Ambient/Post-Rock/Textural bass playing thread

[monsterthompson]

Plugin of interest. Q Clone.
It lets you sample the EQ curves of other plugins, but not dynamics like compression. Clever.
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Hey! Turns out I already own this as part of a bundle. It is almost like it is free

 

[Bob_Ross]

They came up with a way for FM to make sense.

Ah, you have my attention sir! I might have to go back and listen to that video. Back in the late 1980s I thought I'd finally gotten a good handle on FM ...or at least, Yamaha's (via Chowning's) version of FM. Spent a lot of time programming DX-7 IIFDs and dissecting other people's DX-7 patches. Got to the point where I could actually predict what turning this value to that range would do to a particular sound

...and then *poof* FM was uncool and you couldn't sell your DX-7 -- or, in my case, your TX802 -- fast enough. Talk about wasted brain cells.

i think it all comes down to finding a place where you can feel it in your body.

^^^This. QFT.

 

[monsterthompson]

it all comes down to finding a place where you can feel it in your body.

Comedy aside, having partial paralysis changed my relationship with rhythm/tempo/beats. They translate differently in my world. Even after a lifetime of learning and a decade of nerve damage.

 

[steubig]

View attachment 3895606

Comedy aside, having partial paralysis changed my relationship with rhythm/tempo/beats. They translate differently in my world. Even after a lifetime of learning and a decade of nerve damage.

that’s really interesting (and heavy).

not to soft-peddle this, can you describe how it changed? (sorry if that’s weird.).

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

View attachment 3895606

Comedy aside, having partial paralysis changed my relationship with rhythm/tempo/beats. They translate differently in my world. Even after a lifetime of learning and a decade of nerve damage.

One tuff mofo right there.

 

[JES]

View attachment 3895606

Comedy aside, having partial paralysis changed my relationship with rhythm/tempo/beats. They translate differently in my world. Even after a lifetime of learning and a decade of nerve damage.

if you’re willing to share, I’d love to hear more about how you feel rhythm, tempo and beats.

 

[Spectrum]

Ah, you have my attention sir! I might have to go back and listen to that video. Back in the late 1980s I thought I'd finally gotten a good handle on FM ...or at least, Yamaha's (via Chowning's) version of FM. Spent a lot of time programming DX-7 IIFDs and dissecting other people's DX-7 patches. Got to the point where I could actually predict what turning this value to that range would do to a particular sound

...and then *poof* FM was uncool and you couldn't sell your DX-7 -- or, in my case, your TX802 -- fast enough. Talk about wasted brain cells.




^^^This. QFT.

And now DX7's are fairly pricey. Friend of mine bought one about 2 years ago. searched around and got a nice one, paid mucho dinero for it. It came with some kind of memory cartridges, I forget exactly what they do, I'm guessing more stored presets. I don't know a whole lot about the DX7 but his sounds awesome.

 

[monsterthompson]

that’s really interesting (and heavy).

not to soft-peddle this, can you describe how it changed? (sorry if that’s weird.).

It's been a decade, and I've not been shy about it, so it isn't a terribly sensitive point.

So, I used to be a heavy groove and 4 on the floor rock/metal guy. I liked riffs that were fun to play, and the muscle memory was a big part of it. If the fingering of a riff amused me, then it would be something I kept in circulation. I wasn't much of a dancer, but I moved A LOT. I'd mosh and pogo and bang my head. Concerts were a sporting event, and if a band moved me, I'd move back. Pantera (despite Phil's issues), and Static X, and Ministry, and AC/DC, and Sabbath, and early Metallica and Megadeth were models for me. Instead of thinking in chord changes, I thought in riffs and fingering positions, and I envisioned fretting shapes in my head. I knew my timing was not great, so I gravitated to bands with phrasing that I could feel, even if I couldn't count the rhythm. Movement at this point in my life was less conscious and more reflexive.

After I was injured, movement became a very deliberate chore. The only way for me to get from A to B was slowly, and it wasn't fluid, at all. It was like the shields in Dune where to penetrate the armor you had to move below a certain speed threshold. For some muscles, any kind of reflex became hyper-reflexive so if I started to move my arm or leg too energetically, then the whole limb would freak out an lock up. It took the "feeling it" part right out of most things. Imagine something inspiring you to tap your toe, but the act of tapping either couldn't be done, or it could be done but it would occasionally and irregularly cause your leg to lock up and your arm to twitch and your breathing to get weird and make you have to pee immediately.

