Weight?
sorry, not for sale, but the weight has increased significantly recently
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30 song live audition - Not much fun for me
- Thread starter oldrocker
- Start date
sorry, not for sale, but the weight has increased significantly recently
Yup, here in the Bay Area, restaurant/bars and bars are open. Have been since July iirc.
If you've ever looked at Steve Vai's intensive workout, he says "know every not on the next, cold". Good advice if you want to be a gigging musician.
Learn the last two songs and let them know that you are ready for the next gig.
You already did the work, you may as well get some return on your investment, while you wait for something better.
They may be more friendly the next time, because you will be one of the few bassist to come back.
They may even pay more than $60 after this Covid thing.
You already did the work, you may as well get some return on your investment, while you wait for something better.
They may be more friendly the next time, because you will be one of the few bassist to come back.
They may even pay more than $60 after this Covid thing.
OP back - thanks everyone.
This was not a sub situation as some have mentioned. This was an expectation of joining a band that needs a bass player. I'm not made out to be a sub type player. My main motivation to play is for enjoyment and to make good music with other players. I would never have put in this type of effort for a 1 off $60 gig.
I do have a positive history of being able to learn set lists at pretty short notice. For the last band I was in, similar situation they contact me through CL - they have a show in 3 weeks and no bass player. With these guys though, we were able to get a couple of rehearsals in and they were able to provide a CD with them playing most of the songs from a previous show.
These guys were supportive and appreciative. The show went pretty well, a few rough spots. I was asked back and played many good shows with them for 4 years until the band dissolved when the singer and drummer moved out of state.
This was not a sub situation as some have mentioned. This was an expectation of joining a band that needs a bass player. I'm not made out to be a sub type player. My main motivation to play is for enjoyment and to make good music with other players. I would never have put in this type of effort for a 1 off $60 gig.
I do have a positive history of being able to learn set lists at pretty short notice. For the last band I was in, similar situation they contact me through CL - they have a show in 3 weeks and no bass player. With these guys though, we were able to get a couple of rehearsals in and they were able to provide a CD with them playing most of the songs from a previous show.
These guys were supportive and appreciative. The show went pretty well, a few rough spots. I was asked back and played many good shows with them for 4 years until the band dissolved when the singer and drummer moved out of state.
Right, here I was contrasting a similar situation with a previous band that ended up very differently
LOL, right. Maybe I should start a different thread - "is it OK to fire someone by FB delete?"
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Sounds like it wasn't your cup of tea on the personality side either, so probably no real love lost.
Only thing that seemed missing from your description is a time expectation when taking on the gig, e.g., "I can learn the stuff you're playing and would need ~2-3weeks to get there. The sooner you can get me a list of songs and keys, the sooner I can get going. When is your next gig?" I'd rather say no at that point then a few days before when everyone is surprised. I've subbed a few times with a friend and they all have music degrees and are jazz players doing some R&B/blues covers. They don't rehearse, it is "come dialed in" and she puts together charts, endings etc, and I always tell her that I need 2 weekends to prep (~24 tunes). I'm not bad, and like you, I like to sound rehearsed, nail hooks and fills, but at some point, there is a need for simplification, and 2 weeks is sufficient for me to be reasonably comfortable.
Honestly, this group you played with sounds like a bunch of clowns with their mix-up mash-up cross key song list and procrastination on maybe preparing you more with at least ONE somewhat of a rehearsal. This sounds like some band that would be playing in the backyard party of a run down mobile home in Lakeland. I know, I lived in the "Tampa Bay" area for 24 years. Also contributing to the childish image they project is the use of "Facebook" of all things and doing the 'unfriending' thing. Come on, my kid did that when he was 13. I have read all the remarks here, and yes, the pro's who write to you that maybe you should have not 'layed out' (I guess that means you didn't play your bass) on 2 songs and should have muddled your way through it playing roots, I would tend to agree with them, IF, the group you were playing with was not so childlike and actually had THEIR act together. I am sure you just didn't outright SUCK at playing. It sounds like you probably would have stayed with them a few more times if they didn't ignore you after the backyard party was over and unfriended you from the Facebook. I see this as 100% their loss. Lets see what the next bass played they find does with them. Chances are they might just find someone next time that can improvise to their songs and changes and at the end of the show, that bass player will tell them they are a bunch of kids and walk off. But then again, maybe this next bass player will do a fast exit if he knows the pay is $60 for the night with these guys.
Read the first and last pages of the thread, so sorry if I missed anything important...
On the one hand, I'm seeing some posts to the effect that the OP overpromised and that he should have learned everything cold and not had any songs he couldn't at least wing it on.
On the other hand, I'm seeing posts that the band was, basically, unprofessional.
