No worries, except I'm even older! Got my first bass in '63!
Nice... I was 12 and playing the clarinet!
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'78 P-bass. Nitro? How?
- Thread starter Frank Orlando
- Start date
Nice... I was 12 and playing the clarinet!
DiabolusInMusic
Functionless Art is Merely Tolerated Vandalism
It doesn't look like nitro to me. If you want another "test" put some painter's tape on it for 15 minutes. Poly will be just fine and nitro will start to eat away. If it is nitro then your bass has most definitely been refinished, Fender wasn't about to make a one-off nitro finished bass in 1978.
I have a 78 that used to look exactly like yours. I had a very uggly j route that I filled in with a peice of ash with the intention to partly finish the area with transparent yellow. Well, I didn't work out at all. The finish didn't react at all like nitro which I'm used to. When I tried to thin it down to meet the new finish it just peeled of like rubber. Weird stuff. Also, the grain filler/sealer underneath the actual color is completely transparent and probably some kind of polyester.
For the record, my bass is nowadays sprayed with nitro in Olympic white
For the record, my bass is nowadays sprayed with nitro in Olympic white
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I honestly know that people are trying to help by providing suggestions but this bass was not refinished. If that's your only explanation then no need to state it. I'm positive it wasn't refinished. Maybe it's some wierd poly blend that reacts with acetone. Maybe this weird poly can be dented with a fingernail. Maybe Fender did shoot a topcoat of nitro over poly late into the 70's like guys on the other forum state. Maybe it's poly that was exposed to heat or some kind of cleaner was used on it causing it to break down and behave like nitro. But it's NOT because it was refinished. 
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DiabolusInMusic
Functionless Art is Merely Tolerated Vandalism
Can you post a full body shot? The pictures you showed do not have any checking, only chipping. It's not like poly is immune to chipping, it is just more difficult. You're in Florida so your climate is very different than mine but around these parts that bass would have bad swirling and checking in that kind of condition.
That thread was a good read but it isn't definitive. The end of the thread has somebody commenting on how their two best sources of info have been proven wrong on certain subjects. If that thread is correct then your bass is finished with poly with a light coat of nitro over top, the neck is poly and the front of the stock is nitro. As a poster in that thread mentions, it would be pretty awesome to actually hear from somebody who was on the line back in the day.
Also.... have you taken the neck off to check if it has been re-finished?
(sorry, couldn't resist.)
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Question: Do you know for a fact that poly doesn't react to acetone? You say this, "On further internet investigation I learned that THE test for nitro is using a dab of acetone or lacquer thinner on a q-tip in an inconspicuous spot under the pickguard...just a dab. Nitro will immediately soften up leaving a rough spot in the finish from the nitro softening. . . "
I'm not a finish expert, but it may well be that the poly is reacting to the acetone. The area close to the pickups has only two layers of poly: yellow and clear, so it's thinner than the rest of the burst.
I've had all kinds of '70s' Fender, and some had really thick poly all over, while others had layers that wore more easily over the years. I had a '78 Jazz with a wine red finish (which is only two layers, red and clear) that was really thin poly and it wore almost like nitro on some spots.
I'm pretty sure that's what you are experiencing.
I'm not a finish expert, but it may well be that the poly is reacting to the acetone. The area close to the pickups has only two layers of poly: yellow and clear, so it's thinner than the rest of the burst.
I've had all kinds of '70s' Fender, and some had really thick poly all over, while others had layers that wore more easily over the years. I had a '78 Jazz with a wine red finish (which is only two layers, red and clear) that was really thin poly and it wore almost like nitro on some spots.
I'm pretty sure that's what you are experiencing.
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Well, I am unclear how you can be so absolutely sure that this is not a refin, I have a refin that went from 3TSB to LPB and I guarantee that you can't tell. Plus, the finish does not look like a Fender SB, the red and black are too narrow leaving too much yellow. Yes, I know each one looks slightly different, this one looks WAY different...
Can you post a full body shot? The pictures you showed do not have any checking, only chipping. It's not like poly is immune to chipping, it is just more difficult. Your in Florida so your climate is very different than mine but around these parts that bass would have bad swirling and checking in that kind of condition.
That thread was a good read but it isn't definitive. The end of the thread has somebody commenting on how their two best sources of info have been proven wrong on certain subjects. If that thread is correct then your bass is finished with poly with a light coat of nitro over top, the neck is poly and the front of the stock is nitro. As a poster in that thread mentions, it would be pretty awesome to actually hear from somebody who was on the line back in the day.
Also.... have you taken the neck off to check if it has been re-finished?
When I bought it 5 years ago from the second owner it was covered in nicotine and dust and had the wrong (tort) pickguard, thumb rest on wrong (G) string side, a nice size chip in the nut at the E string, replacement CTS pots and Fender flats that were badly tarnished but sounded very nice. The original pots were scratchy so the second owner changed them (?!) but thankfully saved the originals. The second owner was an older gentleman, working musician here in SW Florida. He owned it for over 20 years and played it locally weekly. He said he bought it from a person that closed a studio in the Bronx and was selling all the contents. I bought it from him at his house in the original case with the original chrome covers, owners manual and key. I disassembled every screw. The neck pocket looked untouched. There was the usual Fender dust and crumbs in the routes. I replaced the nut, cleaned and reinstalled the original pots and cap and located a black (correct color) WD pickguard with 2 holes in the correct location for the thumb rest at the E string side. I cleaned the nicotine and dust, strung her up with some Labella flats (has GHS Precision flats now... that's for another post. Awesome strings.) and gave her a setup. The bass is so vibrant and the tone is exactly what I hear from so many of the recordings from the 60's and 70's. It plays exceptionally well. The frets are very good with Fender's recommended action and no buzzing anywhere. It must have had rounds at one time because there are some marks consistant with roundwounds but not very deep. I have been looking for black period correct Fender pickguard to replace the WD for years but from the outside this WD looks good. I am positive this isn't a refin. The finish is soft if you press in a fingernail and reacts to acetone. That's all I know. I really don't care what the finish is. I bought it as a player and when I plug it in and hear that tone I don't care if it was painted with Rustoleum. In the past 5 years I have bought a 2008, 2010 and 2013 American Standard, two 2012 Fender Selects and a '63 American Vintage RI looking for a P-Bass that sounded better or even as good so I could have a backup. I sold them all. Since I put on the GHS Precision Flats and broke them in for the past year I stopped even looking.
