A career in bass playing

[SlapPopBass]

Hello all TBers,

Pretty soon I'm going to be finishing high school, and that's also more or less the time where a teenager has to have at least rough idea what he wants to do. I've been playing bass for 2 years, not very long, but its something I can never seem to get bored. When I was 7 I was sent to piano lessons. I hated it, and I hated learning theory in particular. But fast forward 8 years, ever since picking up bass when I was 15, learning theory has become oh so fun and very rewarding. I literally dream about bass playing, and I deliberately wake up early in the morning just to fool around on the bass before having to go to school. I see myself wanting to do nothing but playing bass or doing something in music. I have absolutely no qualms in learning double bass as well. The dream is so overwhelmingly huge, but I willing to be a warrior and fight for it. I want to play a part in helping to change modern society's perception of music, and knock some sense into the so called "music" that is being cranked out now.

I lived in Malaysia my entire life, but I was actually born in America, making me an American citizen (I kept my citizenship, making be an ABC-American born Chinese), so in a couple years there is a chance for me to start living in the States. I come from a very typical Asian background, and any other career choice aside from Engineering, Law, Science or Medicine is seemingly unacceptable. I do not dislike any of those, but bass playing is still my what I find the most enjoyable and rewarding.

So, my question is, what do I do? What should I do? What can I do? Has anybody ever felt or experienced this, and can perhaps offer any advice? How do you convince your parents to accept this?

Sorry for the bloody novel I posted, and thanks in advance,
Edwin

 

[mcarp555]

Stay in school and get a degree. Music is a tough biz, and only the tiniest fraction ever succeed at it, never mind "changing modern society's perception".

It's great to have a dream, and to play & fulfill it, but you'll always need a backup. It's better to take the world by storm with a degree in your back pocket, rather than being burnt out by 40, and having to work low-paying jobs to keep the wolf from your door.

 

[Poopoutyouridea]

First off, I'd like to say that I thought I'd never see a fellow countryman on here.

You say your parents want you to go for a "standard" career path. Have you actually sat down and discussed with them what you want to do with your life? Besides, do you even grasp how hard it is to "make it" in the music industry? I don't want to be a wet blanket but maybe you should reassess your aims realistically. Becoming a professional musician requires a lot of sacrifice. Most times, things don't go your way. You have to give up almost everything in the pursuit of your dream.

A guy I know had to move away from his hometown and live on the verge of poverty for three years just to get started on his career. Your parents probably don't want to see you go through that experience. If you want to pursue this line, just ask yourself this. Would you be willing to give it all up on something as risky as bass playing? Maybe you're the next Jaco or Victor, I don't know. Just taking the pragmatic route.

My advice? Get a solid career that will settle you for life, then venture into the world of music. You can never be too old.

 

[SlapPopBass]

First off, I'd like to say that I thought I'd never see a fellow countryman on here.

You say your parents want you to go for a "standard" career path. Have you actually sat down and discussed with them what you want to do with your life? Besides, do you even grasp how hard it is to "make it" in the music industry? I don't want to be a wet blanket but maybe you should reassess your aims realistically. Becoming a professional musician requires a lot of sacrifice. Most times, things don't go your way. You have to give up almost everything in the pursuit of your dream.

A guy I know had to move away from his hometown and live on the verge of poverty for three years just to get started on his career. Your parents probably don't want to see you go through that experience. If you want to pursue this line, just ask yourself this. Would you be willing to give it all up on something as risky as bass playing? Maybe you're the next Jaco or Victor, I don't know. Just taking the pragmatic route.

My advice? Get a solid career that will settle you for life, then venture into the world of music. You can never be too old.

I very well understand the complications of going into the music path, and the harsh reality and possibility I will wound up homeless. I have literally sacrificed sleep just to think whether I should even post this question or not.

Realistically? I know, I have to finish school. I plan to get a basic degree in college. Lets say science or business. But the music path is still very much my first choice and dream.