I would lean toward the latter. I don't see that the OP overpromised his abilities; I think that the band had a slipshod show (e.g. the guitarist coming in on the wrong key entirely on one song) and organization (why couldn't they give him a set list and stick to it?). Yes, a consummate pro could have hung with the chaos and still put out something, but that's asking more professionalism of the OP than the band itself was delivering.
I remember one gig, a sort of jazz/yacht rock combo that played restaurants as background music. Their regular bass player had broken his hands in an accident and they wanted a player on two days' notice. I replied to the CL ad, figuring it would be a challenge and to see if I could pull it off. I met them and expected an audition, so they could see if I was up to their music, but instead they just looked at me and said you can do it, I can tell, and booked me. I scrambled the next 48 hours to learn everything, but there were one or two songs with lots of changes and more complex structure that I couldn't get down completely in the time I had. It wasn't a fixed set list exactly, so at the gig the BL (drummer/singer) looks at me and says, "Can you play X?" I said, "Well, I was working on it..." and he goes "Do you KNOW it?" And I had to say no. That was humiliating. But it was also a gig that paid sixteen dollars and a sandwich, for which I didn't feel too bad about not showing up with utter professionalism.
The classic rock trio that was my busiest gigging band, they only "auditioned" me by showing up to a gig I was playing with another group. They gave me a list of 20 songs to learn. I said, "Won't we need more than that for a gig?" and they replied, "Oh, you'll pick up the rest as we go along." So I did. They didn't use set lists, the BL would call it as we went, and sometimes it was just "Jonny, this one's in A," and off the guitarist went with an opening riff. He and the drummer had been playing together for twelve years and had a huge catalog of stuff they had played sometime or other. They called it "throwing Jonny to the wolves," and were perfectly understanding about me stumbling along to keep up, but I generally did manage to keep up more or less. After a year they were still surprising me with stuff I had never played before but it got less and less common.
On the one hand, I'm seeing some posts to the effect that the OP overpromised and that he should have learned everything cold and not had any songs he couldn't at least wing it on.
On the other hand, I'm seeing posts that the band was, basically, unprofessional.
I would lean toward the latter. I don't see that the OP overpromised his abilities; I think that the band had a slipshod show (e.g. the guitarist coming in on the wrong key entirely on one song) and organization (why couldn't they give him a set list and stick to it?). Yes, a consummate pro could have hung with the chaos and still put out something, but that's asking more professionalism of the OP than the band itself was delivering.
I remember one gig, a sort of jazz/yacht rock combo that played restaurants as background music. Their regular bass player had broken his hands in an accident and they wanted a player on two days' notice. I replied to the CL ad, figuring it would be a challenge and to see if I could pull it off. I met them and expected an audition, so they could see if I was up to their music, but instead they just looked at me and said you can do it, I can tell, and booked me. I scrambled the next 48 hours to learn everything, but there were one or two songs with lots of changes and more complex structure that I couldn't get down completely in the time I had. It wasn't a fixed set list exactly, so at the gig the BL (drummer/singer) looks at me and says, "Can you play X?" I said, "Well, I was working on it..." and he goes "Do you KNOW it?" And I had to say no. That was humiliating. But it was also a gig that paid sixteen dollars and a sandwich, for which I didn't feel too bad about not showing up with utter professionalism.
The classic rock trio that was my busiest gigging band, they only "auditioned" me by showing up to a gig I was playing with another group. They gave me a list of 20 songs to learn. I said, "Won't we need more than that for a gig?" and they replied, "Oh, you'll pick up the rest as we go along." So I did. They didn't use set lists, the BL would call it as we went, and sometimes it was just "Jonny, this one's in A," and off the guitarist went with an opening riff. He and the drummer had been playing together for twelve years and had a huge catalog of stuff they had played sometime or other. They called it "throwing Jonny to the wolves," and were perfectly understanding about me stumbling along to keep up, but I generally did manage to keep up more or less. After a year they were still surprising me with stuff I had never played before but it got less and less common.
- Oct 7, 2000
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Only read the first few responses, and feel it got nailed right out of the gate.
Those were my first thoughts.
And this was my next.
I think its great when we push our comfort zones, and with doing that - for me, I like to learn from my mistakes. Having been in situations like you described I'd consider the above in the future.
Unlike you, for me no rehearsals is almost an absolute on my decision whether or not to play in a cover situation. It tells me that the band is on the same page as I am, and of the same experience. "We rehearse once a week," is my red flag for this is NOT the situation for me, unless its a really high profile gig. I think you knew going into it that you were in over your head, but its great that you pushed your limits, IMO.
The only thing that I'd have done differently if I were in that situation is I'd communicate clearly, earlier, exactly where I was with the material. I'd have let them know the day before what I was comfortable with and what I wasn't. I know they didn't give you the setlist until the last minute, but I'd have gone through whatever they send me and probably made a song order of the songs I was MOST confident with going down to the ones I struggled with, and listing ones I didn't know at all. It sounds to me like they were pissed because they were caught off guard, and trusted you when you said you could handle it.
