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Why the hate on JHS?

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The #1 principle of libertarianism is a free market economy. If you don't believe in a free market economy, then I'd choose a different label to be "closest" to.

It's akin to saying, "I'm closer to a Christian than anything, but I don't believe in Jesus."

I never said I didn't support a free market economy. I just think it's poopy how companies like JHS take advantage of it and lie to consumers like so many other companies in a free market economy.

Again the point was missed. That's three times in a row man. You are killing it!
 
You ignore the market distortions that people are complaining about, and how those complaints are in fact the vehicle of a market correction. If a company overstates the quality of their product, that information distorts the market if accepted. It is precisely through "whining" as you call it that the market can correct itself as potential customers learn that the value of the product is less than advertised. A further market distortion is added when a company copies the intellectual property of another. Allowing this practice to stand will discourage innovation because investment in research and product development will be less attractive when other companies can copy designs and reap the profits of design and research without doing any of it themselves.
That said, I don't want the government regulating every exaggerated advertisement, and perhaps the designs JHS is accused of ripping off weren't properly protected by intellectual property laws. Thus, if bad actors in the market aren't to be corrected by government intervention, they must be addressed through private means, such as warning other potential customers of the company's wrongdoing.

Finally a response with some depth and thought! Thanks for that.

I see where you are coming from and agree with much of what you say. Where we separate is the consequences of letting intellectual property forgery stand. I don't believe that increased copying will stifle market innovations. If anything, it will open the door for other innovators who actually have original ideas and make their products stand alone. Just a thought.
 
I never said I didn't support a free market economy. I just think it's ****** how companies like JHS take advantage of it and lie to consumers like so many other companies in a free market economy.

Again the point was missed. That's three times in a row man. You are killing it!

Not sure what you mean and why you are attempting to belittle me. Perhaps proposing a solution to your perceived problem would help me see where you are coming from. You quoted my post and said that it was "the problem." My entire post was in reference to the advantages of a free market economy. It's fine that you think their pedals are a rip off and over-priced. You also have the freedom to yell that from atop a mountain. But if folks choose to ignore you and JHS sells 25,000 pedals this year, then the market base has spoken. This is the semi-free market economy in which we live.

Lastly, you are nothing close to a libertarian, which is indicative through your posts.
 
Actually, a lot of words don't mean what people think they mean. Their definitions have bene distorted a long time ago.

That's a bit of a philosophical reach there don't you think? We are talking about the meaning of a single word used to describe an association of people that have a very specific set of political views. The definition of the word is not up for debate. Perhaps some principles are, but not the core values. A free market economy is a libertarian value that NO libertarian would reject.
 
I never said I didn't support a free market economy. I just think it's ****** how companies like JHS take advantage of it and lie to consumers like so many other companies in a free market economy.

A free market is an econ 101 straw man, not a real thing. It is a part of a system of belief that posits capitalism as a natural human expression and not a societal construct. Don't push your beliefs of how other people should act on them, cause that sucks.

Not sure how much I care about all this JHS stuff. Tried a Pandamonium before I heard about this all - it was ok, it sounded more or less like a mammoth and a generic dirty pre. Sorta wondering if/how companies that push JHS, like CME, should react.
 
My experience has been this: they are located in a redneck-ish suburb(once an outer burg that eventually got swallowed up by sprawl)of my hometown. They started as a neighborhood instrument store, long after I moved away, and this had closed before I had to go back to the area on a regular basis for family matters. They had a listing on Craig's for amps/cabs that were left over from the retail days. At that time, I was unaware of all these allegations of swiping designs, or even of their supposed religious bent. I went out there to buy a speaker, and even though I had made an appointment, there was this vibe of uptightness of the "are you supposed to be here?" variety. The assembly room, while not exactly Waco compound weird, still had an aura of humorlessness, surprising for a bunch of 20-something workers. Now, it IS a very small operation, so I would imagine that economy of scale dictates the relatively high price tags, but they do seem to move a lot of units. On a second sale, which was thru Ebay, I went out to pick up a fairly esoteric EHX pedal, killer deal on a barely used item. As I was there, just to break the ice a bit, I was joking around, and made a crack about why Josh had a competitor's pedal and was selling it so quickly, and was he reverse engineering it. I might as well had been Jeff Foxworthy making an appearance at Harlem's Apollo Theater. Before you could say "lighten up, Francis", things got a bit terse. Whatever. Did the deal, and I was outta there. My question is this: has any other pedal building entity raised a stink about JHS cloning THEIR stuff, or is the Devi situation isolated? If there have been others calling out JHS, and JHS did not retaliate, was JHS singling out Devi not only for saying "hey, wait just a minute here", but also for her sexual orientation and lifestyle choices, which usually gets under the skin of fundamentalists. I know that's a big assumption on my part, but it's anyone's guess. Religion makes people weird, in my book.
 