That's what started me on the ambient path. I already enjoyed it, but I wasn't interested in making it. Now, I can make patterns with sequencers or delays or loopers, instead of relying on my inconsistent muscle control. i can build huge washes of sound that don't have a driving beat. Now, it is about the mood and the texture, independent of the patterns. Or if there are patterns, I use an external device/machine to create them, and the patterns don't have to follow each other in sync. They can float independently. It is like galaxies in space, where you can identify planets orbited by moons, which are all slowly, though regularly orbiting a star. They are part of the same system, but they aren't uniform in their composition and path.

Hope that's not too clunky of an explanation.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

It's been a decade, and I've not been shy about it, so it isn't a terribly sensitive point.

So, I used to be a heavy groove and 4 on the floor rock/metal guy. I liked riffs that were fun to play, and the muscle memory was a big part of it. If the fingering of a riff amused me, then it would be something I kept in circulation. I wasn't much of a dancer, but I moved A LOT. I'd mosh and pogo and bang my head. Concerts were a sporting event, and if a band moved me, I'd move back. Pantera (despite Phil's issues), and Static X, and Ministry, and AC/DC, and Sabbath, and early Metallica and Megadeth were models for me. Instead of thinking in chord changes, I thought in riffs and fingering positions, and I envisioned fretting shapes in my head. I knew my timing was not great, so I gravitated to bands with phrasing that I could feel, even if I couldn't count the rhythm. Movement at this point in my life was less conscious and more reflexive.

After I was injured, movement became a very deliberate chore. The only way for me to get from A to B was slowly, and it wasn't fluid, at all. It was like the shields in Dune where to penetrate the armor you had to move below a certain speed threshold. For some muscles, any kind of reflex became hyper-reflexive so if I started to move my arm or leg too energetically, then the whole limb would freak out an lock up. It took the "feeling it" part right out of most things. Imagine something inspiring you to tap your toe, but the act of tapping either couldn't be done, or it could be done but it would occasionally and irregularly cause your leg to lock up and your arm to twitch and your breathing to get weird and make you have to pee immediately.

That's what started me on the ambient path. I already enjoyed it, but I wasn't interested in making it. Now, I can make patterns with sequencers or delays or loopers, instead of relying on my inconsistent muscle control. i can build huge washes of sound that don't have a driving beat. Now, it is about the mood and the texture, independent of the patterns. Or if there are patterns, I use an external device/machine to create them, and the patterns don't have to follow each other in sync. They can float independently. It is like galaxies in space, where you can identify planets orbited by moons, which are all slowly, though regularly orbiting a star. They are part of the same system, but they aren't uniform in their composition and path.

Hope that's not too clunky of an explanation.

Awesome share.
Thank you.

 

[JES]

That’s a great explanation. Thanks for sharing. I have developed hypersensitivity in my hands from a maintenance drug I’m on to keep some metastatic cancer under wraps (the drug works, so no complaints). I was always a physical player — started on upright. Now I wear gloves to play but have taken up touchstyle playing because it requires less repetitive motion than bass. I am still figuring out what it all means but it has shifted my music journey 90 degrees.

 

[monsterthompson]

I am still figuring out what it all means but it has shifted my music journey 90 degrees.

Feel free to PM any time if you ever want to chat about it outside of the context of the thread.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

This was a drum break sample only.
All made with only my SP. ¨mastering¨ done in Ableton.

Enjoy/cringe

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[Bob_Ross]

And now DX7's are fairly pricey.

Really?!?! Man, I still have the TX802, maybe I should look into selling it ...again. Last time I checked you could barely get $200 for one in mint condition.

 

[cosmicevan]

It's been a decade, and I've not been shy about it, so it isn't a terribly sensitive point.

