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Ambient/Post-Rock/Textural bass playing thread

#8,181
lordradish said:
What kind of stuff? Most Berlin stuff I think of might have some high hats and occasional kick, unless you're talking about the live TD type stuff. The live TD stuff (Ricochet,etc) - I can't even fathom programming that on anything.

Didn't know you were a BS fan, I'm pretty hardcore on that stuff. Ever listen to Free System Projekt and Gert Emmens/Rudd Hejj?
Click to expand...

Yeah, basically that kind of frantic high hat thing you hear in that genre. Also, I like the percussion in Pink Floyd's On the Run, though it's not really "Berlin School" it's of the same era and seems related, with the sequencer and all.

As far as me being a BS fan I'm pretty sure I've mentioned it before. I am originally from the Philadelphia area, and U of Penn radio station there WXPN has a "spacemusic" show that runs every Saturday late night called Star's End which I've listened to since about 1993 or so. Thanks to streaming I still listen in DC.

They also have live shows called The Gatherings at the St. Mary's Chapel on the Penn campus about 4 times a year that feature BS'ish performers, and they are big, well run shows that draw a fairly large audience. Some of the groups I've seen there lean towards the ambient guitar side of things, though most are synthesizer based with the odd guitarist or other instruments. Usually, after the live set, they head down the street to the radio studio and do a set live on the air. Chuck Van Zyle runs both the radio show and the live shows. I can take a train there from DC in about 2 hours and walk to the show from 30th Street Station.

I may have seen Free System Projekt there; I've for sure heard them on the radio.

My favorite current artists would probably be Radio Massacre International, Air Sculpture, and some of Ian Boddy's stuff, all of whom I've seen in Philly. I also saw Johann Johannsson perform live there, before he was well known for film work; he had a synth and 3 or 4 string players and performed Fordlandia, with an awesome video backdrop. Can't wait for the pandemic to pass so I can go see some more shows.



This is a great video from the archives: RMI actually got to do a long set on MTV back in the 90s! I bet the MTV brass were kicking themselves for allowing such non-dance nerdiness on the air. The best part is the hostess joking with them; she likely has no clue what this genre of music is about lol. I spoke to these guys after a show in Philly about 6 or so years ago, really cool dudes.



And Johannsson RIP. This stuff is less electronic and more orchestral I guess, and it goes slow, but it is pretty awesome. Shame he died so young.

 
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#8,182
Speaking of firmware updates, I just updated the firmware in my 2 Moog Mother 32 units. Moog put this out about a month ago and uploaded a youtube video explaining how to do it, but I held back for a couple of reasons. For starters I didn't have any MIDI interface yet, now I have a good USB-to-MIDI cable. Secondly, my Moogs functioned quite well on the original firmware, so I feel like I was taking a slight risk by lobotomizing them and installing new. The update adds new functionality, but there wasn't anything broken to fix.

Now that's done I'm glad it's over with. I have all the cool new features. Moog is a company I feel is pretty trustworthy, and they are easy enough to contact if something goes wrong.

Generally, though, I hate the idea of needing firmware upgrades ad infinitum. Goes back to the discussion pages ago about gear lasting forever even after the manufacturer no longer supports it. Like, say, a vintage 70s synth hand-wired, with no IC chips and no firmware to worry about, or even an 80s Casio key board that is basically bulletproof as long as you care for it and store it properly.
 
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#8,184
monsterthompson said:
I’m getting the quarantine GAS.
OBNE Dweller and the Drone Rainger are on my short list. KMA Cirrus and SGFX Athens are still on my watch list, too. I’m hoping that once my Hilbish preamp gets here (soon) that I’ll cool my jets for a bit.
Click to expand...
That Dweller has my attention.
 
