Ambient/Post-Rock/Textural bass playing thread

[steubig]

@cosmicevan

i did a project that was a series of bandcamp releases that i called improv diaries. i’d do them once a month. put them up, warts and all. let them go for free.

imo, there are worse things than sharing one’s work.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

Okay, so I'm sitting here like a moron checking my email every minute to hear from Maurizio. This is stupid.

Do they have a vaccine for GAS? Seriously? Because this happens all the time. You think you have everything you want, then they invent something else.

A year from now, when my contract's up, my income's gonna be cut in half (I fully expect to have other work by then). So I keep using this as a lame-ass excuse... "well, better get that now, because you won't have money for it, next year."

Convert all your $$ in Canadian funds.
Problem solved.
Everything is going to double in price for ya instantly.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

@cosmicevan

i did a project that was a series of bandcamp releases that i called improv diaries. i’d do them once a month. put them up, warts and all. let them go for free.

imo, there are worse things than sharing one’s work.

Re: warts. (Mistakes, etc....I assume.)

I really dig imperfections.
It makes it human.

 

[steubig]

Re: warts. (Mistakes, etc....I assume.)

I really dig imperfections.
It makes it human.

mistakes. bad ideas. bad execution of ideas. bad intonation. bad phrasing.

that’s not all it is (i don’t think).

 

[monsterthompson]

man, trying to cure my fix-it-itis is harder than curing GAS.
play, listen, reject. play listen, edit, reject. play, listen, edit, edit, reject.

 

[steubig]

man, trying to cure my fix-it-itis is harder than curing GAS.
play, listen, reject. play listen, edit, reject. play, listen, edit, edit, reject.

is that one piece?

 

[monsterthompson]

is that one piece?

Just a brief representation of how some days feel, even when I tell myself the point is to just get a recoding of an idea down so I can revisit it later. It’s probably why I haven’t been more successful. Getting stuck sacrificing the good for the perfect isn’t the most creative path.

 

[lordradish]

Maybe ask him if deals can be had for a bulk order. I'd be very serious on getting in on one of these especially if he chops off some $ if we order a few in one shot.

I am a big fan of Chris' work (also CB that you play), but the lead times on the website are listed at like a year and a half and I've heard some stories that people have been waiting on instruments from Chris for an unreasonable amount of time...plus I'm already waiting on a Carl Thompson for about a year and a half, if not more.

Having dealt with both C's, they both do great work, but in terms of communication, no comparison... Cliff Bordwell always got back to me ASAP, no matter how many times I contacted him, and you know how it is when you're first figuring out a custom bass, lots of questions, changed minds, etc. Chris just often took a long time to get back to me on certain things. I think he's overstretched, I'm glad I had mine before he got involved with Wish Bass, because from what I've heard, he's even less communicative, now.

Yearlong waits suck! I think it was about 6 months or so for the Stammie, and the CB was over a year. I remember, it arrived THE DAY BEFORE I LEFT FOR BELIZE AND GUATEMALA for a few weeks. That was some bad timing.
But hey, the waiting list for a Wal is over 2 years now, and you can't get one for under 7 grand. Got mine for 2500, used, about 20 years ago, sight unseen, from a guy in Toronto on ebay.

 

[lordradish]

Just a brief representation of how some days feel, even when I tell myself the point is to just get a recoding of an idea down so I can revisit it later. It’s probably why I haven’t been more successful. Getting stuck sacrificing the good for the perfect isn’t the most creative path.

I think we all had a big conversation about this a few months ago, that 'it's never done/good enough' thing. I've actually gotten a lot better, once I finally accepted that not everything I do and finish has to be album-quality stuff.

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

I think we all had a big conversation about this a few months ago, that 'it's never done/good enough' thing. I've actually gotten a lot better, once I finally accepted that not everything I do and finish has to be album-quality stuff.

Indeed, you have to actually practice creating stuff.
Some of it is good, some of it is just plain crap.

This reminds me of 9th Wonder (legendary beatmaker....if anyone is wondering) He had this 30 by Thursday kinda thing going on for a long time as a practice routine.

He would start on Monday and would not stop until he had at least 30 beats .....deadline....Thursday sharp.
All this because he heard that Pete Rock would do 25 beats a week,.