Last note: Though it goes against conventional wisdom, in situations like this (last minute with my back against the wall) I found its better to have people expecting less of me, than more. That way if I start flubbing they roll with it
. When they expect more, the opposite happens. As it did in your situation.
I don't understand why people do this thing of waiting until the last minute to send out set lists to a sub. It's a setup for failure. Sorry this happened to you
Those were my first thoughts.
And this was my next.
When you tell them something like "They ask me if I can play this stuff and I tell them I'm not a pro but yes I can play it," I'd say yes, that's what they should expect based on what you told them. Yeah, they dropped the list on you pretty short notice, but then you said you could do it. I'd be perturbed too if someone came new into our gig and said they didn't know a couple songs and would lay out on those when we were told the person could do it.
I'm not going to get on you at all. I would say if you see red flags (a band that doesn't rehearse when you prefer to), or something you see ahead of time is going to be out of your comfort zone, listen to those voices. Take the whole thing as a lesson to not put yourself in a similar position in the future. It's not fair to the band and it's definitely not fair to yourself to be in that when it can be avoided. I've done some stuff in my past too that became an absolute train wreck or embarrassed the hell out of myself because I wanted to be able to do it and, unfortunately, proved myself coming up short.
Know your strengths, your abilities, your needs in a band (i.e., the rehearsal thing), and stick with that.
And let this one roll off like the educational experience it is. It's done, it's over, and you lived.
I think its great when we push our comfort zones, and with doing that - for me, I like to learn from my mistakes. Having been in situations like you described I'd consider the above in the future.
Unlike you, for me no rehearsals is almost an absolute on my decision whether or not to play in a cover situation. It tells me that the band is on the same page as I am, and of the same experience. "We rehearse once a week," is my red flag for this is NOT the situation for me, unless its a really high profile gig. I think you knew going into it that you were in over your head, but its great that you pushed your limits, IMO.
The only thing that I'd have done differently if I were in that situation is I'd communicate clearly, earlier, exactly where I was with the material. I'd have let them know the day before what I was comfortable with and what I wasn't. I know they didn't give you the setlist until the last minute, but I'd have gone through whatever they send me and probably made a song order of the songs I was MOST confident with going down to the ones I struggled with, and listing ones I didn't know at all. It sounds to me like they were pissed because they were caught off guard, and trusted you when you said you could handle it.
Last note: Though it goes against conventional wisdom, in situations like this (last minute with my back against the wall) I found its better to have people expecting less of me, than more. That way if I start flubbing they roll with it
. When they expect more, the opposite happens. As it did in your situation.
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Welcome to trying to be a sub, (Edit:, OK, trying to join a band.) and all it's perils. I'm normally not either, but... here's a story where it went right.
Been there, done that, but I had a blast. Only because a few key things were different. The young (just turned 16!) guitar player / singer and his mom and dad helped me with anything I had questions about. I got asked on a Thursday noonish by a much more experienced bass player friend that got asked, but couldn't cover a gig for that Saturday night, and decided to go for it with his encouragement. "You're ready, you'll do great, I know you can, wish I could play it, wanna buy a bridge?" kind of thing.
I had a set list Thursday by around 5. Similar situation, but a few more songs, and the percentage of ones I hadn't played before and ones I'd never heard before was maybe a bit higher.
We did have two 2-hour practices to go over anything I needed help with, one on Friday afternoon and one the morning of the show. The drummer had played with him before, he was pretty good albeit a little odd, and both were very "aware" of and easily worked on getting through issues. Long story short; nailed it, surprising even myself. We even did a couple of his own songs I hadn't heard in the third set, he was hesitant to ask and offered me an out; but they were blues, so his 10 second pre-song descriptions were enough, what the heck?!
And I was actually enjoying myself by the third set. I was even singing harmony lines when I knew the words. I think I only had three or four clunkers all night. The family was overjoyed, that was cool. It was a hell of a lot of work and stress, the pay was fair, and I got to be the kid's bass player on his first real full show. This kid is the real deal, extremely gifted, humble and a nice young man. He'll do well. I told his mom and dad that they owed me an invite to his first Grammy party.
Just to be honest here, I'm not nearly that good. I started playing too late in life. Lots of roots and fifths in that situation. I'm not really a pick-up sub that's done things like that, and I knew I'd be pushing myself, but I like doing that. I'd sat in on some gigs before, but had a couple of weeks to get ready for those. There was quite a bit of risk. But I always liked going to jam nights, trying new things regularly, where some pretty cool stuff resulted. I'd focused on ear training a lot, playing along with anything that comes up on Serius XM channels for instance, and man did that pay off! And it just all worked out, but entirely because the family made every effort to help me as much as possible.