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#8,185
monsterthompson said:
I’m getting the quarantine GAS.
OBNE Dweller and the Drone Rainger are on my short list. KMA Cirrus and SGFX Athens are still on my watch list, too. I’m hoping that once my Hilbish preamp gets here (soon) that I’ll cool my jets for a bit.
Click to expand...
I want (want more than need.....) another Hm2......damn trends that skyrocket prices.....(mine is actually a BYOC Swede with exactly the same chip as the MIJ ones)

Even the crap Behringer clone has doubled in price. It sounds freakin awesome though,,,,,,just dont stare at it too hard....it might break

Jeez Godflesh and Entombed used those in the late 80s early 90s and now everyone is biting that shizzle.

:(
 
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#8,186
monsterthompson said:
I’m getting the quarantine GAS.
OBNE Dweller and the Drone Rainger are on my short list. KMA Cirrus and SGFX Athens are still on my watch list, too. I’m hoping that once my Hilbish preamp gets here (soon) that I’ll cool my jets for a bit.
Click to expand...
I think Hilbish did a great job with the preamp. It's interesting to compare it to my Model feT, which is voiced similarly but definitely has a smoother midrange

Got some GAS for the OBNE Dweller and Visitor as well, and I'm realizing how underrated SGFX is. I remember being disenchanted with the Cirrus after looking into it for some reason...
 
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#8,188
Spectrum said:
Yeah, basically that kind of frantic high hat thing you hear in that genre. Also, I like the percussion in Pink Floyd's On the Run, though it's not really "Berlin School" it's of the same era and seems related, with the sequencer and all.

As far as me being a BS fan I'm pretty sure I've mentioned it before. I am originally from the Philadelphia area, and U of Penn radio station there WXPN has a "spacemusic" show that runs every Saturday late night called Star's End which I've listened to since about 1993 or so. Thanks to streaming I still listen in DC.

They also have live shows called The Gatherings at the St. Mary's Chapel on the Penn campus about 4 times a year that feature BS'ish performers, and they are big, well run shows that draw a fairly large audience. Some of the groups I've seen there lean towards the ambient guitar side of things, though most are synthesizer based with the odd guitarist or other instruments. Usually, after the live set, they head down the street to the radio studio and do a set live on the air. Chuck Van Zyle runs both the radio show and the live shows. I can take a train there from DC in about 2 hours and walk to the show from 30th Street Station.

I may have seen Free System Projekt there; I've for sure heard them on the radio.

My favorite current artists would probably be Radio Massacre International, Air Sculpture, and some of Ian Boddy's stuff, all of whom I've seen in Philly. I also saw Johann Johannsson perform live there, before he was well known for film work; he had a synth and 3 or 4 string players and performed Fordlandia, with an awesome video backdrop. Can't wait for the pandemic to pass so I can go see some more shows.



This is a great video from the archives: RMI actually got to do a long set on MTV back in the 90s! I bet the MTV brass were kicking themselves for allowing such non-dance nerdiness on the air. The best part is the hostess joking with them; she likely has no clue what this genre of music is about lol. I spoke to these guys after a show in Philly about 6 or so years ago, really cool dudes.



And Johannsson RIP. This stuff is less electronic and more orchestral I guess, and it goes slow, but it is pretty awesome. Shame he died so young.

Click to expand...

Now that I think of it, I do remember you mentioning this. I forgot to mention RMI.

Unfortunately, I live in a part of the country where I can pretty much guarantee I won't hear any live BS... unless I make it, myself.
 
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#8,189
Spectrum said:
Speaking of firmware updates, I just updated the firmware in my 2 Moog Mother 32 units. Moog put this out about a month ago and uploaded a youtube video explaining how to do it, but I held back for a couple of reasons. For starters I didn't have any MIDI interface yet, now I have a good USB-to-MIDI cable. Secondly, my Moogs functioned quite well on the original firmware, so I feel like I was taking a slight risk by lobotomizing them and installing new. The update adds new functionality, but there wasn't anything broken to fix.

Now that's done I'm glad it's over with. I have all the cool new features. Moog is a company I feel is pretty trustworthy, and they are easy enough to contact if something goes wrong.

