Why no Hype for the young Brothers?

[aborgman]

Remember this kind of "make money at all costs" thinking got us in this world wide financial crisis\problem. More money is not always a good thing. Well, maybe most of the time it is...

It's neither a "good" nor a "bad" thing - that is dependent on how it is achieved... but for profit companies exist to make a profit.

BP doesn't exist to make the world a better place, it exists to turn a profit.

The problem with this analogy is that plenty of banks have denied loans to minority applicants with excellent\good credit. I guess that's kinda of the point the others are making.

I just don't believe that Bass Player is choosing their who they feature based on racist inclinations in the editorial room. The skew (to the extent it exists) comes from the makeup of the niche they are marketing too.

It doesn't matter how much better for the world it would be if McDonalds started serving health food, because their market isn't interested in it.

I agree with this 100%. This is the #1 way to deal with this type of problem with any company.

Exactly. Hit them in the one place that matters - the pocketbook.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

Come On, Cheese. That statement is lame and does nothing for this thread.
What's the next post going to be "We're being kept down by the Man!"

Why is it so tough for you to accept that BassPlayer is in the business of selling magazines and not promoting the next hot bass phenom (black or white).

Get past my color and go read my posts. I actually said that I consider BP a diverse magazine compared to most music magazines. I simply am supporting the right of others to complain.

If you would stop thinking in stereotypes and actually read with an open mind, you would not make such obvious mistakes.

 

[aborgman]

+1. It shows a clear lack of understanding the issue at hand and instead making it what someone wants to believe it is... unwarranted complaining. Despite the genius of Randall.

The point of Randall's diatribe isn't that complaining is unwarranted. The point of Randall's diatribe is that if you want things to change, do something about it instead of JUST complaining.

 

[aborgman]

My point is that if you are against idle talk, you should really spend very little time on TB whatever the topic.

Not against - in fact I really like it... I'm also completely aware that it won't actually achieve anything.

 

[Crunktacular]

I find that this discussion always has two sides: a theoretical side, and a realistic side.

I see the validity in both sides of this argument. But people don't eat\sleep\live\play music in a theoretical world. We exist in the real world. It would help if everyone took a few moments to see the world through the other side's eyes.

That was my Dr. Phil moment for today...

 

[Dr. Cheese]

Not against - in fact I really like it... I'm also completely aware that it won't actually achieve anything.

Fair enough, but I have read others posts of yours on other topics, and you seem to have never felt a need to point out idle talk before this topic.

 

[nortonrider]

Get past my color and go read my posts. I actually said that I consider BP a diverse magazine compared to most music magazines. I simply am supporting the right of others to complain.

If you would stop thinking in stereotypes and actually read with an open mind, you would not make such obvious mistakes.

I have read all your posts and had your back right up until I said that somebody should start a black bassplayer magazine and you went on the defensive.

I'm not a racist, and I don't buy into stereotypes. I am just looking for a rational reason for all of the ranting.
Are you just blowing off steam or honestly looking for a way to possibly increase the exposure young black bass players.

 

[Brad Johnson]

Absolutely - but they ain;t doing it for altruistic motives, they're doing it for profit motives.




I tend to assume for profit companies are in the business of maximizing profit.



I'm of the opinion that all for profit magazines are around to make money - all that other suff is just a means to an end.



Not if there was more money to be made by becoming a stand alone magazine. If there wasn't, I'm sure they would have stayed a part of GP.

Maybe you should run that into the ground just a bit more.


here's something you seem to ignore... if that's the sole motive for making BP magazine, what the motive for bothering to read it...

for the profit of their company? Right.


Without a compelling reason to read the mag, which for many like myself isn't simply rehashing the most popular bassists, that potential readership is lost.

 

[Brad Johnson]

I have read all your posts and had your back right up until I said that somebody should start a black bassplayer magazine and you went on the defensive.

I'm not a racist, and I don't buy into stereotypes. I am just looking for a rational reason for all of the ranting.
Are you just blowing off steam or honestly looking for a way to possibly increase the exposure young black bass players.

Because to be blunt, it wasn't a very bright suggestion, clearly with no thought behind it. And if it had actually happened, how far behind would the complaints akin to "why can't we have WET"? be.

 

[Dr. Cheese]

I have read all your posts and had your back right up until I said that somebody should start a black bassplayer magazine and you went on the defensive.

I'm not a racist, and I don't buy into stereotypes. I am just looking for a rational reason for all of the ranting.
Are you just blowing off steam or honestly looking for a way to possibly increase the exposure young black bass players.

Once again, read my threads. I did not start this thread, and I simply said I would like a bit more diversity in BP, a magazine I have subscribed to for nearly twenty years. I also said that boutique makers are smart to use blacks in their ads, and I cited several that do just that.

 

[nortonrider]

mainstream makers do too!
what's your point?