So keep your chin up, not everybody is that bad. And people many times get more than they deserve. So what, never let that stop you, you're already better for having done it.
The real pros on here have to realize that picking up stuff like that is a skill, and like any other it takes time and experience to develop, and a few failures. The other band members should have known this, and frankly just didn't care or they at least would have made a little effort. Not ready on only two songs for, sixty bucks? Give me a break. And is there any question why those guys didn't have a regular bass player? Yeah, we all know. I think the OP did great and learned a ton despite all the "help." I know my episode has given me a ton of confidence and made me a better player, hopefully it will do the same for him.
Been there, done that, but I had a blast. Only because a few key things were different. The young (just turned 16!) guitar player / singer and his mom and dad helped me with anything I had questions about. I got asked on a Thursday noonish by a much more experienced bass player friend that got asked, but couldn't cover a gig for that Saturday night, and decided to go for it with his encouragement. "You're ready, you'll do great, I know you can, wish I could play it, wanna buy a bridge?" kind of thing.
I had a set list Thursday by around 5. Similar situation, but a few more songs, and the percentage of ones I hadn't played before and ones I'd never heard before was maybe a bit higher.
We did have two 2-hour practices to go over anything I needed help with, one on Friday afternoon and one the morning of the show. The drummer had played with him before, he was pretty good albeit a little odd, and both were very "aware" of and easily worked on getting through issues. Long story short; nailed it, surprising even myself. We even did a couple of his own songs I hadn't heard in the third set, he was hesitant to ask and offered me an out; but they were blues, so his 10 second pre-song descriptions were enough, what the heck?!
And I was actually enjoying myself by the third set. I was even singing harmony lines when I knew the words. I think I only had three or four clunkers all night. The family was overjoyed, that was cool. It was a hell of a lot of work and stress, the pay was fair, and I got to be the kid's bass player on his first real full show. This kid is the real deal, extremely gifted, humble and a nice young man. He'll do well. I told his mom and dad that they owed me an invite to his first Grammy party.
Just to be honest here, I'm not nearly that good. I started playing too late in life. Lots of roots and fifths in that situation. I'm not really a pick-up sub that's done things like that, and I knew I'd be pushing myself, but I like doing that. I'd sat in on some gigs before, but had a couple of weeks to get ready for those. There was quite a bit of risk. But I always liked going to jam nights, trying new things regularly, where some pretty cool stuff resulted. I'd focused on ear training a lot, playing along with anything that comes up on Serius XM channels for instance, and man did that pay off! And it just all worked out, but entirely because the family made every effort to help me as much as possible.
So keep your chin up, not everybody is that bad. And people many times get more than they deserve. So what, never let that stop you, you're already better for having done it.
The real pros on here have to realize that picking up stuff like that is a skill, and like any other it takes time and experience to develop, and a few failures. The other band members should have known this, and frankly just didn't care or they at least would have made a little effort. Not ready on only two songs for, sixty bucks? Give me a break. And is there any question why those guys didn't have a regular bass player? Yeah, we all know. I think the OP did great and learned a ton despite all the "help." I know my episode has given me a ton of confidence and made me a better player, hopefully it will do the same for him.
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This is a great story! I've played thousands of gigs over the years and I've come up with a rubric for taking gigs. It's gotta be at least two out three. 1- Good pay, 2- Good Hang, 3- it's Music that I love and would play for free anyhow
When you tell them something like "They ask me if I can play this stuff and I tell them I'm not a pro but yes I can play it," I'd say yes, that's what they should expect based on what you told them. Yeah, they dropped the list on you pretty short notice, but then you said you could do it. I'd be perturbed too if someone came new into our gig and said they didn't know a couple songs and would lay out on those when we were told the person could do it.
I'm not going to get on you at all. I would say if you see red flags (a band that doesn't rehearse when you prefer to), or something you see ahead of time is going to be out of your comfort zone, listen to those voices. Take the whole thing as a lesson to not put yourself in a similar position in the future. It's not fair to the band and it's definitely not fair to yourself to be in that when it can be avoided. I've done some stuff in my past too that became an absolute train wreck or embarrassed the hell out of myself because I wanted to be able to do it and, unfortunately, proved myself coming up short.
Know your strengths, your abilities, your needs in a band (i.e., the rehearsal thing), and stick with that.
And let this one roll off like the educational experience it is. It's done, it's over, and you lived.
I know you've heard a lot of, you're a bass player you should look at the guitarists hands and follow the song instead of laying out. Do they mean the guitarist that started the one song in the wrong key? You don't know a song and they can't change one song before the start of a set? 30 songs for an audition is ridiculous, as is getting paid $60. And the way you were treated, during and at the end of the gig, these guys sound like real D Bags so you won't be missing out on much. Write this one off and move on.
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