Why do we not say 8/8, when we have other signatures with X/8? Many a song is played with 8 8ths to a bar.
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Why note this time signature?
- Thread starter themickster
- Start date
It has to do with the feel..
If you tap your foot to the beat of most western music, you'll tap in quarter notes.
When the denominator is 8, it depends on which variant: simple meter (divided into two equal parts) or compound meter (divided into three equal parts).
If you tap your foot to the beat of most western music, you'll tap in quarter notes.
When the denominator is 8, it depends on which variant: simple meter (divided into two equal parts) or compound meter (divided into three equal parts).
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I'm going to take a stab at this ...
We use:
and when "they" were "designing" music, they didn't want things getting too confusing?
We use:
and when "they" were "designing" music, they didn't want things getting too confusing?
it's not used in the way you're referencing, historically, and i don't do it, but big whup. write 8/8 if you like.
even if you're making 8th notes sound cool, the fundamental beat is likely to be represented better by a quarter note.
think: BPM
The time signature gives you a sense of the FEEL of the song as well as how to count it. There is a difference between 3/4 and 6/8, for example. The weirdest time signature I've seen was 3.5/4, which could have been written as 7/8, but 7/8 usually has a 3+4 or 4+3 feel, which this one didn't have.
The "C" is for "common time" used at a time when chant was evolving into metered music, as shorthand for 4/4 time, which is the time signature for much of western diatonic classical era compositions. The C with a line through it is known as "alla breve," which we loosely interpret as "cut time" or "half time," with the beat on the half note, or minim note, instead of the quarter note, or crotchet. Yes, if the feel of the eighth note and the phrasing are in the music as written, 8/8 is a viable time signature, just not used often.
Why not needlessly complicate things? Sure, let's do it
This ^ The now-familiar boogie-woogie with its rolling bass line in the left hand of the piano player became known as "eight-to-the-bar," but since it was jazz oriented, it was still four primary beats.it's not used in the way you're referencing, historically, and i don't do it, but big whup. write 8/8 if you like.
Even if you're making 8th notes sound cool, the fundamental beat is likely to be represented better by a quarter note.
think: BPM
I've seen 8/8 felt as 3+3+2 before. Of course, it was from a crazy contemporary classical piece, where the time kept shifting between all sorts of X/8's. The conductor gave 2 long beats and a short 3rd beat.
The conductor gave 2 long beats and a short 3rd beat.
Arithmetically you are correct, but 8/8 is probably not that useful for constructing musical ideas. 8/8 implies 8 beats of 1/8 each in the measure, with perhaps an accent on 1 with all others being equal. This is not the same as 4/4, which has distributed accents (1 is strongest, 3 is second, 2 and 4 in equal 3rd - see the chevrons):
Then there are the established conventions. Firstly, time signatures should be a simple as possible without losing meaning - why say 48/64 when you can say 3/4?
Secondly, for the most part*, 8ths are used as the denominator to indicate compound time, that is to say where the beat is, for example, a dotted 1/4. The numerator is usually a multiple of 3. For example, 6/8 and 3/4 both have 6 x 1/8 in the bar. but the pulse is different. In compound time, divide the numerator by 3 to find the number of beats:
* 3/8 is a special case - it is 'simple triple' and is typically, but not always, used to simplify triple-time notation at very high tempi.
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In 4 4 time, the quarter note "gets the beat"
In 8 8 time, the eighth note gets the beat.
Time signatures are not fractions.
In 8 8 time, the eighth note gets the beat.
Time signatures are not fractions.
I've seen these kind of time signatures, with half beats, quite a few times.
It's the same principle, though. 3.5/4 has a different feel than 7/8. quarter note vs eighth note feel.
For 7/8, don't forget 2+5, 5+2, 2+2+3, 2+3+2, 3+2+2. Never seen a 1+6 or 6+1
i had a great theory professor my first year of college, who often had to argue with the pre-college level theory (many non-music majors) about this idea.
his short answer was "it's written this way because that's what it is."
- the implies explanation being that there actually IS a difference. perhaps subtle, and perhaps semantics, but the person who decided it did so for a reason.
8/8 would be very unusual. in a bar of 4/4, obviously that can be broken down into 8ths. but, that is truthfully a bar of 4/4 counted as 8ths.
it's not particularly important that you fully grasp the idea other than trusting that there is a difference and if you really needed to know it'll become more clear with experience.
analyzing pieces written as 3/4 vs 3/8 will be a good into to the concept i think. even ones played at the same tempo. you could argue it may be written the other way. but, the way it's written often will imply a feel or convey something to the musician.
it can be confusing to hear other musicians say "nah just trust me, this is it." but it takes a bit of experience, specifically with written music, before it naturally becomes more clear.
his short answer was "it's written this way because that's what it is."
- the implies explanation being that there actually IS a difference. perhaps subtle, and perhaps semantics, but the person who decided it did so for a reason.
8/8 would be very unusual. in a bar of 4/4, obviously that can be broken down into 8ths. but, that is truthfully a bar of 4/4 counted as 8ths.
it's not particularly important that you fully grasp the idea other than trusting that there is a difference and if you really needed to know it'll become more clear with experience.
analyzing pieces written as 3/4 vs 3/8 will be a good into to the concept i think. even ones played at the same tempo. you could argue it may be written the other way. but, the way it's written often will imply a feel or convey something to the musician.
it can be confusing to hear other musicians say "nah just trust me, this is it." but it takes a bit of experience, specifically with written music, before it naturally becomes more clear.
I'd like to know more. Please PM me with it.
There's also:I've seen these kind of time signatures, with half beats, quite a few times.
It's the same principle, though. 3.5/4 has a different feel than 7/8. quarter note vs eighth note feel.
For 7/8, don't forget 2+5, 5+2, 2+2+3, 2+3+2, 3+2+2. Never seen a 1+6 or 6+1
11/8 - three bars of 3/4, one of 2/4;
13/8 - three bars of 3/4, one of 4/4. Golden Brown has that between verses.
I'm with you. I had a discussion with a person who used a DAW. He insisted that it was ok to have a time signature such as 5 7 because he divided his measures into 7 equal parts.
Then he'd write his parts out with a 5 7 "time signature". SMH
Time signatures are not fractions.
Turnaround
Commercial User
5 7 means that the bar has 5 beats and the 7th note counts as 1 beat. Now, how to write a 7th note.......
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