Now that is a work ethic. I would pay anything to be a fly on the wall to watch him go ninja steez on his MPC chopping for 20 hours straight.

Here is the video where he talks about this concept.....and shows you what he sampled for the Duckworth song of DAMN (its actually Kendrick Lamar’s real last name).

3:55 for when he talks about the 30 before Thursday thing.

 

[steubig]

i asked about it being one piece cause i've gone through many days *or weeks* of that sort of process (or just being at a loss on *what* i could do to move on, if anything) on one piece. sometimes it's just beating my head against a wall . . . and sometimes i actually have a breakthrough.

sometimes the hardest thing to know is when it's just bad piece and will never work.

like @ugly_bassplayer mentioned above, often it's just putting in the time/work. hopefully it makes you better or gets you to where you want to go. i like to set tasks/deadlines for myself, which often helps me.

and a lot of times, it's just a leap of faith . . .

i have one friend who is doing really interesting things and has been very reticent about showing people. when he finally did, he got some really good feedback.

anyway, i've heard some really amazing stuff from folks in this thread . . .

 

[ugly_bassplayer]

i asked about it being one piece cause i've gone through many days *or weeks* of that sort of process (or just being at a loss on *what* i could do to move on, if anything) on one piece. sometimes it's just beating my head against a wall . . . and sometimes i actually have a breakthrough.

sometimes the hardest thing to know is when it's just bad piece and will never work.

like @ugly_bassplayer mentioned above, often it's just putting in the time/work. hopefully it makes you better or gets you to where you want to go. i like to set tasks/deadlines for myself, which often helps me.

and a lot of times, it's just a leap of faith . . .

i have one friend who is doing really interesting things and has been very reticent about showing people. when he finally did, he got some really good feedback.

anyway, i've heard some really amazing stuff from folks in this thread . . .

Very well put. But it did take me years to build up the confidence to do my own stuff and put it out.
For me it all comes down to just doing it.....going forward. Putting in the work.
If it’s crap, well its crap....on to the next one. I forget who said : “you just found a new thing\way that doesn’t work”.....(or something along those lines)

Last thing I want is many years from now and having regrets of ....”I should have done this”.....“Wish I had done that”......”I dreamed of making an album”......
At least I can say...yes...I did this....here it is.
I didn’t sit on my @$$ and stay complacent.

 

[steubig]

totally.

i decided to replace the “fear of failure” with the “fear of not doing.”

 

[lordradish]

Very well put. But it did take me years to build up the confidence to do my own stuff and put it out.

Funny story about that. I've had quite a good run, musically, especially for a self-taught guy who lives in VT... I've been playing for 36 years now... jammed with Bernie Worrell, opened up for John Scofield at the headlining of the big jazz fest up here, a few other great things. By and large, I don't get stage fright. Once I hear the applause (you know, not nightclub applause, where you hear individual people - theater applause where it's a big unified sound) after our first song at the Sco show, I never got it again. Not playing to thousands at festivals, or for opening up for famous people. I even held my own with Keith Jarrett's kid, who's one of the best damn drummers in the northeast. not nervous, excited.....Until...

Most of you know I started doing that synth thing with my duo, and had a few little synth gatherings, attended by maybe 30 people, back in January, again in Feb.

My damn legs were SHAKING. Like Elvis, when they wouldn't show his hips on tv in the 50's shaking. Like Ren in Ren and Stimpy when he was losing touch with reality. Dry mouth. The sweats.

Yeah, 30 people, in a tiny VT town, in some small community arts center, 15 minutes, not really playing something technically difficult, and I was scared crapless. Why? Because this was MY baby. Yeah, my basslines in a band are my baby, as are a few of the songs some bands have played, but that's not really personal in the same way. This was coming from a place deep inside me, and I and my duo partner were the focus, not 6 band members and a huge horn section, where I can blend into the background.

And when we got the biggest applause of the night, all was well, again, but damn, when you're out there naked like that, it's not easy. Putting stuff out is like that, too.

