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Wooten does it again

Discussion in 'General Instruction [BG]' started by spark_chaser, Nov 20, 2008.


  1. OldBluesGuy

    OldBluesGuy

    Aug 14, 2008
    Enfield, CT
    Just think what you might be able to accomplish if you put the same amount of energy into learning and playing.

    :rollno:
     
  2. Man, I pegged that troll as both of them as soon as they started their little back and forth feud.

    Hope you enjoyed Thanksgiving break, kids.
     
  3. JKT

    JKT

    Apr 30, 2007
    Buffalo NY
    Endorsing Artist: Barker Basses
    I have been gone for a few days. I went back over this thread.

    I don't see the crazy, irritating posts made by zanz anymore, but people quoting him. what up with that?

    JKT
     
  4. BassSlave

    BassSlave

    Mar 2, 2006
    Chicago via Park Forest IL
    Endorsing artist: Sadowsky Basses & Dean Markley Strings
    I noticed that too_On one post I quoted him on he went back and edited out his sarcastic remarks. It looks like he starts these conversations and then retracts his statements later.


     
  5. I guess that was part of the plan. Trash the thread then delete everything you wrote. At one point the thread was closed - I guess by the mods? Apparently it was opened up again.

    I've been on the internet for a long time and I still don't understand trolls. :rollno:

    It was a good thread. Anyone care to start it up again? I finished watching the whole thing and have been going back over parts again. I even had a small rant at my band mates about our lack of a decent groove as a band. ("You guys are playing like a bunch of Presbyterians!") :smug:

    Cindy
     
  6. JKT

    JKT

    Apr 30, 2007
    Buffalo NY
    Endorsing Artist: Barker Basses
    In addition, apparently he was posting under another name and so discussing with himself? Do I have that right? :confused:
     
  7. Yes, he was posting as both Zanz and Nutzmozio and flaming himself. Anyway he is (they are?) gone now and we can return to our regularly scheduled program.

    Cindy
     
  8. JKT

    JKT

    Apr 30, 2007
    Buffalo NY
    Endorsing Artist: Barker Basses
    As to keeping the thread going, it was an interesting thread sans crazy annoying guy.

    I have benefitted greatly from Victors take on playing, technique, and oulook on life and music in general. I have wanted to keep going but have been stalled for a year with a long-term nerve related problem in my right arm and hand.
    I feel as though it is all I can do to keep playing at the level that I'm at which is somewhat lower than where I was. I have stayed in the game by virtue of playing it safe, rarely soloing, and having very supportive bandmates. Victors approaches have come in very handy in a very challanging time in my career. Akin to a fear of rejection, I am frankly afraid to look ahead too far and see what else it is that I can't do :meh:
     
  9. I've worked on a computer all day for years and have caused all manner of problems with my right arm because of that. Also, I had probably lost focus in my bass playing by spending too much time on trying to learn "pyrotechnics" which was also causing problems with my hand/wrist/arm. Watching the video has made me reconsider this, and when the "Mediocre Bassist Club" thread started I realized that having a good solid groove is so much more important than being able to impress people with flash - and it seems to actually help my body rather than hurting it. I've programmed a bunch of metronome-type patterns into my drum machine and have been practicing those. I've also been recording some of my practices (which has been REALLY depressing). But at least now I know where the problems are and have been working on them and I've been seeing improvement and it's showing up in my playing with the band.

    If you go to Carol Kaye's website, she talks a lot about hand/arm health. Apparently she had to stop working for a long time in the 70's because of problems with her left hand/arm. I sure hope you're able to continue playing.

    Cindy
     
  10. Doug Hodges

    Doug Hodges

    Sep 12, 2008
    Had to order this after reading posts
    Looking so forward to getting it!!!
     
  11. tfmbass

    tfmbass

    Dec 13, 2006
    Orlando,Fl
    +1 CindyB. That was the biggest message I got from the video was focusing on the groove.
    Anthony's little section was amazing! I have been working on the "e's and a's".
    It is really cool to hear a top notch bassist talk about what he does when he is at home practicing.
     
  12. rosanne

    rosanne

    Sep 30, 2004
    SF Bay Area
    CindyB I PM'ed you.
     
  13. This shows what a terrible person I am, but it really made me feel better to hear those awesome students (who are all better than I'll ever be) making timing mistakes! :)

    Cindy
     
  14. tfmbass

    tfmbass

    Dec 13, 2006
    Orlando,Fl
    Some of those guys were good, but the Asian guy seemed very lost for the duration of the video. He has a sweet bass!
     
  15. Hmmm, i thought that the 'Asian Guy' had a funkier feel, funkier sounding than Dave (the guy with the 4 string Warwick thumb neck through) when they were syncopating on catching the 'e' of a beat. I also felt that the 'Asian guy's' fund of knowledge was deeper than Dave's, not as deep as Joe's, the guy in the back with the $10,000 Anthony Jackson Fodera. And this is not intending to compare one student against the other, but a slight contrast.

    Watching the video reinforced to me, that, given the exact same instructions, we can all play the exact same thing and our individual feel, will always come to the fore. Rarely will 2 feels ever be identical.

    Also, to me, this video is targeted at students that can already play and is intened to be supplemental to your fund of knowledge. The bulk of this video is presented for the intermediate student.