 

[Poopoutyouridea]

If that's the case then, go for it. No one's stopping you but yourself. All you have to do is believe. Once you stop believing in yourself, no one will. All those famous bass players and musicians had to start out from somewhere right?

 

[Indiana Mike]

to add....

a lot of professional musicians have degrees of some kind.

get educmacated ..... you can pursue music while in school and make a rather large network of fellow musicians while doing so.....

 

[BassChuck]

One of the paths to happiness is following your passion. At age 60 I'll tell you that you should do that, but also there is no logical reason that your passion should have to pay the bills. Take care to build a secure life... education, good job, solid relationships, and put family in the center of all that. Develop your passion and spend time with it, you will be a stronger person for that.

 

[scotch]

I had the same dream in high school & managed to pull it off, I'm about 20 years into a career playing bass full time. It has been rewarding, but it has not been easy!

Keep a couple of larger concepts in mind:

No matter what you do, some kind of education is key. Not just to learn job-specific skills, but to learn to build a network and give you more options down the road. I never attended a university or college full time, but my early post-high school education included a fair amount of college-level music theory and a LOT of practical playing experience. I had already played well over a hundred shows in over 20 States before I started to make real $$$ playing bass and managed to make it my profession.

Playing bass for a living is most likely going to mean you will be "self employed". No one is going to give you affordable health insurance, decent retirement or a predictable income. Learn what being in business for yourself entails (hint: it has nothing to do with music or playing bass)! Expect to spend more time finding work, administrating, networking, travelling, etc than you do playing your instrument! Unless you are the one-in-a-thousand out of the one-in-a-million who manages to have enough success to pay someone else to run your business (management, agents, accountants and attorneys), you are a businessman and will spend an ungodly amount of time doing stuff that is mundane and has nothing to do with bass. Even if you are so lucky, there are still myriad business headaches!

When your "dream" becomes your "career", it's going to be different than you expect. The entertainment industry has become less profitable on all fronts over the last 10 years. It's harder now to have financial success. Sure, it's easier to get a little buzz going with YouTube and social media- but if you want to buy groceries, things get harder!


All of that said, there are many ways to enjoy a career in music! Performing in everything from original artist situations, cover/cruise/wedding bands, studio recording, education and teaching, music therapy, etc... Being prepared for as many scenarios as possible makes success much more likely. Education and playing experience are key. You NEED to invest in both in one form or another.

Good luck!

 

[lfmn16]

So, my question is, what do I do? What should I do? What can I do? Has anybody ever felt or experienced this, and can perhaps offer any advice? How do you convince your parents to accept this?

Sorry for the bloody novel I posted, and thanks in advance,
Edwin

First, get ready to ignore the "go be an accountant because this is too hard and scary" posts. Second, find some people who are actually making a living at music and ask them how they are doing it. Third, be prepared for the fact that the odds are against you and that it is incredibly hard to make a full time living off of music.

Be prepared for a roller coaster ride. Some of my best, and worst, memories are from when I was a full time musician (many, many years ago). I wouldn't trade those memories for anything.

 

[jamersonburton]

Im in your position. Im actually starting uni soon, intending to major in both International relations and philosophy with the intention to either go into law or education. That being said, i will always play music and if the oportunity arises for a possible career in that direction, then i will take it.

 

[Turxile]

Go for the business degree you mentioned. There's a business side to music as well.

 

[Space Pickle]

just keep slappin and poppin

 

[Ric5]

Hello all TBers,

Pretty soon I'm going to be finishing high school, and that's also more or less the time where a teenager has to have at least rough idea what he wants to do. I've been playing bass for 2 years, not very long, but its something I can never seem to get bored. When I was 7 I was sent to piano lessons. I hated it, and I hated learning theory in particular. But fast forward 8 years, ever since picking up bass when I was 15, learning theory has become oh so fun and very rewarding. I literally dream about bass playing, and I deliberately wake up early in the morning just to fool around on the bass before having to go to school. I see myself wanting to do nothing but playing bass or doing something in music. I have absolutely no qualms in learning double bass as well. The dream is so overwhelmingly huge, but I willing to be a warrior and fight for it. I want to play a part in helping to change modern society's perception of music, and knock some sense into the so called "music" that is being cranked out now.

