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Zoom B3 As Preamp

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#341
We have an interesting experiment going on over at the MS-60B thread:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f36/zoom-ms-60b-announced-last-972567/

For whatever reason, the new stompbox has reached Canadian retail ahead of the States. One of the guys is trying out my MS-60B patches on his B3, to see if the M Comp, Opt Comp and 160 Comp models correspond between the two boxes.

If they do, then it may be possible to manually translate other B3 settings over to the MS-60B. I can't wait to try out some tasty B3 user patches on my new toy!
 
#342
steve_rolfeca said:
We have an interesting experiment going on over at the MS-60B thread:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f36/zoom-ms-60b-announced-last-972567/

For whatever reason, the new stompbox has reached Canadian retail ahead of the States. One of the guys is trying out my MS-60B patches on his B3, to see if the M Comp, Opt Comp and 160 Comp models correspond between the two boxes.

If they do, then it may be possible to manually translate other B3 settings over to the MS-60B. I can't wait to try out some tasty B3 user patches on my new toy!
Click to expand...

I am fairly confident that the DSP engine and modeling algorithms in the MS-60B are the exact same as in the B3 (with simply less as many varieties.) With this said, I am extremely excited to learn if I am correct when I am able to purchase an MS-60B here in the USA.

Cheers!
 
#343
Just a quick post to say thanks, CharlieC. I just bought a B3, mostly just to have some fun with but after pouring through this thread and your companion web page, I'm truly excited about what I may accomplish with the B3. Terrific info here! I look forward to contributing to this thread in the near future. Thanks again for putting this together!
 
#345
A Strohman said:
Just a quick post to say thanks, CharlieC. I just bought a B3, mostly just to have some fun with but after pouring through this thread and your companion web page, I'm truly excited about what I may accomplish with the B3. Terrific info here! I look forward to contributing to this thread in the near future. Thanks again for putting this together!
Click to expand...

Thanks and enjoy the ride! Lots of good folks on this thread at your service ;)

Noddy Boulder said:
Yes, big thanks. I am now considering getting a power amp and running it with the B3. Never used power amp set up seems a bit daunting.
Click to expand...

Take the plunge on a basic power amp and you may never look back, but keep your receipt handy just in case! :D
 
#346
Two Heads Better Than One

Even if one does not have a stand-alone power amp, any standard bass head with EFFECT RETURN or POWER AMP IN jacks could be used to provide the same experience.

The benefit of this is actually two-fold, as should a problem arise with the B3, you then have the bass head to plug into and complete the gig.

I myself take advantage of this using my SVT-7 PRO, which also happens to feature an FX MIX knob that I will disclose the interesting benefit of in a future post.

Cheers!
 
#347
The thing that I discovered while trying to patch into the effects loop directly is that the wet/dry on my amp is actually dry/wetish. There is no 100% through the loop and therefore the volume was considerably lower than I would have hoped.

I don't know how common this is, or if it's unique to my amp head.
 
#348
jovino said:
The thing that I discovered while trying to patch into the effects loop directly is that the wet/dry on my amp is actually dry/wetish. There is no 100% through the loop and therefore the volume was considerably lower than I would have hoped.

I don't know how common this is, or if it's unique to my amp head.
Click to expand...

Effect loop functionality is specific to the make/model of the amplifier

Which amp are you using?
 
#350
jovino said:
I have a Yorkville Bassmaster xs800h. I get between 50%-70% wet through the effect loop.

Killer head though. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info!

I pulled the user manual for your particular model amp and I cannot see why one could not achieve a 100% wet mix using the EFT RTN jack on the rear in conjunction with the Effects Return knob on the front turned fully clockwise

http://traynoramps.com/downloads/ownersman/omxs800h.pdf

Regardless, now knowing that your amp also features an AMP IN jack on the rear, I would suggest use of that input instead of EFT RTN

Interestingly, I can see from the manual's Block Diagram page that use of the AMP IN jack is governed by the amp's front panel MASTER and Bass Resonance knobs. This is unusual to me as the AMP IN jacks I have seen on other bass amps generally bypass all front panel functionality. One would need to keep this in mind when feeding the XS800H from its AMP IN jack so that the appropriate settings can be made to the MASTER and Bass Resonance knobs (else volume level and bass response of the amp's power section could be unknowingly affected.)

Cheers!
 
#351
I'll have to peek at the back again because I didn't notice an Amp In jack. If so, that would be rad. :)

The master volume is just for the power amp section, so that kinda makes sense. The resonance control* I thought was part of the preamp, so that's news to me.

