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Why I don't like onboard EQ

#61
I wasn't discounting any of the advice I've received here. But I wasn't posting a problem that I wanted a solution to. I just wanted to hear some feedback about my opinions of onboard EQ. I was already aware of most of the possible solutions to the problems I have with it.

Instead of trying to find an onboard EQ that fits my tastes, I'm just going to stick to passive onboard controls and leave the fancy EQ for outboard gear.

I made the first step to making myself happier about my bass by wiring the pickups straight to the jack and bypassing the preamp. Next? Well, not sure yet.

@JehuJava, while I did find a few of your comments condescending I realize people here are trying to give valuable input and I do appreciate it. It's just that they were answering questions I wasn't asking.
 
#64
I love a qaulity onboard preamp with the center freqs set at what ive foiund to be my fave freq centers for. I use mine for tonal changes. I use either numbered speed knobs or others with postion marker so putting them where desired from memory is quite easy. Regarding diff output level, I like that hotter signal and the sound benefits from lowz conversion. Disp put it quite well to imo.
 
#65
I EQ my amp for the room, and adjust my tone with my hands and on-board tone controls to suit the song.

Sometimes, adjusting the pickup balance or passive tone control makes a bass sound better for a particular song. I don't require an active bass with active tone controls. I definitely prefer the way my P-bass sounds buffered.

Maybe the OP would be happiest with a Redeemer circuit and no on-board controls at all.
 
#66
Jazzdogg said:
I EQ my amp for the room, and adjust my tone with my hands and on-board tone controls to suit the song.

Sometimes, adjusting the pickup balance or passive tone control makes a bass sound better for a particular song. I don't require an active bass with active tone controls. I definitely prefer the way my P-bass sounds buffered.

Maybe the OP would be happiest with a Redeemer circuit and no on-board controls at all.
Click to expand...

Actually I'm having something similar designed for me. Gives me everything I like about a preamp but no EQ.
 
#68
Rickett Customs said:
You sound very qualified: To speak for yourself that is............if that works for you, great. My real question is why do you need to post a thread about it? I can understand getting some feedback about what others may discuss.

I for one, like pancakes, but don't like waffles ;)
Click to expand...

NO, I think there is more here than just personal taste. Ripping all the knobs off your bass doesn't really solve the problem either. It only avoids it.

For example, the issue of changing tone while playing either mid-set or mid-song. I personally agree with the rant that continuous controls are not only prone to be bumped, but also take too much time to "dial-in". This is why I like the G&L approach of switches.

One can ask this question: Just how many different "bass" and "treble" settings do you really "need"? What I'm getting at, is do you REALLY "need" to have an infinite number of settings on a continuous knob? For example what I really like on my passive basses is a three way switch on the "tone" control. The tone control still works, but the switch gives you three instant options: Tone "off" namely maximum bright, tone with .047 cap and tone with .002 cap. This gives you the option of going from a given "dialed-in" tone setting to bright to back again without losing any settings and not having to fiddle with any knobs. You can't do a sound check in the middle of a song!

So this leads to the next question. What if you replaced the active EQ "bass" and "treble" pots with rotary switches that had a series of say 4 or 5 positions of "boost" and 4 or 5 positions of "cut". The knobs would be much less likely to be "bumped" and even better you can flip through a number of settings with KNOWN sound quick as a wink.

I am starting to think there is something to this idea. Of course the BEST system would be some kind of programmable digital thing where you work out a setting with analog pots and then once you like a given sound you "save" it and from then on you only have to touch a button (say on the upper horn) and the bass automatically goes to your setting. But that is a pretty complex and advanced kind of electronics. But nonetheless I could see that kind of rig for folks into bass modeling or pedal effects.
 
#69
KingRazor said:
Instead of trying to find an onboard EQ that fits my tastes, I'm just going to stick to passive onboard controls and leave the fancy EQ for outboard gear.

I made the first step to making myself happier about my bass by wiring the pickups straight to the jack and bypassing the preamp. Next? Well, not sure yet.
Click to expand...

Well, I love the certain "mojo" that passive basses have too. But you've opened a discussion here about an important issue of active basses. (I also love the mojo soe of my active basses have too).

The question is this: Where should your EQ control knobs be located?

Issues: Knobs on the bass are handier to adjust while playing or between sets.

Knobs on bass are easier to bump and knock off their settings while playing.

EQ circuits on basses need to run on batteries which limits the quality and complexity of the circuit.

External EQ circuits can have as much power as they need making the sky the limit.

EQ circuits on the bass make playing with a DI simple and effective without needing an external Preamp.

Often external preamps come with a quality DI which gives you maximum quality tone without needing an amp.


Let me point out that there is a Preamp with EQ in your amp! So even if you have a passive bass, it's still actually active! The only thing missing are the line driver and the fact the knobs are located over on your amp. Thus there is no theoretical reason one couldn't somehow locate the front-end circuits of your amp in a cavity in your passive bass. Yeah there are some practical issues, but in theory it could be done!
 