I lived in Malaysia my entire life, but I was actually born in America, making me an American citizen (I kept my citizenship, making be an ABC-American born Chinese), so in a couple years there is a chance for me to start living in the States. I come from a very typical Asian background, and any other career choice aside from Engineering, Law, Science or Medicine is seemingly unacceptable. I do not dislike any of those, but bass playing is still my what I find the most enjoyable and rewarding.

So, my question is, what do I do? What should I do? What can I do? Has anybody ever felt or experienced this, and can perhaps offer any advice? How do you convince your parents to accept this?

Sorry for the bloody novel I posted, and thanks in advance,
Edwin

I am quoting another TB user ...

"If you want to make a million dollars in music then start with 2 million"

There are many threads here where people "pay to play" or other threads where working band members do the math and realize that they are making less than minimum wage. Then there are other threads where people discuss the big investment in equipment and the small return from playing out.

I am in my 50s. In my 20s I had an epifany. I realized that I was not going to get rich playing music. I got a professional degree and a professional job. Now I have a good salary, a pension, a 401K, health benefits, paid holidays, and paid vacations. I would have none of those from music. Also I get to sleep in my own bed at night and see my family daily.

Music is still a big part of my life. I still play in bands and I get out in front of people from time to time, but it is more of an expensive hobby for me.

Music may seem glamorius to you now, but the reality is you have to play certain songs over and over to the point you can't stand it. I can get really boring. That is why so many musicians get into substance abuse ... to kill the boredom.

 

[bassdude51]

There are dreams. There is reality. There is luck.

Advice about making a career out of being a bass player. If that's what you really want to do, try for it!

As for changing modern society's perception of music, that will never happen. We can find a nitch, perhaps gather a small following but the days of one band or one genre of music capturing the attention of a large percentage of the world's attention are over!

There will never be another Elvis, The Beatles, Frank Sinatra, Louis Armstrong, etc. It's over!

I saw a news report on CBS news about graduates from Julliard New York. They can not make a living off of music! They all have side jobs or "day jobs" if you will that allows them to live so that they can play music.

Trying to be the next big thing in music is about as likely as a inner city basketball kid thinking that he will be the next Michael Jordan.

A nice dream but not reality.

 

[scotch]

...

Trying to be the next big thing in music is about as likely as a inner city basketball kid thinking that he will be the next Michael Jordan.

A nice dream but not reality.

Thank goodness becoming "the next big thing" isn't the only way to make a relatively comfortable living playing music full time!

It would help to know what the op wants to pursue more specifically and how flexible he or she is in that pursuit.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

Thank goodness becoming "the next big thing" isn't the only way to make a relatively comfortable living playing music full time!

Unfortunately, it kind of rapidly IS becoming the only way. Broadway shows are shrinking the number of live musicians, orchestral film scores are being recorded outside the US, clubs that still hire live music pay pretty much the same thing they did 30 to 50 years ago, US orchestras are going bankrupt right and left, jingle recording has been taken over by sampling keyboards, etc. The only guy I know making a serious living as a musician (MD for Rod Stewart, George Michaels, writes for commercials and films, has a group that tours, sideman w/Chris Botti etc) is EXTREMELY talented AND well educated. The folks I know who do Broadway type stuff are all pretty concerned about how long that's going to be around. Pretty much all of the jazz guys I know (of my generation and the generation before) are all either teaching academically or trying to get an academic position.

So sure, if you are in a scene that you've developed and are established therein, great. But when you look around, do you still see opportunity for someone coming into that scene and being successful? Or is it scuffle time until somebody decides to quit the scene and then there's room for readjustment.

 

[Telenovela]

I see a lot of negativity here about having a career as a musician.