 

[dannster]

Ah but if you live your life like you want the world to be rather than resigning to the world as it is...

So, back to the original subject!........
Get some pictures of these young brothers along with a bio, short interview and maybe a couple Youtube clips and send them to BP. New bad-ass talent is always a good read!

Proactive not Reactive.

I find that this discussion always has two sides: a theoretical side, and a realistic side.

I see the validity in both sides of this argument. But people don't eat\sleep\live\play music in a theoretical world. We exist in the real world. It would help if everyone took a few moments to see the world through the other side's eyes.

That was my Dr. Phil moment for today...

 

[Dr. Cheese]

mainstream makers do too!
what's your point?

My point is that diversity is good business, and it directly applies to the argument that BP articles racial breakdown is makes economic sense. Look at BassPlayer TV, and see how many black people there are at seminars. The percentage is certainly above the 12% that black people represent within the national population. The idea that showing black artists is bad business simply does not hold water. The magazine shouldn't be all black folks all the time, but a few more would be beneficial, not negative.

 

[aborgman]

Fair enough, but I have read others posts of yours on other topics, and you seem to have never felt a need to point out idle talk before this topic.

I'm not pointing out the idle talk - I'm pointing out the futility of idle talk if you want to achieve change.

If everyone just want to complain about their percieved issues with BP, that is all good - it just won't change it.

 

[nortonrider]

Because to be blunt, it wasn't a very bright suggestion, clearly with no thought behind it.

Please tell me what wasn't very bright about it?

The complaints are that there isn't forum showcasing the talents of todays young black players.

My suggestion: Create one!

Sometimes the best solution is the easiest!

Of course, this is unless you think a magazine predominately featuring young black bass players won't appeal to a large enough segment of the market (IE: sell enough copies) to stay afloat.
If that is your conclusion, then I guess that answers the question as to why BassPlayer Magazine doesn't do it.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

The magazine shouldn't be all black folks all the time,

No it shouldn't.

but a few more would be beneficial, not negative.

It really would.

 

[Crunktacular]

BP doesn't exist to make the world a better place, it exists to turn a profit.

True indeed. But does that imply that BP won't make a profit if they started including more feature articles of minority players?

I just don't believe that Bass Player is choosing their who they feature based on racist inclinations in the editorial room. The skew (to the extent it exists) comes from the makeup of the niche they are marketing too.

I don't believe they are doing it on purpose. A lot of racist things are said\done\implied by accident. I can say\do something totally out of line and not mean any harm by it. For example, when Barbara Bush (i think it was Barb) made those comments in the AstroDome about the Hurricane Katrina evacuees being accustomed to sleeping on floors. I don't think she meant it like she said it. But that was waaaayyy outta line when people heard it.

Please realize that most black folks in America have experienced varying degrees of racism all their lives. Some more blatant than others. So our "detectors" can pick it up pretty good. I play a game with my white friends sometimes when we go out. I point out every thing that can be considered a racist act and rate it on a scale of 1-10. It helps them feel what I feel when it happens. And it lets me know when I'm over-reacting to stuff.

I also actively try to get the same feedback from my Hispanic and Muslim friends. I encourage everyone to do the same. If you don't have any friends of a different race or ethnicity, then... shame on you, I guess?

B/c how can you attempt to understand racism in all its various forms if you don't know anybody outside your own race.

 

[aborgman]

here's something you seem to ignore... if that's the sole motive for making BP magazine, what the motive for bothering to read it...

Personally, I don't see one.

I can read fawning gear reviews designed to appease the people buying ads in the Musicians Friend catalog or the manufacturers brag sheets - so I don't need that.

Without a compelling reason to read the mag, which for many like myself isn't simply rehashing the most popular bassists, that potential readership is lost.

I'd say the number of people (in terms of sales dollars) who see "rehashing the most popular bassists" as compelling is orders of magnitude greater than those that don't.

I wouldn't be surprised one bit if the the majority of BP dollars (not subscriptions, but actual profit) comes from people who barely if at all even play bass.

I don't find the magazine compelling, so I don't buy it... but if 10x as many people DO find those topics compelling - they've made the right decisions by not worrying about my opinion.

 

[Crunktacular]

Ah but if you live your life like you want the world to be rather than resigning to the world as it is...

LOL. Nice!!!

So, back to the original subject!........
Get some pictures of these young brothers along with a bio, short interview and maybe a couple Youtube clips and send them to BP. New bad-ass talent is always a good read!

+1,000

 

[aborgman]

The magazine shouldn't be all black folks all the time, but a few more would be beneficial, not negative.

I'd like to believe that - but I also think if it were beneficial TO THEIR BOTTOM LINE they'd be doing it.

Do you believe they are intentionally foregoing profits?

If so, do you think it's because of racism, or just ignorance of a potential revenue source?