So, I used to be a heavy groove and 4 on the floor rock/metal guy. I liked riffs that were fun to play, and the muscle memory was a big part of it. If the fingering of a riff amused me, then it would be something I kept in circulation. I wasn't much of a dancer, but I moved A LOT. I'd mosh and pogo and bang my head. Concerts were a sporting event, and if a band moved me, I'd move back. Pantera (despite Phil's issues), and Static X, and Ministry, and AC/DC, and Sabbath, and early Metallica and Megadeth were models for me. Instead of thinking in chord changes, I thought in riffs and fingering positions, and I envisioned fretting shapes in my head. I knew my timing was not great, so I gravitated to bands with phrasing that I could feel, even if I couldn't count the rhythm. Movement at this point in my life was less conscious and more reflexive.

After I was injured, movement became a very deliberate chore. The only way for me to get from A to B was slowly, and it wasn't fluid, at all. It was like the shields in Dune where to penetrate the armor you had to move below a certain speed threshold. For some muscles, any kind of reflex became hyper-reflexive so if I started to move my arm or leg too energetically, then the whole limb would freak out an lock up. It took the "feeling it" part right out of most things. Imagine something inspiring you to tap your toe, but the act of tapping either couldn't be done, or it could be done but it would occasionally and irregularly cause your leg to lock up and your arm to twitch and your breathing to get weird and make you have to pee immediately.

That's what started me on the ambient path. I already enjoyed it, but I wasn't interested in making it. Now, I can make patterns with sequencers or delays or loopers, instead of relying on my inconsistent muscle control. i can build huge washes of sound that don't have a driving beat. Now, it is about the mood and the texture, independent of the patterns. Or if there are patterns, I use an external device/machine to create them, and the patterns don't have to follow each other in sync. They can float independently. It is like galaxies in space, where you can identify planets orbited by moons, which are all slowly, though regularly orbiting a star. They are part of the same system, but they aren't uniform in their composition and path.

Hope that's not too clunky of an explanation.

I feel like we all kinda know each other and not trying to be too intrusive, but since you are sharing I'm uber curious about your injury. Tree top details if that's best, but curious what happened (if you'd rather not say, not offended...I get it).

I grew up on the same stuff...the reason I play bass is because of early Metallica (Anesthesia)...funny how far we drift or evolve rather. As for my musical and health journey - I have nothing to really compare. My big thing was getting arthritis in my 20's. I muscled through on a 36" scale for as long as I could (I find the tone of 36" to be what I look for in an instrument...something about it for me), but ultimately ended up switching to 32" scaled instruments which are more manageable and don't leave me in pain when I'm so inclined to play for stretches of several hours. I still have a 36" bass and play it here and there, but I can't bring it out to a jam with others because I just can't hang below the 5th fret...those stretches kill me and I lose my ability to keep up with moderate paced tempos. It really is crazy when your body can't keep up with your head. I'm not sure how old y'all are, but I get the vibe that I'm somewhere in the middle of regulars here at pushing 42 and in the past 5 years or so I've definitely seen major changes in everything. I'm definitely paying for some of my wanton abandonment and party boy nature of my youth and I kinda dread where this is going. I love this thread because it offers discussion around the promise of possibility. This thread is probably THE thread in the effects forum that is furthest focused from bass. Obviously we all play bass or did at some point, but this thread has become the spot (to me at least) where those of us interested in sounds beyond bass can chit chat. I'm getting a little too close to going modular...I'm kinda scared that I might buy a liquidated rig at some point.

 

[dukeorock]

Ah, you have my attention sir! I might have to go back and listen to that video. Back in the late 1980s I thought I'd finally gotten a good handle on FM ...or at least, Yamaha's (via Chowning's) version of FM. Spent a lot of time programming DX-7 IIFDs and dissecting other people's DX-7 patches. Got to the point where I could actually predict what turning this value to that range would do to a particular sound

...and then *poof* FM was uncool and you couldn't sell your DX-7 -- or, in my case, your TX802 -- fast enough. Talk about wasted brain cells.




^^^This. QFT.

from what I’ve read, the DX7 is one of the most, if not the most advanced synths ever made. Too bad I couldn’t make a decent patch on one to save my life
I flipped out over the FS1R when it first . came out, but wasn’t doing much electronic stuff at the time. Now they’re insanely expensive :/
I would gladly look into another FM synth at some point. Huge fan. Maybe the MegaFM, but I got my hands full with the EssenceFM for now.

