5 string basses should be 35” scale

[micguy]

25908923[/URL], member: 145228"]There is another reason: inharmonicity of strings. Physicists develop bass string theory and String inharmonicity vs material

Italian harpsichord makers needing to shorten the instruments to fit, learned in the 1600's that too thick a string will not vibrate freely and even though may have similar tension, will not have the overtones or sustain necessary to match, and the overtones can go sharp. This is one reason B strings in commercially available sets are lesser diameter than equal tension figures might indicate otherwise as to how large a diameter a B string should be. Piano tuners also work with this, actually progressively flattening the fundamentals of the lowest octaves so the overtones will be in tune with the middle of the piano, and sharpening the treble pitches for other bioacoustic reasons as well as the inharmonicity of the solid strings as they get shorter.

Yes, I have been using custom singles to get a more balanced tension, usually with 45-60-80-105 GHS Progressives on my Rickenbacker 4002 (yes, "2," not "1" or "3") since the early 90's, and more recently the D'A XL170BT plus a 130 B string on my Ibby gig bass for these very reasons.

Bottom line: depending on the construction, set up, and choice of strings, any 5-string bass of any scale can sound good, even superlative, so long as the player is aware of the inherent compromises and limitation inherent in having a 5th B string on a bass.

Sorry, I don’t buy that as a good reason. Inharmonicity is a well understood problem at this point. It’s caused by string stiffness, and the practical solution (which works well on pianos and basses) is a wound string - the core takes the tension, and is small enough to not have too much stiffness. The windings add mass without adding stiffness. It’s not really a factor in a debate about 34 or 35 inch scale bass strings- a 120 isn’t significantly better than a 130 or 140, assuming they’re wound properly.

 

[darthplagis]

I've played 34" 5 ers since 1998. (Yamaha and sandberg) and I've found with both that using a tapered B string make a WORLD of difference. personally I use Warwick black label (40-130) 40300 ML.
I used to use Warwick reds back in the 90s and the Yamaha (BBG5a) always felt a bit dry and flubby, and i saw a post on here about a TB'er with a Kubiki x factor which used tapered strings for the B and E and a few folk suggested them for 34" basses, so I did a bit of digging and warwick black label 40300 were my best bet
I've been using them exclusively since that post in about 2004-5ish. except for the sandberg which I didn't really feel the need for the tapered B... until I put the Warwick's on earlier this year (after 11 years of staus hotwires) and the B just came to life.

I've just ordered my first 35" 5 with the Harley Benton Marquess. so when she arrives I'll compare the stock olympia strings to the Warwick's after I've set her up with the new strings.

 

[perfektspace6]

I have no major floppiness issues with several 34 inch scale 5 strings but some are better than others. I have used Ken Smith strings for years with a tapered B and perhaps that is part of the success. I would put the B on my U.S. Spector up against anything. Clear, deep and tight. The sum of the parts seems to matter more than the scale length.

 

[spiritbass]

My favorite five-string is a Dingwall Super J (head stock in avatar). The scales go from 35" on the B to 32" on the G. Nothing not to like about it. They do occasionally pop up in the classifieds, but you have to be quick...

 

[Obese Chess]

The 37" B on my Dingwall 5 is better than the 34" B on my MUB 5, but not as much as I would have anticipated.

 

[J.Wolf]

[overlysimplistic generalized declaration]

My 33 has one of the best B's I've ever heard, but maybe only because I'm wrong.

 

[oren]

When I was trying out 5’ers about a dozen years ago, the ones with 35” scale (Lull and Roscoe) had, to my ear, better sounding B strings than the ones with 34” scale. I ended up with a Roscoe SKB and I can heartily recommend Keith’s great design and craftsmanship.

 

[jim nolte]

At one time I had three 5 string basses and all three were different scale lengths, 34 “ EBMM SR5, 34.5” Fbass BN5 and a 35” Lakland 55-02, all strung with the same strings with a .130 B string, none had a “ floppy” feel but obviously sounded differently because of different pickups, pre amps, construction etc., could easily switch between all three without any change in technique or attack, so definitely not in the it has to be 35” inch for 5 string only camp and personally don’t like the feel of the G string on my 55-02 a little too taught but yeah it’s got a great B but they all do.

 

[el murdoque]

I want to get my high end, forever bass at this point in my life. I have pondered owning a Sadowsky for the build quality and tone. Does the B string sing with clarity? Should I go with an American Lakland? What are your thoughts?

When you go high end and cross a certain threshold, there will be no more compromises.
I've played a 35" 6 string and a 34-36" Multiscale and was happy with their B strings.
My current main bass is a high end model and it's 34". No complaints.
I've played great 34" basses with B strings that were tight, both in sound and feel.
It's just that Fender has (to my knowledge) yet to build one that's good. Every single Fender or Squier 5 string I touched felt like "people want 5 strings, so we take a 4 string and slap another string on there, easy money."
No love for the B.
I have played two NYC Sadowsky 5 string basses. Both were fantastic.

 

[MultiScaleMale]

I have a 30" Alien Audio 5 string. B string is great. I have a 37" Canadian Dingwall. B string is great. I have several 34" 5 strings. B strings are great.

Out of these, my favorite is the 30".

 

[coyote1]

Floppy B strings are intolerable.