    To me, it's only on Anthony's segment, that the viewer that's not ready for Victors advanced observations, can get concrete instruction on material that you can physically work at, to first of all identify what a groove is (subdividing & tageting the e & uh of a 16th, loosely worded) & developing a program to cultivate grooves, which is 90% of what i would ever expect to walk away with, from a Groove Workshop.

    Anthony is a gifted educator and i can only hope his star continues to rise, as word of this dvd spreads. Anthony alone, made that whole dvd worthwhile!
     
  16. BassSlave

    BassSlave

    Mar 2, 2006
    Chicago via Park Forest IL
    Endorsing artist: Sadowsky Basses & Dean Markley Strings
    For me, Anthony's segment only reviewed material and concepts that I have been working on for as long as I can recall. Subdivision is a part of rhythmic training that you will naturally encounter when you seriously take up reading music or counting rhythms, even for those who play by ear. My first music instructor always had me to count every measure using the correct subdivision. Like Victor stated in the video, they were only touching on the subject and introduced this concept with hope that the end user would explore on his own. Every groove I play or come up with I will start on different beats of the measure to see what it feels like and most drummers who know me always asks "where is the one at?" when I start a groove because they have experienced a groove I've started thinking it was a different groove. I've learned to simply count the drummer in and then begin to play a displaced groove and he would then know how to interpret the feel and where the "one" is. Sometimes later in the groove all it takes is a head nod or telling the drummer to lets put the whole groove on the "one" or play it on the "up beat" which means to play it on the "ands" for me. I also can audibly tell him to play the groove on the "e' or the "uh" and this is not new material or concepts for most of the people I play with. The video still has merit and good training practices and I still give credit to Wooten who, on Anthony's segment, questioned to play the exercise starting the groove on each beat. Anthony told him that he would start the groove on the pops, and then on the hammer-ons, and then on the left hand ghost notes. However if you take Vic's suggestion and try it either with a metronome or counting out loud and just displace the groove by a beat or shift it over by a 16th note, you will find a wealth of information and how which grooves respond better to which "modes of rhythm". For instance, if the groove pattern is a simple even eighth notes with not many sixteenths, the better sounding displacements would be on the upbeats, or the "an"s of beats 1 2 3 and 4 and if the groove has many sixteenths than that will be easier to shift to any of the four sub-beats of 1 2 3 and 4. For me, when using this concept in conjunction with reading exercises or writing my own patterns out that I have come up with helps in sight-reading and just reading rhythms in general.
     
  17. greenboy

    greenboy

    Dec 18, 2000
    remote mountain cabin Montana
    greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
    [​IMG]

    Take this in the manner it's intended. You are saying something good but most people find it a lot easier to digest if you make it more readable.
     
  18. BassSlave

    BassSlave

    Mar 2, 2006
    Chicago via Park Forest IL
    Endorsing artist: Sadowsky Basses & Dean Markley Strings
    No problem and I thank you for your comment. It reminds me of when Prince was asked the question "what is funk?" or to explain what funk is. He stated that if you can explain it..."it ain't funky". Victor Wooten also mentions this in the video. I know that statement pertains to funk and not the rhythm example I posted, but some things are easier to just play and hear and feel than to explain and music is one of those things for me. I find many of the concepts of music are esoteric in meaning and has more than one meaning or viewpoint so I am just encouraging people to listen to their inner voice when applying any musical principal.

     
  19. For me, Anthony Wellington's visual representation of a timeline, cut out much confusion and left nothing to be misinterpreted, for those of us that don't practice reading rhythmn's regulary.

    Syncopation, or to synocopate, is the sprinkling in of notes that will occur on the 'e' & 'uh' of a beat, which in turn will make whatever you play, instantly have some sort of flavor to it, imo.

    For this to work though, there has to be a steady pulse, either in your mind, with a metronome, with a drummer, drum machine, using your foot to keep the pulse going, etc. There has to be a pulse and you have to keep track of it in order to subdivide.

    It really is a basic, fundamental idea, but notice how many of those students (that are paying $25,000 to $35,000 a year) to study at the Bass Collective, that couldn't grasp the concept right away.

    So, you are saying that The Bass Collective will enroll anyone, so long as you got confetti? ($) How do you make it all the way up there to study & cannot subdivide? You playing Jaco harmonics and other wierd stuff, but can't divide a 16th, lol?

    Not a diss, but is it really so basic of a principle to eveyone? It isn't. Some of us slipped through the cracks evidently, but bring it to our attention & teaching us how to fish and whalla.

    Give me a pulse, move out my way & thank me later!

    Kirk, 'The Carribean guy' had no problem subdividing the 16th's. None that i can see, but Kirks background is firmly rooted in 'Ethnic' music, which having a firm grasp on subdivisions is integral to the genre.
     
  20. If i was to arrange the video in a chronological order, Anthony's teaching segment should've been the very first lesson they delved into, as whenever Victor debuted his teaching segment by segwaying into a groove, then the lesson itself, Anthony could've charted for us the main melody of what Victor had just played (not the whole thing, just the main melody of it) to reinforce dividing 16th's and demonstrate how this method (subdividing) can be useful for transcribing basslines, as well as melodies, in addition to creating a groove from scratch, imo.
     

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