It's been a decade, and I've not been shy about it, so it isn't a terribly sensitive point.

So, I used to be a heavy groove and 4 on the floor rock/metal guy. I liked riffs that were fun to play, and the muscle memory was a big part of it. If the fingering of a riff amused me, then it would be something I kept in circulation. I wasn't much of a dancer, but I moved A LOT. I'd mosh and pogo and bang my head. Concerts were a sporting event, and if a band moved me, I'd move back. Pantera (despite Phil's issues), and Static X, and Ministry, and AC/DC, and Sabbath, and early Metallica and Megadeth were models for me. Instead of thinking in chord changes, I thought in riffs and fingering positions, and I envisioned fretting shapes in my head. I knew my timing was not great, so I gravitated to bands with phrasing that I could feel, even if I couldn't count the rhythm. Movement at this point in my life was less conscious and more reflexive.

After I was injured, movement became a very deliberate chore. The only way for me to get from A to B was slowly, and it wasn't fluid, at all. It was like the shields in Dune where to penetrate the armor you had to move below a certain speed threshold. For some muscles, any kind of reflex became hyper-reflexive so if I started to move my arm or leg too energetically, then the whole limb would freak out an lock up. It took the "feeling it" part right out of most things. Imagine something inspiring you to tap your toe, but the act of tapping either couldn't be done, or it could be done but it would occasionally and irregularly cause your leg to lock up and your arm to twitch and your breathing to get weird and make you have to pee immediately.

That's what started me on the ambient path. I already enjoyed it, but I wasn't interested in making it. Now, I can make patterns with sequencers or delays or loopers, instead of relying on my inconsistent muscle control. i can build huge washes of sound that don't have a driving beat. Now, it is about the mood and the texture, independent of the patterns. Or if there are patterns, I use an external device/machine to create them, and the patterns don't have to follow each other in sync. They can float independently. It is like galaxies in space, where you can identify planets orbited by moons, which are all slowly, though regularly orbiting a star. They are part of the same system, but they aren't uniform in their composition and path.

Hope that's not too clunky of an explanation.

Thanks so much for sharing that!

 

[steubig]

It's been a decade, and I've not been shy about it, so it isn't a terribly sensitive point.

So, I used to be a heavy groove and 4 on the floor rock/metal guy. I liked riffs that were fun to play, and the muscle memory was a big part of it. If the fingering of a riff amused me, then it would be something I kept in circulation. I wasn't much of a dancer, but I moved A LOT. I'd mosh and pogo and bang my head. Concerts were a sporting event, and if a band moved me, I'd move back. Pantera (despite Phil's issues), and Static X, and Ministry, and AC/DC, and Sabbath, and early Metallica and Megadeth were models for me. Instead of thinking in chord changes, I thought in riffs and fingering positions, and I envisioned fretting shapes in my head. I knew my timing was not great, so I gravitated to bands with phrasing that I could feel, even if I couldn't count the rhythm. Movement at this point in my life was less conscious and more reflexive.

After I was injured, movement became a very deliberate chore. The only way for me to get from A to B was slowly, and it wasn't fluid, at all. It was like the shields in Dune where to penetrate the armor you had to move below a certain speed threshold. For some muscles, any kind of reflex became hyper-reflexive so if I started to move my arm or leg too energetically, then the whole limb would freak out an lock up. It took the "feeling it" part right out of most things. Imagine something inspiring you to tap your toe, but the act of tapping either couldn't be done, or it could be done but it would occasionally and irregularly cause your leg to lock up and your arm to twitch and your breathing to get weird and make you have to pee immediately.

That's what started me on the ambient path. I already enjoyed it, but I wasn't interested in making it. Now, I can make patterns with sequencers or delays or loopers, instead of relying on my inconsistent muscle control. i can build huge washes of sound that don't have a driving beat. Now, it is about the mood and the texture, independent of the patterns. Or if there are patterns, I use an external device/machine to create them, and the patterns don't have to follow each other in sync. They can float independently. It is like galaxies in space, where you can identify planets orbited by moons, which are all slowly, though regularly orbiting a star. They are part of the same system, but they aren't uniform in their composition and path.