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Not sure what you mean and why you are attempting to belittle me. Perhaps proposing a solution to your perceived problem would help me see where you are coming from. You quoted my post and said that it was "the problem." My entire post was in reference to the advantages of a free market economy. It's fine that you think their pedals are a rip off and over-priced. You also have the freedom to yell that from atop a mountain. But if folks choose to ignore you and JHS sells 25,000 pedals this year, then the market base has spoken. This is the semi-free market economy in which we live.

Lastly, you are nothing close to a libertarian, which is indicative through your posts.

Ok man. I said you missed the point because I wasn't arguing the advantages of a free market economy. But more the attitude of, because it's a free market economy I'm going to get rid of all morals and values of being a decent human and lie to my customers. Steel from my competitors and charge double the price. I am not saying the government should come in and shut them down. I am saying people as a whole don't have to be sh*t stains to each other. So as a somewhat libertarian in order to believe in a free market economy one also has to believe in being a terrible person? I quoted your post because you seemed to endorse that kind of attitude. You know, being a sh*t stain. :)
 
That's a bit of a philosophical reach there don't you think? We are talking about the meaning of a single word used to describe an association of people that have a very specific set of political views. The definition of the word is not up for debate. Perhaps some principles are, but not the core values. A free market economy is a libertarian value that NO libertarian would reject.


Come on! That's not a reach. The definition of "Conservative" has changed so much in the last 50 years in your country. And, let's try not to be super American centric for a minute, Conservative, Liberal, Libertarian, Socialist means absolutely different things in Canada, Europe, or the US. Even though they come from a single point (even though that point is more of an area) in history.

People project ideals on a label, does not mean everyone does, does not meant that the consensus on what gets projected on what label was always the same.
 
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So as a somewhat libertarian in order to believe in a free market economy one also has to believe in being a terrible person? I quoted your post because you seemed to endorse that kind of attitude.

Nope. I am saying that in a free market economy where folks vote with their dollars, companies that act that way will eventually fail. If they don't fail, then there is usually another side to the story.

I personally don't know much about the allegations of JHS. Nor do I follow the "political boutique pedal world."

I would just warn certain advocates of JHS's demise to choose their words and arguments carefully. Sometimes a passionate argument can turn into a contrary situation. You may be doing more good for them then harm. It all goes back to the "there is no bad publicity" argument. It's easy to get riled up with your like-minded com padres on an internet forum. Just make sure that your positions are firmly rooted in facts and these facts are displayed in a concise and relevant manner. There are many more people who read these threads than who post. Most of them are not even members of this forum. I know a few people who would read some of these bashing threads and it would make them want to go out and buy a JHS pedal even more.

Perhaps I'm playing devils advocate, but we all know that threads need that. It's just my opinion, take it or leave it.

And I am personally by no means a shitstain :) I am a man of character and honesty.
 
This is the JHS 808
upload_2015-2-16_12-30-2.jpeg
and here is the ibanez tube screamer, he uses the same color, too funny
upload_2015-2-16_12-30-47.jpeg
 
Come on! That's not a reach. The definition of "Conservative" has changed so much in the last 50 years in your country. And, let's try not to be super American centric for a minute, Conservative, Liberal, Libertarian, Socialist means absolutely different things in Canada, Europe, or the US. Even though they come from a single point (even though that point is more of an area) in history.

People project ideals on a label, does not mean everyone does, does not meant that the consensus on what gets projected on what label was always the same.


"Conservative" is not a party. Libertarian is. You cannot vote for the "Conservative" party here in America when you hit the ballot box. Libertarian yes.

And yes, words do change meaning and evolve over time. That is certain. Please assume that the words that I am referring to are meant to be interpreted with their most current definition and not one from the past or future lol.
 
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"Conservative" is not a party. Libertarian is. You cannot vote for the "Conservative" party here in America when you hit the ballot box. Libertarian yes.

And yes, words do change meaning and evolve over time. That is certain. Please assume that the words that I am referring to are meant to be interpreted with their most current definition and not one from the past of future lol.

"LOL?" Ok, you are missing the point ENTIRELY. you are referring the the definition YOU subscribe to now. Not the definition that somebody else subscribes to now. And, Libertarian is not just a party, it's also an ideology.

Also, depending on where you vote...

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

LOL indeed...
 
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