Why Do Legendary Bassists play such Cheesy Material???

[basegetar]

Originally posted by Oysterman
If you think that is meant to be a serious composition, then I pity you!

I didn't think it was meant to be serious but... "Takin' my bass out for a spin..." Please...

 

[XavierG]

Can someone please define 'cheesy' for me, in musical terms?

 

[JimK]

Towards the end of Jaco's WR days, Zawinul did double the bass line...basically, 'cause Jaco wouldn't play the tune(like "Mr. Gone").
Check out Milkowski's Jaco bio(I think the story is corroborated in Zawinul's book, too).

BTW, didya see the new April issue of Jazz Times?
Invalid Link Removed

 

[JimK]

Originally posted by XavierG
Can someone please define 'cheesy' for me, in musical terms?

Webster's defines "cheesy"(Slang) as-
"Of substandard quality".

..are you familiar with the term schmaltz?

 

[XavierG]

Originally posted by JimK


Webster's defines "cheesy"(Slang) as-
"Of substandard quality".

..are you familiar with the term schmaltz?

So, who sets the standard against which these comparisons are being made? (ie. Weather Report's synth being 'cheesy', and similar statements).

 

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally posted by XavierG


So, who sets the standard against which these comparisons are being made? (ie. Weather Report's synth being 'cheesy', and similar statements).

Yes, I thought it was a bit ironic, as I remember at the time, discovering Weather Report and thinking how refreshing their sound was - as nearly every other Fusion album had loads of distorted guitar solos which was the "cheesy" part to my ears!

I mean Zawinul and Shorter could really play and had worked with the best Jazz musicians of their time - they had something to say in their playing; whereas most of the rock - based guitarists were just regurgitating blues licks at faster tempos!

So it was nice to find an album that wasn't swamped with over-long guitar histrionics !

 

[oddentity]

Originally posted by XavierG


So, who sets the standard against which these comparisons are being made? (ie. Weather Report's synth being 'cheesy', and similar statements).

It's all subjective, right? What's cheesy to one person is meaningful to another.

 

[XavierG]

Originally posted by oddentity


It's all subjective, right? What's cheesy to one person is meaningful to another.

Precisely! I personally liked (and still do) Weather Report very much. The combination of sounds, including that "cheesy synth sound", defined their sound. Weather Report would not have been Weather Report if not for it. And frankly, I really couldn't care less if joeblotalkbassistwhoisquicktocriticizeothersmusicbutslowtoputtheirsonthetableforalltohear_115 thinks their (Weather Report - Zawinul - or anyone else for that matter) sound was "cheesy".

 

[Howard K]

...it explains the large number of players who think that having in-depth knowledge of musical thoery and advanced playing technique detracts from your ability to write decent music.

I love cheese, (Roy Ayers is the king in my book), but when it's purley bass wankoff cheese it's just too much for me.

I had my first lesson the other day (t'was excellent), my teacher played me the CD of classical thumb by victor wooten... to highlight the sloppy technique. My thoughts were "I can't believe people actually think this is good" - it sounds like a learner piece for piano and played badly on bass?!
IMO it's the sort of completely crap melody that I would come up with, work on, then abandon as soon as I realised how completely tacky it was.

If anyone thinks Classical Thump is great, maybe you heard a different version to me?

I do genuinley like cheese in a healthy proportion, but I also agree that artists like Stanley Clarke, Wooten, Stu Hamm are guilty of producing a fair amount of 'flashy crap' for the bassist market.
That said if I was the first guy to play bass like Mr Clarke I'd have done exactly the same thing.

Some good musicians arent good song writers and vice versa.

Jaco is a different matter... I have Word Of Mouth and a collection called Jaco.. it is v-cheesy in places, but it's also amazing in terms of songs and feeling at the same time. Word of Mouth is a bit full-on at times I must admit... Crisis, for example, is a crisis.

I think when people hear a cheesy sound or tone they tend to tune out and ignore the actual song, or groove. Herbie Hancock used many cheesy sounds, but you can still hear the musicians getting into it - you can really feel it.

 

[Intrepid]

Originally posted by Howard K
...it explains the large number of players who think that having in-depth knowledge of musical thoery and advanced playing technique detracts from your ability to write decent music.

Well said....the trumpet player in my band can blow my mind with some of the music theory he talks about, but I don't he can write worth crap. he gets to technical with his music instead of going by sound. I feel I'm a much better song writer then him. Simple=better alot of times, especially in modern music.

I think when people hear a cheesy sound or tone they tend to tune out and ignore the actual song, or groove. Herbie Hancock used many cheesy sounds, but you can still hear the musicians getting into it - you can really feel it.

Well Herbie Hancock and his cheesy sounds were relative is time. I don't he is a good example, because Cantoloupe Island is an amazing song in my opinion. He kept it simple.

 

[Howard K]

Yeah, Herbie did keep it simple in a lot of cases, but the second track on Headhunters - however brilliant - does start of with some very strange and not 100& wholesome noises.
Don't get me wrong I love HH, but I think he can be a bit cheesy (and i like it).