and not just Gb maj/Eb min). That aside, some people use Eb tuning to acheive a different overall tonality. All keys are not created equal.
432hz said:The simplest answer is that it really isn't tuned down, but in a different frequency rather. Concert A, standardized by the AFM (Rockerfeller), is 440 Hz; although, natural resonant frequency is actually A=432 Hz.
Resource:
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Other research:
Fibonacci Golden Ratio
Solfeggio scale
An older post, but I read the linked article. Cracked me up.
A 440 is part of the Nazi agenda! A 432 is the resonant frequency of LIGHT and CONSCIOUSNESS. Have you ever been listening to something, and you hear an A that just makes your consciousness vibrate, and bends all the light in the room? That's a TRUE A 432.
I agree, and I don't much like this trend myself, but you hear it quite often with orchestras. They tune slightly bright (sharp) in the belief that it's somehow more uplifting for the audience. Personally, I think it's nonsense.
As a trumpet player once in a while, I always thought it was probably first used to satisfy wind instruments. Eb on a guitar and bass makes my job as a trumpeter a lot easier.
It's really not that simple. I play in a folk/bluegrass quartet and we tune down 1/2 step because my singer prefers flat keys (and not because of his vocal range). Some singers really do just prefer them. Aside from that, tuning down can produce a different sound. Fact is that all keys are not tuned equally, and thus all keys have unique tonal characteristics. That coupled with the fact that (like you mentioned) certain keys are much more prevalent than others (and not only in guitar-dominanted music) - we use keys like Db and Gb quite seldom in Western music, really.
If a singer prefers a particular key for a particular song, then it's all about their vocal range. If a song is comfortably within their range, then there's no reason at all why they should even know (without being told) whether it's in a flat key or not, let alone prefer it.
I guess singers with perfect pitch could be aware of the key. But expressing a preference for, say, Eb over E is either about ease of hitting high notes in the tune a semitone lower, or purely affectation.
All keys ARE tuned equally with contemporary equal temperament instruments and they don't have unique tonal characteristics unless these are dictated by the limitations of the instrument or the musician.
Most of Aerosmith Rocks is tuned down 1/2 step.
Re: Stevie Wonder - I remember reading that his bass player (Nathan Watts?) tuned to Eb because SW liked the key, and when he played the unison horn run in Sir Duke he had to bend the high note in the run to reach it (playing a fender P).
Re: Stevie Wonder - I remember reading that his bass player (Nathan Watts?) tuned to Eb because SW liked the key, and when he played the unison horn run in Sir Duke he had to bend the high note in the run to reach it (playing a fender P).
I know Nathan tuned down for some tunes, specifically "Do I Do" in order to hit the necessary bottom D# in the original key of B. Stevie liked keys with lots of black notes on the piano - easier to feel your way around, I guess.
Having said that, though, all the arrangements I've ever played of Sir Duke wouldn't require the bend you mention as the highest note would be within the range of a Standard P even if it was tuned down a semitone. With Sir Duke, as with "Do I Do", the original key is B, and in this key the highest note in the unison run you mention is G#, which would be 14th fret on a bass that was downtuned one semitone. I don't think you need to hit the top D# in the tune, but maybe somebody else could correct this if I'm mistaken. If you did need to, this would be one semitone above the range of such a downtuned P bass and would therefore need the bend you mention.
By the way, just to be accurate, for the first tune I mentioned there, Nathan was playing a Stingray IIRC on "Original Musicquarium" . Sir Duke was on the Songs In The Key Of Life album, but I don't know what bass Nate was using at that point.
Alvaro Martín Gómez A.
TalkBass' resident Bongo + cowbell player
Hey Bill! I recorded a bass cover of "Sir Duke" a couple years ago and that bending is actually needed to play the unison run if you are trying to replicate the way Nathan Watts recorded it. Check the video here (there are two slow-motion takes of the run at the end of the video) and here's what I wrote about bass tuning in the video description:
After that, I remember having seen some sources saying that Nathan Watts actually downtuned his bass one half step, so it seems that my guessing was right.
That's a great video, Alvaro, thanks. Lovely relaxed and accurate playing.
It sounds like you and Nate are playing it different to me. Our arrangement, like yours, is in C. In that run, the C on beat 1 of the second bar is the same C as the start of the run, on my bass chart (that's also true for the horns on the record, if you listen). Your vid, though, shows you're playing that second bar an octave higher than I am - hence the high E. I'm on 9th fret of the G string at that point. In other words, you (and Nate?) are playing the first bar same as me except for the last two sixteenth notes, which you play an octave up, the second bar is also an octave up and the rest is the same as me again.
Here's a recording of my band playing it. It was a rather boozy gig, to be honest, lots of trumpet shenanigans going on here. You can hear me pushing to keep the buggers from slowing down most of the way through the tune!
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It sounds like you and Nate are playing it different to me. Our arrangement, like yours, is in C. In that run, the C on beat 1 of the second bar is the same C as the start of the run, on my bass chart (that's also true for the horns on the record, if you listen). Your vid, though, shows you're playing that second bar an octave higher than I am - hence the high E. I'm on 9th fret of the G string at that point. In other words, you (and Nate?) are playing the first bar same as me except for the last two sixteenth notes, which you play an octave up, the second bar is also an octave up and the rest is the same as me again.
Here's a recording of my band playing it. It was a rather boozy gig, to be honest, lots of trumpet shenanigans going on here. You can hear me pushing to keep the buggers from slowing down most of the way through the tune!
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Put some LaBella flats on it.
I have them on all my short scales and can downtune to D even though I never do.
Thanks for the tip on Garageband,I used AU Pitch filter and moved Blood and Roses up 1/2 step and am now playing it in normal E. Guess what the difference is VERY neglgigible, in fact the average person won't even know the difference. So NICE finally being able to practice this song without detuning 3 strings or switching basses. Moved up some old Ratt tunes to, guess what, negligible difference, but so nice to play all in standard tuning.
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