007... Million dollar question. Does acetone react with any of the poly "family" of finishes THAT FENDER USED EVER? I don't know the answer to that one. That's why I posted it. I figured I can't be the first one to run into this. Then you get some people on other forums saying acetone reacts with blah blah blah poly and then someone else jumps in and says "yes, but Fender never used that stuff on any guitar" so very interesting and perplexing. Thanks for not stating that my bass must be a refin...
Here's mine:
"WAY" different?
Take a look. Do any of these look "WAY" different? Not to me... It's a sunburst. They are all unique but none are "WAY" different. Oh, mine is in the middle of these pictures somewhere.
Here's mine:
"WAY" different?
Take a look. Do any of these look "WAY" different? Not to me... It's a sunburst. They are all unique but none are "WAY" different. Oh, mine is in the middle of these pictures somewhere.
View attachment 663355 View attachment 663356 View attachment 663358 View attachment 663362 View attachment 663363 View attachment 663364 View attachment 663365 View attachment 663366 View attachment 663357
Ok, I still think it is a refin...
I have wondered what the finish on my 73 P is as well. It would be poly, from what I read, but it is noticeably thinner than the finish on a Telecaster Bass I have made in the same year. The finish on a black 75 J I have is similar to the 73 P but not as extremely checked and cracked.
I posted these in another thread a few days ago- sorry if you have seen them already. They show clearly how the finish has cracked and the manner in which it flakes off. In the first pic you can see the sealant and it is clear and appears fairly thin. The second one shows the checking well and the wear through the top coat but not yet through the colour coat at the edge of the tummy cut. The third pic shows checking above but also a dullish, porous area where your arm rest on the bass. This area goes a greyish, blue colour when sweated on. In extreme humidity, which we get here is Queensland at times, the whole body will go that bluish grey. When humidity drops it goes back to black.
BTW. I know what you mean about having a P Bass that makes it very hard to keep another because you are forever comparing the new one to it.
This is one of those as well. It sounds great. The only other split coil P I have kept is an 83 Fullerton 57 RI. Very different neck and voicing though.
I posted these in another thread a few days ago- sorry if you have seen them already. They show clearly how the finish has cracked and the manner in which it flakes off. In the first pic you can see the sealant and it is clear and appears fairly thin. The second one shows the checking well and the wear through the top coat but not yet through the colour coat at the edge of the tummy cut. The third pic shows checking above but also a dullish, porous area where your arm rest on the bass. This area goes a greyish, blue colour when sweated on. In extreme humidity, which we get here is Queensland at times, the whole body will go that bluish grey. When humidity drops it goes back to black.
BTW. I know what you mean about having a P Bass that makes it very hard to keep another because you are forever comparing the new one to it.
This is one of those as well. It sounds great. The only other split coil P I have kept is an 83 Fullerton 57 RI. Very different neck and voicing though.
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Not out of the realm of possibility that there is a nitro clear coat on top.
Fender still sprayed nitro clears on headstock faces in the 70s. I can see running out of clear poly and grabbing the nitro gun on a Friday afternoon at the factory.
But, no way the color coat is nitro unless it's a refin.
Fender still sprayed nitro clears on headstock faces in the 70s. I can see running out of clear poly and grabbing the nitro gun on a Friday afternoon at the factory.
But, no way the color coat is nitro unless it's a refin.
Also, I'm pretty certain that acetone will eat a poly finish, especially one that is 30+ years old.
A way to test would be to take a chip of the finish, color and top coat, and drop it into a bit of lacquer thinner, if it disappears pretty much instantly, you've got nitro. If it floats around for a while you got not-nitro.
A way to test would be to take a chip of the finish, color and top coat, and drop it into a bit of lacquer thinner, if it disappears pretty much instantly, you've got nitro. If it floats around for a while you got not-nitro.
Why not take it to a local luthier? He could tell you pretty much instantly what the finish is. To me it looks like poly, though.
youre going to get a lot of misinformation from people who dont own 70's fenders or owned them in the 70's (with suspect memories).
as someone who owns 70's fenders, like you know, your bass is absolutely sporting its original finish. people dont seem to understand that these guitars werent finished in modern poly like ernie balls that will crack off in chunks like an eggshell. the sealer coat was the thick, nearly impenetrable coating. the color coats were thin, soft and prone to aging and checking. i couldnt tell you exactly what material was being sprayed, but your experiences with the finish on your bass are absolutely common and correct for this era of fender.
as someone who owns 70's fenders, like you know, your bass is absolutely sporting its original finish. people dont seem to understand that these guitars werent finished in modern poly like ernie balls that will crack off in chunks like an eggshell. the sealer coat was the thick, nearly impenetrable coating. the color coats were thin, soft and prone to aging and checking. i couldnt tell you exactly what material was being sprayed, but your experiences with the finish on your bass are absolutely common and correct for this era of fender.