Thanks for looking into this. I appreciate it.:)


*resonance control seems to be a high-pass filter of some sort, but it's unclear from the documentation what it does exactly. All I know is that tight soumds best, and loose has less transformer emf noise. Funny that. :)
 
#353
I am looking at a QSC 2450 power amp at the moment going cheap in an auction. Closes tonight so fingers crossed.

I am using a Little Mark III at the moment. You mentioned that a bass head can be used if it has an effects loop. Can the LMIII do this? It has an effects loop but I do not use it as you can't tune and mute! I think that is becasue it is in parallel.
 
#354
Noddy Boulder said:
I am looking at a QSC 2450 power amp at the moment going cheap in an auction. Closes tonight so fingers crossed.

I am using a Little Mark III at the moment. You mentioned that a bass head can be used if it has an effects loop. Can the LMIII do this? It has an effects loop but I do not use it as you can't tune and mute! I think that is becasue it is in parallel.
Click to expand...

Good luck on the auction!

The Little Mark III manual I downloaded shows that a RETURN EFFECT jack exists on the rear of the amp and it appears that there is no POWER AMP IN jack

Invalid Link Removed

Unfortunately, since there was no block diagram included in the manual, nor do I have any experience with that amp, I cannot give you more info on how to best interface the B3 with it

Cheers!
 
#355
Noddy Boulder said:
I am using a Little Mark III at the moment. You mentioned that a bass head can be used if it has an effects loop. Can the LMIII do this? It has an effects loop but I do not use it as you can't tune and mute! I think that is becasue it is in parallel.
Click to expand...

Most people using a box like the B3 in that situation, are trying to bypass the amp's built-in preamp. Their signal chain would be bass > B3 > effects return or amp in jack > cab. There wouldn't be anything plugged into the amp's input jack.

In that situation, on most amps the mute, gain and tone controls would no longer affect your signal. The master volume might or might not, depending on how the amp is configured.
 
#356
CharlieC said:
... snip ...
Unfortunately, since there was no block diagram included in the manual, nor do I have any experience with that amp, I cannot give you more info on how to best interface the B3 with it
... snip ...
Click to expand...

Indeed. It seems, however, that amp has a fixed parallel use of the effects loop only and a modification would be required to change this, cf. Invalid Link Removed. In this case I would go into the amp the ordinary way and set it as flat as possible. Two preamps in series shouldn't be that big a problem I would guess.
 
#357
Just thought I'd share my set-up. I am using the B3 into the side chain send/return jacks of my Eden Navigator pre-amp. Then I can control the wet/dry mix on the front pannel of the preamp. With any patch in place, I can get that sound or the beautiful Eden sound, or anywhere in between without adjusting the B3. I have the output from the preamp going into my Carvin combo (BRX800) with the eq set as CharlieC suggested (making a mp3 sound good). I love the sound on stage. Now that I'm comfortable with that, I plan on running DI out of the Navigator to the FOH system. I believe my wet/dry mix will go to the FOH on the DI.
 
#358
Carvinite said:
Just thought I'd share my set-up. I am using the B3 into the side chain send/return jacks of my Eden Navigator pre-amp. Then I can control the wet/dry mix on the front pannel of the preamp. With any patch in place, I can get that sound or the beautiful Eden sound, or anywhere in between without adjusting the B3. I have the output from the preamp going into my Carvin combo (BRX800) with the eq set as CharlieC suggested (making a mp3 sound good). I love the sound on stage. Now that I'm comfortable with that, I plan on running DI out of the Navigator to the FOH system. I believe my wet/dry mix will go to the FOH on the DI.
Click to expand...

Way to go on your integration of the B3 via the effects loop with intent to blend!

Your DI to FOH should sound equally fantastic under that operating model

Cheers!
 
#359
I run my B3 into a powered PA cab at my guitar player's place or into the input of my AI Clarus into a fEarful 12/6 cabinet. The Clarus & fEarful rig is a little darker and fatter but I haven't bothered tweaking my current patches for specific rigs yet. It sounds great through my headphones as well.
 
#360
Swift713 said:
I run my B3 into a powered PA cab at my guitar player's place or into the input of my AI Clarus into a fEarful 12/6 cabinet. The Clarus & fEarful rig is a little darker and fatter but I haven't bothered tweaking my current patches for specific rigs yet. It sounds great through my headphones as well.
Click to expand...

Versatility is one of the B3's major strengths and it sounds like you've got things well-covered with those options :bassist:
 
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