Generally, though, I hate the idea of needing firmware upgrades ad infinitum. Goes back to the discussion pages ago about gear lasting forever even after the manufacturer no longer supports it. Like, say, a vintage 70s synth hand-wired, with no IC chips and no firmware to worry about, or even an 80s Casio key board that is basically bulletproof as long as you care for it and store it properly.
Click to expand...
As to the endless firmware updates...

I think well-designed stuff is at less risk for that. There hasn't been a firmware update for my Moog Subsequent 37 in well over 2 years, maybe more, but although I could maybe think of one or two things that would enhance it, it really doesn't need it.

Contrast that with something like Korg.... as much as I love the Wavestate, they designed the interface with computers around the RDNIS device protocol, not sysex, so half the computers out there, for some reason, have connectivity issues, and then they all stop working, every time Windows updates. If they don't change that, it's pretty likely that 5 years from now, I won't be able to mess with my WS libraries. I think a lot of stuff gets rushed out the gate, nowadays, because everything is so hyped and competitive.

The Aeros Looper's been out for a year, and they still don't have all of the promised features implemented and working... we've more or less been beta testers since the thing came out. The one upside to that, however, is a lot of the current R&D on it is being based on customer feedback... they literally would have no clue what to do about making it usable for soundscapers and droners (eg seamless overdubs, etc) if they weren't having conversations about it with us in the forums.

The MPC Live was out for THREE YEARS before they finally fixed the multi-midi problem. Again, the rush...

With more and more computer-based stuff, this is going to become the norm, I'm afraid. I just wish they'd start their R&D with "How can we make it so someone can still use this product successfully, 10 years from now", instead of making that an afterthought.
 
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#8,190
monsterthompson said:
I’m getting the quarantine GAS.
OBNE Dweller and the Drone Rainger are on my short list. KMA Cirrus and SGFX Athens are still on my watch list, too. I’m hoping that once my Hilbish preamp gets here (soon) that I’ll cool my jets for a bit.
Click to expand...

My quarantine GAS is fully out of control. It doesn't help that I sold a bunch of old hobby knick knacks and have a nice sized fun money budget. I have been bringing in so much new stuff before quarantine and since that I need to just chill and explore what I have. The big challenge as I see it, is that it is easy to spend to time browsing stuff (especially during the work day or from a phone) when you are in a position that you can't be playing so more time is invested in digital browsing than hands on keys/strings/knobs, plus we watch these demos that usually sound great and then start getting that warm feeling of wanting to make those sounds ourselves. When browsing, you tend to see great deals or come across limited releases that you feel you can't pass up also.

My short list is:
- Moffenzeef Modular - stargazer (most likely going to move on one)
- Moffenzeef Modular - intensifie (most likely going to move on one)s
- checking out more hyped fuzzes that are universally loved
- other desktop noise synths/etc

...and then I've been looking at the Moog desktop units - DFAM, Mother32 and the like. I hear such mixed things with these, but feel like I might want to go down the rabbit hole. But again, those seem like reasonable time investments will be needed to learn how to control them deliberately and adding more things that I need to invest it is probably a bad idea.
 
#8,191
lordradish said:
As to the endless firmware updates...

I think well-designed stuff is at less risk for that. There hasn't been a firmware update for my Moog Subsequent 37 in well over 2 years, maybe more, but although I could maybe think of one or two things that would enhance it, it really doesn't need it.

Contrast that with something like Korg.... as much as I love the Wavestate, they designed the interface with computers around the RDNIS device protocol, not sysex, so half the computers out there, for some reason, have connectivity issues, and then they all stop working, every time Windows updates. If they don't change that, it's pretty likely that 5 years from now, I won't be able to mess with my WS libraries. I think a lot of stuff gets rushed out the gate, nowadays, because everything is so hyped and competitive.

The Aeros Looper's been out for a year, and they still don't have all of the promised features implemented and working... we've more or less been beta testers since the thing came out. The one upside to that, however, is a lot of the current R&D on it is being based on customer feedback... they literally would have no clue what to do about making it usable for soundscapers and droners (eg seamless overdubs, etc) if they weren't having conversations about it with us in the forums.