Leo made the modern bass at guitar 34” scale to accommodate 4 strings. It is perfect for that specific purpose. Years ago I switched to 5 string and got an American Deluxe Jazz V. It was beautiful, sounded great, but the low B felt a bit like a rubber band.

Years later, Musicman Stingray 5. I loved that bass. It was slightly better with the low B. Still didn’t feel right. At the same time I played an Ibanez 6 string for solo bass arrangements. The high C was fun but that low B was rubber city.

Then I got a Lakland 55-02. Dammit, they got it right. The 5th string is taught, clear, and feels like a natural extension of the bass. It’s big, no doubt. I had to adapt to it but it’s the best 5 string I have ever owned.

My query is, what’s next? Does Sadowsky make a 35” 5 string? I want to get my high end, forever bass at this point in my life. I have pondered owning a Sadowsky for the build quality and tone. Does the B string sing with clarity? Should I go with an American Lakland? What are your thoughts?

A well built 5 or 6 or 7 string can be 34”. I’ve had three at that length that do the job very well, the latter two of which I still own: Conklin 7, Tobias KillerB 6, Ibanez Portamento 6. By contrast, two low-B instruments I had are both gone and for the same reason: Ibanez BTB1206, Tune TWB53. And gone because their B-strings were both unsalvageably floppy.

The Ibanez had a 35” scale length. So I can assure you that the issue is not scale length.

The Conklin? Awesome instrument. Sounded great, easy to play… except I eventually found 7 strings to be one too many.

 

[IamGroot]

Lots of 34" scale basses have a great B string. Fenders are hit n miss, mostly miss. Dont know why. Saw this when I went shopping around 2002.

 

[JonathanPDX]

Not all 5-string basses have B strings.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Floppy B strings are intolerable.

Leo made the modern bass at guitar 34” scale to accommodate 4 strings. It is perfect for that specific purpose. Years ago I switched to 5 string and got an American Deluxe Jazz V. It was beautiful, sounded great, but the low B felt a bit like a rubber band.

Years later, Musicman Stingray 5. I loved that bass. It was slightly better with the low B. Still didn’t feel right. At the same time I played an Ibanez 6 string for solo bass arrangements. The high C was fun but that low B was rubber city.

Then I got a Lakland 55-02. Dammit, they got it right. The 5th string is taught, clear, and feels like a natural extension of the bass. It’s big, no doubt. I had to adapt to it but it’s the best 5 string I have ever owned.

My query is, what’s next? Does Sadowsky make a 35” 5 string? I want to get my high end, forever bass at this point in my life. I have pondered owning a Sadowsky for the build quality and tone. Does the B string sing with clarity? Should I go with an American Lakland? What are your thoughts?

USA Handmade — Michael Tobias Design

Rodger Sadowsky doesn't believe in 35" scale

 

[dBChad]

I have a 34" 5 string and a 34" 6 string. Whenever I thought the B string was too floppy (I tune down 1/2 step), I went up on string gauge. Always fixed the issue.

Actually, come to think of it, using the right strings made all the strings sound better. Sadowsky's are cool, but DR, Ernie Ball, D'Addario, GHS, Dunlop, LaBella, StringJoy, Elixir, and others may fix your problem for much less money while making unexpected improvements to your tone overall.

 

[Deleted member 165050]

Rodger Sadowsky doesn't believe in 35" scale

They definitely exist, I have one...

 

[bobknowsbass]

My favorite five-string is a Dingwall Super J (head stock in avatar). The scales go from 35" on the B to 32" on the G. Nothing not to like about it. They do occasionally pop up in the classifieds, but you have to be quick...

Good to know!

 

[bobknowsbass]

When you go high end and cross a certain threshold, there will be no more compromises.
I've played a 35" 6 string and a 34-36" Multiscale and was happy with their B strings.
My current main bass is a high end model and it's 34". No complaints.
I've played great 34" basses with B strings that were tight, both in sound and feel.
It's just that Fender has (to my knowledge) yet to build one that's good. Every single Fender or Squier 5 string I touched felt like "people want 5 strings, so we take a 4 string and slap another string on there, easy money."
No love for the B.
I have played two NYC Sadowsky 5 string basses. Both were fantastic.

Awesome!

 

[DJ Bebop]

They definitely exist, I have one...

Cool!
You must have one of the experimental models!

My snarky comment was based on an interview with Rodger and Michael about scale length. At the time Rodger seem to take the position that 35" wasn't needed to get a good B

It might be this one, or maybe not



Or this:

Roger Sadowsky – I am 100% with Michael Pedulla on this one. I only build in 34” scale. Of course, I have experimented with 35”, but for my basses, I do not find 35” makes a better B string than 34”, nor does through-body stringing. Like Michael, I do not like the sound of my G string at 35” either, especially in the upper register. So for me, it is 34” for everything. I understand the attraction of longer and shorter scales to some, but I can’t do everything!

Luthiers’ Round Table – Oct. 2017 | Bass Gear Magazine

 

[shade_1313]

Do I think that extra inch can help? Yes. Do I think it’s necessary? No. I have basses with Bs that are 34, 35, 35.25 and 37 inches. The Dingwall, of course, feels fantastic. That.s about good scale length, good neck construction and fitting, AND good strings. My 34s feel great, too, and I credit the neck construction and the strings. Same on past 34” 5 strings I’ve had. I will say that I like my 35+ Bs best, but the others sound and feel quite good as well.