Hope that's not too clunky of an explanation.

thank you.

 

[monsterthompson]

I'm uber curious about your injury. Tree top details if that's best, but curious what happened (if you'd rather not say, not offended...I get it).

I was mountain biking at a resort in Canada. I didn’t properly set my bike up after unpacking it from air travel, so the suspension got weird on a small obstacle, which sent me over the bar. I landed on my head, breaking my neck. I remember waking up when the medics arrived and thinking I was going to die. Not afraid, but aware. Next thing I knew, I was in a hospital with no sensation or movement below my shoulders, living on tubes and machines.

Spinal cord injuries are often two injuries. There’s the force of impact, and the pressure from the swelling. Doctors all thought I was going to be fully incapacitated for life. My best guess is that the swelling eased and the nerves recovered. Fortunately, the cord itself wasn’t torn or severed. The docs did have to fuse a couple of vertebrae.

It took me about a year to get back to work. Then I got back in a band. I was in pretty good shape before the crash, so I could still power through a lot by sheer will. My left side didn’t recover as well as my right. Most folks can’t tell what’s not working right.

Funny side note. I had been in a band with a big Vegas gig booked for the same week as my accident. I had an argument with the founding guitarist who then booted me out over it. If I hadn’t gotten into it with him, I’d have skipped the bike trip to play the gig, and still going off in some non ambient direction.

 

[steubig]

wow

 

[monsterthompson]

I love this thread because it offers discussion around the promise of possibility. This thread is probably THE thread in the effects forum that is furthest focused from bass. Obviously we all play bass or did at some point, but this thread has become the spot (to me at least) where those of us interested in sounds beyond bass can chit chat.

Yeah. It definitively drifts from the world of the P bass

I think there’s always a theme of low frequency instruments and ambient sounds. It gets pretty creative around here. I think lots of the topics are extensions of playing in unconventional ways. Bassists certainly have a philosophy and disposition that sets us apart from ambient guitarists or keyboardists, and even drummers. Lots of synth stuff is monophonic and the foundation of bass playing is based in single note parts. We don’t have a brain that looks at chords the same way as a guitarist or keyboardist, though we obviously need to understand harmony and chord changes. The application of that understanding is different.

Even DAW talk is helpful and related. Recording and processing for much of what we share here doesn’t fit a lot of the “conventional” production of rock or pop or jazz.

 

[theunknowndude]

Yeah. It definitively drifts from the world of the P bass

I think there’s always a theme of low frequency instruments and ambient sounds. It gets pretty creative around here. I think lots of the topics are extensions of playing in unconventional ways. Bassists certainly have a philosophy and disposition that sets us apart from ambient guitarists or keyboardists, and even drummers. Lots of synth stuff is monophonic and the foundation of bass playing is based in single note parts. We don’t have a brain that looks at chords the same way as a guitarist or keyboardist, though we obviously need to understand harmony and chord changes. The application of that understanding is different.

Even DAW talk is helpful and related. Recording and processing for much of what we share here doesn’t fit a lot of the “conventional” production of rock or pop or jazz.

funny you say this... I mean physically I’m in decent shape... although I picked my guitar up for the first time in ages and realised I have lost the ability to pick fast (you don’t use it you lose it right?) despite that I can play fast metal speeds with two fingers...
part of why I switched from guitar to bass is I think in riffs and feel a lot... I can’t play a 4/4 rock beat on a drum kit yet I can play a reasonable hip hop / off time beat...
anyway, long story short - even without bass chops as I hardly practice anymore, I THINK like a bass player in Odd ways and more monophonic. Funny how that kind of goes through in my composition and then spiraled into this with the ambient / post rock side... and then the odd sounds of synth side. Most of my “noodling” these days tends to be messing with effects... making soundscapes, just losing yourself of a note wrapped in distortion and reverb...
in some ways I kind of “get” what tool (I think it was Adam?)we’re saying in that you can feel / colour the sound... I still like a bit of structure but sometimes the mood of a riff can just give you certain feelings...

Anyway that’s my tangent of how I ended up a regular here... 35 with 4 kids and a full time job, I’m sure not 20 and jumping around to Metallica like I used to