The MPC Live was out for THREE YEARS before they finally fixed the multi-midi problem. Again, the rush...

With more and more computer-based stuff, this is going to become the norm, I'm afraid. I just wish they'd start their R&D with "How can we make it so someone can still use this product successfully, 10 years from now", instead of making that an afterthought.
Click to expand...
One reason. Deadlines.

Édit 2 reason:
Lack of beta testing.

My 2 cents
 
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#8,193
lordradish said:
As to the endless firmware updates...

I think well-designed stuff is at less risk for that. There hasn't been a firmware update for my Moog Subsequent 37 in well over 2 years, maybe more, but although I could maybe think of one or two things that would enhance it, it really doesn't need it.

Contrast that with something like Korg.... as much as I love the Wavestate, they designed the interface with computers around the RDNIS device protocol, not sysex, so half the computers out there, for some reason, have connectivity issues, and then they all stop working, every time Windows updates. If they don't change that, it's pretty likely that 5 years from now, I won't be able to mess with my WS libraries. I think a lot of stuff gets rushed out the gate, nowadays, because everything is so hyped and competitive.

The Aeros Looper's been out for a year, and they still don't have all of the promised features implemented and working... we've more or less been beta testers since the thing came out. The one upside to that, however, is a lot of the current R&D on it is being based on customer feedback... they literally would have no clue what to do about making it usable for soundscapers and droners (eg seamless overdubs, etc) if they weren't having conversations about it with us in the forums.

The MPC Live was out for THREE YEARS before they finally fixed the multi-midi problem. Again, the rush...

With more and more computer-based stuff, this is going to become the norm, I'm afraid. I just wish they'd start their R&D with "How can we make it so someone can still use this product successfully, 10 years from now", instead of making that an afterthought.
Click to expand...

The Mother 32 is about 5 years old at this point, and this is the only firmware update so far, and even then it's more of an upgrade rather than a needed bug fix. So I agree with you that Moog is pretty good about this.

In the last few weeks I've been exploring the Mother 32's capabilities and learning how to do cool things I never knew it could do before. That patch bay is really powerful.
 
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#8,195
Spectrum said:
The Mother 32 is about 5 years old at this point, and this is the only firmware update so far, and even then it's more of an upgrade rather than a needed bug fix. So I agree with you that Moog is pretty good about this.

In the last few weeks I've been exploring the Mother 32's capabilities and learning how to do cool things I never knew it could do before. That patch bay is really powerful.
Click to expand...

Can I ask a question about the patchbay? Can you use CV from other non-Eurorack Moog stuff like the Moogerfoogers? Hopefully it would just require cables with the different sizes on each end. I have a few Moogerfoogers including the CP-251 control processor, so wondering if I could use those for increased functionality if I end up getting the Subharmonicon...
 
#8,196
lordradish said:
With more and more computer-based stuff, this is going to become the norm, I'm afraid. I just wish they'd start their R&D with "How can we make it so someone can still use this product successfully, 10 years from now", instead of making that an afterthought.
Click to expand...

I think this is an artifact of modern (agile) software development processes. Agile is all about releasing a minimum viable product so that you can make money during development and also get customer feedback to drive the future roadmap of the product.
 
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#8,197
hieronymous said:
Can I ask a question about the patchbay? Can you use CV from other non-Eurorack Moog stuff like the Moogerfoogers? Hopefully it would just require cables with the different sizes on each end. I have a few Moogerfoogers including the CP-251 control processor, so wondering if I could use those for increased functionality if I end up getting the Subharmonicon...
Click to expand...

I think so. Basically, it follows the Moog "volt per octave" CV standards and uses a 2-conductor patch cable. Moog specifically built it so you can take it out of its case and stick it in a Eurorack.

I don't have any modular stuff nor any Moogerfoogers, but the two Mother 32s talk to each other and also talk to the patchbay on my Arturia Microbrute with no problems.
 

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