#70
Bassbenj:

I actually played my first G&L the day at GC. I couldn't figure out what all the switches did except change the sound...now I understand. I never saw that before. I personally rarely use my onboard EQ and when I do it's mostly the mid knob. I prefer a tone knob though for rolling off the highs a bit. I like the idea of the switches AND still having the tone knob...like a three position. However, the argument could be made that you are now limited to just those selections.

I totally agree there are too many EQ knobs between the bass, the amp, the tweeter control, the pedals, the sound man...over control I think. But then again I like shelving EQ.

There may be something to this.
 
#72
I like being able to bump up and down my mids, treble, and bass when I feel like it without having to stop rocking out, turn my back to the audience, take my hand off the bass, and squint at knobs.

With a decent 2- or 3-band EQ that has center detents, I don't understand what the big deal is. Set it at the center and bump it up or down as you need... then if you accidentally bump something, quickly click it back to center and move it to the same general area again.

Close enough is good enough for live... my bass tone isn't some fragile thing that I'm going to utterly destroy and ruin everyone's night if my knobs aren't at the *exact* right place.
 
#74
JehuJava said:
Bassbenj:

I actually played my first G&L the day at GC. I couldn't figure out what all the switches did except change the sound...now I understand. I never saw that before. I personally rarely use my onboard EQ and when I do it's mostly the mid knob. I prefer a tone knob though for rolling off the highs a bit. I like the idea of the switches AND still having the tone knob...like a three position. However, the argument could be made that you are now limited to just those selections.

I totally agree there are too many EQ knobs between the bass, the amp, the tweeter control, the pedals, the sound man...over control I think. But then again I like shelving EQ.

There may be something to this.
Click to expand...
With the exception of our opinions on shelving EQ, you and I actually seem to be on the same page...
 
#75
Also, as I've said in other threads, there's only so much you can do you to your tone with just EQ.

I feel like I get a wider variety of tones just with the balance knob than I do from a shelving EQ.

I'm someone who would be more likely to have two basses that I switch between rather than get one with an onboard EQ that I mess with. If I'm going to change my tone, I'm probably going to want a pretty significant change. I can't think of any time where I'll suddenly want more lows but want the rest of my tone to stay the same.
 
#76
Ray Salamon said:
I have a couple of sets of earbuds... still trying to find ones that I really really "love". The system itself is a Carvin rockmount one... I don't know the exact model off the top of my head. One of the best investments a band can make... even one playing a bar gig. Lets you really tighten up, hear the sound for what it is, and not have insane stage volume (that ends up spilling over FOH!).
Click to expand...

Sweet. The only drawback is convincing the sound guy to hook it up.
 
#77
I've actually considered, if I ever join a band, getting a mixing board for a stage mix. One member of the band controls it. This board controls all monitor sends and the band supplies the monitors/IEMs. All the instruments/mics hook up to a split snake, which sends the same signals to the stage board as the FOH board. That way, no matter who is behind the FOH, the band gets the monitor mix they want.
 
#78
KingRazor said:
If I'm going to change my tone, I'm probably going to want a pretty significant change. I can't think of any time where I'll suddenly want more lows but want the rest of my tone to stay the same.
Click to expand...

Uh, that's pretty much my entire thought process. I have my sound, but occasionally I'll want more or less mids or lows, not a totally new sound. Unless it's something that I need a pedal for, like overdrive, phaser, or synth.

Also, if you want such a complex EQ setup live, how are you going to tweak it? I mean, I'm a pretty active player (I like to run around, jump, headbang, whatever, even when doing classic rock covers) but even if I stood stock still I don't think I could adjust a full parametric EQ with any useful degree of accuracy whilst paying.
 
#79
IntrepidCellist said:
Uh, that's pretty much my entire thought process. I have my sound, but occasionally I'll want more or less mids or lows, not a totally new sound. Unless it's something that I need a pedal for, like overdrive, phaser, or synth.

Also, if you want such a complex EQ setup live, how are you going to tweak it? I mean, I'm a pretty active player (I like to run around, jump, headbang, whatever, even when doing classic rock covers) but even if I stood stock still I don't think I could adjust a full parametric EQ with any useful degree of accuracy whilst paying.
Click to expand...

Well, like I said, I'm a one tone kind of guy. I don't adjust my tone mid-song. Even if I had a 6-band fully parametric EQ, I'd set it during sound check and leave it. If it was recall-able, I'd have one setting for one bass and one setting for another, assuming I wanted to use more than one bass. Which, most of the time, I don't think I'd do.

You and I simply have very different tonal tastes. I can't think of any time when I'd want the same tone, but with just more or less lows, mids, or highs.
 
#80
I guess my confusion comes from the fact that I regularly play in loud rock mixes in places with questionable sound reinforcement, and I'm not picky about my bass tone as long as it works with the band and gets heard. Sometimes to get heard you need that kind of adjustment on-the-fly and it's easier to access on the bass... it doesn't always work out like sitting in a studio (or behind the mixing board) when you're on stage!

I mean, I have passive basses that I play live too, but I always find myself feeling more at the mercy of everyone else with them.
 

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