Win some, Lose some.

[soitainly]

I understand why you would feel a bit put off by learning songs and not keeping the gig, but in the end a band has to do what's best long term. If you were only subbing, then maybe they should give you some compensation for your time, but I wouldn't burn any bridges.

I was asked to sub for an important gig with some friends once when in reality they were looking for a permanent replacement. When they found someone permanent I gracefully bowed out, I learned some songs, it was a bit of work, but what the heck, I like music so learning songs isn't a bad thing.

 

[bluewine]

I want to support the artist who wrote the songs, I don't mind paying for the songs. It's all good.

How do you know the artist is getting the money?

Blue

 

[mellowinman]

Only thing I have to say to you is this:

Say you're in a band with a decent following in a city. You've spend thousands of dollars and hours recording your first album.

You release it only to have one person buy it then burn it and give it to all his friends. They in turn burn it and give it to theirs and so on and so forth.

As a band trying to make it, especially as a young band with not much income. That would piss me right off.

The way I do it is I torrent the album. If I like more than 2 songs then on my next paycheck I buy the CD copy.

If you absolutely insist on torrenting 100% then at least go see the band live, buy a t-shirt, tell your friends about them. Do SOMETHING in exchange for that free CD.

If you're doing so well that bands are covering your songs, it is unlikely that this scenario exists.

 

[mellowinman]

Sure...if you don't mind exposing your comuter to viruses.

There's a new invention that I use for songs I need to learn but would never buy. It's called Youtube.

I have a new invention, too.

It's called Kaspersky.

 

[guy n. cognito]

If you're doing so well that bands are covering your songs, it is unlikely that this scenario exists.

This scenario is playing out with such regularity that it is actually changing the record industry as a whole. There have been a number of interesting articles written on the topic that can be found through google.

 

[RustyAxe]

It's not stealing. It's file sharing. And it's not for consumer consumption. It's to learn to play the song.

No, it's stealing intellectual property. Justify it to yourself, but I won't do it.

Do you pay BMI and ASCAP every time you play somebody's COPYRIGHTED songs?

Not necessary. Do you know how copyright law works and what it covers? The performer only has to take reasonable steps to be sure the venue has appropriate licenses from ASCAP, BMI, etc.

I just love the selective morality lectures we get on this and other internet sites.

No lecture here. Just pointing out facts.

If you lend me your Aerosmith CD, and I copy it, did I steal music? Should I be prosecuted?

Yes, you did. Prosecuted? If you did it for profit (ie, started rippin' them for your friends) ... sure.

Should you, also, for lending it to me?

Nope.

What if you lend it to me, and I don't copy it, but I commit all the songs to memory? Did I steal it then?

Nope, of course not. Lame argument, IMO.

It's easy to justify yourself stealing others' intellectual property when you don't actually have a horse of your own in the race.

 

[Mr L]

If you're doing so well that bands are covering your songs, it is unlikely that this scenario exists.

But if someone downloads songs with that reasoning then what's to stop them from downloading songs from a startup band?

Only band I torrented and didn't feel bad about was the new GnR album, no way am I giving Axl rose more money for being a huge a**

 

[mellowinman]

But if someone downloads songs with that reasoning then what's to stop them from downloading songs from a startup band?

Only band I torrented and didn't feel bad about was the new GnR album, no way am I giving Axl rose more money for being a huge a**

They call that last bit "selective justification."

I'm quite a moral person, and I'm very happy with the choices I make. Apparently, learning the song off of YouTube is OK, but downloading it via torrent, so I can play it through my system as an mp3 crosses an imaginary line that someone arbitrarily imposed on me.

Luckily, no one lives in my head but me, so I'll probably be OK.



As to the OP, I can see not being happy about spending money that got wasted, and that's why I made the suggestion. IT was an attempt to be HELPFUL, something you judgmental people are NOT being.

As to wasting his time learning songs, it's never a waste of time to learn something.

I always try pointing that out to people. As musicians, we should learn all we can, and eat it up.

By the way, I have written over 350 songs, and if anyone would like to steal some of my intellectual property, have at it. If you make enough money at it, first I'll sue you, and then, if I'm successful, I'll THANK YOU, because I never could sell any of it.

 

[DiabolusInMusic]

Only thing I have to say to you is this:

Say you're in a band with a decent following in a city. You've spend thousands of dollars and hours recording your first album.

You release it only to have one person buy it then burn it and give it to all his friends. They in turn burn it and give it to theirs and so on and so forth.

As a band trying to make it, especially as a young band with not much income. That would piss me right off.

The way I do it is I torrent the album. If I like more than 2 songs then on my next paycheck I buy the CD copy.

If you absolutely insist on torrenting 100% then at least go see the band live, buy a t-shirt, tell your friends about them. Do SOMETHING in exchange for that free CD.

If a band thinks they are going to make money selling albums in they are sorely mistaken. You make money selling tickets and merch and the shows, that is where the bread and butter lies. Record companies make money off albums, not artists.

Quite frankly, start up bands should be the most willing to "share" their music with others. 1 record sale could lead to 1000's of people hearing your music in parts of the world you would never have though possible even though they didn't pay for it. If a band wants my money they can bring their act to my front door, otherwise I will download their record. For the record I do buy albums I find fantastic, the problem is their are less and less of those records each year (for me).

 

[SBassman]

It's not stealing. It's file sharing.

Quick - somebody grab this for a sig.

That's gold, Jerry. Gold!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CF7OnW4XDck

 

[abemo]

To the OP: that sucks, but its a lot better than getting a sub gig with a band that doesn't have their stuff together. When you spend all the time and effort learning a set, then show up to the gig only to be told that they're changinh the set, and they want to go over some new material in the parking lot, now that really sucks. Sounds like these guys are a bit wishy-washy, so maybe its best.

As for downloading, record companies make money off albums. Bands need some sales so they don't go into major debt, but if a band is big enough to profit on albums, they're doing just fine. Bands make money off concerts and merch, the music is a marketing tool. That's why I want my music downloaded as much as possible, each download is another person and their friends possibly coming to a show. That said, I can't fault a band or musician for trying to protect all of their revenue streams rather than just the biggest. For instance, a restaurant makes most profit on drink sales, but that's no reason to steal the food.