If you are coming from the last few generations, I can see why this seems like a bad time to enter the business. Gigs that paid the bills in the 1970s don't exist the same way today, from broadway, club dates, orchestra dates, etc.

But I'm in my 20s in NYC and surrounded by professional musicians of my generation who are making it happen. The industry is changing and we're the ones writing the rules and charting out the waters.

And you know what? we're doing it. I've managed to release a few jazz records, tour internationally, play gigs that pay great, play gigs that pay terribly. I've taught piano guitar and bass to over 30 students a week, I've written music for film and TV.


Sure, I have to do a lot of things, but I love being a musician and I love them all.

The whole, 'get a day job, do music for fun' thing doesn't make sense to me. Of course, I gave the finger to everyone who told me that and did what I wanted anyway, so I guess there's that.

Honestly, the industry and the union dropped the ball for the last few decades, ultimately screwing themselves out of the equation. It's a tough world right now because everything is changing and those from the previous generation only see destruction, but if you're smart, you can see opportunity. Musicians need to get better organized, we need to exert the power we have as performers and intellectual property creators, and build a future that is better than the past.

If this is what you love to do, DO IT! You'll never be as good at something you hate as you will at something you love.

 

[jmattbassplaya]

I had the same dream in high school & managed to pull it off, I'm about 20 years into a career playing bass full time. It has been rewarding, but it has not been easy!

Keep a couple of larger concepts in mind:

No matter what you do, some kind of education is key. Not just to learn job-specific skills, but to learn to build a network and give you more options down the road. I never attended a university or college full time, but my early post-high school education included a fair amount of college-level music theory and a LOT of practical playing experience. I had already played well over a hundred shows in over 20 States before I started to make real $$$ playing bass and managed to make it my profession.

Playing bass for a living is most likely going to mean you will be "self employed". No one is going to give you affordable health insurance, decent retirement or a predictable income. Learn what being in business for yourself entails (hint: it has nothing to do with music or playing bass)! Expect to spend more time finding work, administrating, networking, travelling, etc than you do playing your instrument! Unless you are the one-in-a-thousand out of the one-in-a-million who manages to have enough success to pay someone else to run your business (management, agents, accountants and attorneys), you are a businessman and will spend an ungodly amount of time doing stuff that is mundane and has nothing to do with bass. Even if you are so lucky, there are still myriad business headaches!

When your "dream" becomes your "career", it's going to be different than you expect. The entertainment industry has become less profitable on all fronts over the last 10 years. It's harder now to have financial success. Sure, it's easier to get a little buzz going with YouTube and social media- but if you want to buy groceries, things get harder!


All of that said, there are many ways to enjoy a career in music! Performing in everything from original artist situations, cover/cruise/wedding bands, studio recording, education and teaching, music therapy, etc... Being prepared for as many scenarios as possible makes success much more likely. Education and playing experience are key. You NEED to invest in both in one form or another.

Good luck!

+1

I've put more of my business skills towards use in advancing my musical 'career' than I have my own music skills. The ability to network, work out contracts, figure out operational costs, potential profit margins, negotiate pay rates, etc... have all been more crucial in forwarding my goals as a bassist than actually playing bass has been lol.

 

[Wesley R]

One of the paths to happiness is following your passion. At age 60 I'll tell you that you should do that, but also there is no logical reason that your passion should have to pay the bills. Take care to build a secure life... education, good job, solid relationships, and put family in the center of all that. Develop your passion and spend time with it, you will be a stronger person for that.

Very well stated.

 

[Ed Fuqua]

But I'm in my 20s in NYC and surrounded by professional musicians of my generation who are making it happen. The industry is changing and we're the ones writing the rules and charting out the waters.

And you know what? we're doing it. I've managed to release a few jazz records, tour internationally, play gigs that pay great, play gigs that pay terribly. I've taught piano guitar and bass to over 30 students a week, I've written music for film and TV.

What did that look like, on your Schedule C for 2012? I'll take a ballpark...