 

[Spectrum]

Funny story about that. I've had quite a good run, musically, especially for a self-taught guy who lives in VT... I've been playing for 36 years now... jammed with Bernie Worrell, opened up for John Scofield at the headlining of the big jazz fest up here, a few other great things. By and large, I don't get stage fright. Once I hear the applause (you know, not nightclub applause, where you hear individual people - theater applause where it's a big unified sound) after our first song at the Sco show, I never got it again. Not playing to thousands at festivals, or for opening up for famous people. I even held my own with Keith Jarrett's kid, who's one of the best damn drummers in the northeast. not nervous, excited.....Until...

Most of you know I started doing that synth thing with my duo, and had a few little synth gatherings, attended by maybe 30 people, back in January, again in Feb.

My damn legs were SHAKING. Like Elvis, when they wouldn't show his hips on tv in the 50's shaking. Like Ren in Ren and Stimpy when he was losing touch with reality. Dry mouth. The sweats.

Yeah, 30 people, in a tiny VT town, in some small community arts center, 15 minutes, not really playing something technically difficult, and I was scared crapless. Why? Because this was MY baby. Yeah, my basslines in a band are my baby, as are a few of the songs some bands have played, but that's not really personal in the same way. This was coming from a place deep inside me, and I and my duo partner were the focus, not 6 band members and a huge horn section, where I can blend into the background.

And when we got the biggest applause of the night, all was well, again, but damn, when you're out there naked like that, it's not easy. Putting stuff out is like that, too.

At least you had bandmates. When I do electronic shows, usually 3 or 4 times a year, I'm up there by my lonesome with a metric crap ton of gear to set up and control. I find this way harder than playing bass in a rock band. And only about 1 out of 4 of my performances don't suck by my standards. And I'm usually playing to a handful of noise heads, some of whom are busy looking at their phones.

Oddly, I did one fairly big show last fall in front of a lot of people. A really famous electronic musician was up right after me, so there were a lot of people there because of him. I rehearsed my ass off, got my crap together, and for once managed to not screw up. Maybe my best performance so far. Good confidence booster.

Someday I'd like to have a three piece band like Tangerine Dream did in the mid 70s to help spread the load. Maybe. Being solo has its own benefits as well.

 

[lordradish]

At least you had bandmates. When I do electronic shows, usually 3 or 4 times a year, I'm up there by my lonesome with a metric crap ton of gear to set up and control. I find this way harder than playing bass in a rock band. And only about 1 out of 4 of my performances don't suck by my standards. And I'm usually playing to a handful of noise heads, some of whom are busy looking at their phones.

Oddly, I did one fairly big show last fall in front of a lot of people. A really famous electronic musician was up right after me, so there were a lot of people there because of him. I rehearsed my ass off, got my crap together, and for once managed to not screw up. Maybe my best performance so far. Good confidence booster.

Someday I'd like to have a three piece band like Tangerine Dream did in the mid 70s to help spread the load. Maybe. Being solo has its own benefits as well.

Yeah, a TD type setup would be nice. I know a drummer who I've played with before who does electronics that would be a good fit, but his wife's an overbearing no-talent nutball who tries to weasel her way into every one of his projects, so I don't play with him anymore. Sad, cuz we really click.

I do think that after doing this, I might be nervous on a solo show, but maybe not. I still don't even know when I'll perform again, thanks, COVID.

 

[lordradish]

And I'm usually playing to a handful of noise heads, some of whom are busy looking at their phones.

Funny, although there were some noiseheads playing, the audience seemed much more into the esoteric, composed type stuff. It was so strange to watch how intently some of them were concentrating on our music. If there were a lot of noiseheads in the audience, it could have gone either way... I might have been less nervous because I feel like I wasn't playing for a crowd looking for intricate, composed stuff and were more open, but I'd also perhaps worry that they'd think I was being a pretentious ass.

 

[steubig]

i’m always nervous
before gigs. especially when there are other players i respect in the room.

and i know that any bass player in the room knows what a fraud i am.


re pretentious: it’s pretentious just to get on stage, so might as well go for it and enjoy it.

 

[lordradish]

i’m always nervous
before gigs. especially when there are other players i respect in the room.

and i know that any bass player in the room knows what a fraud i am.

I do admit to getting a twinge of nervousness when there's someone I really respect in the room (aw, man, he's gonna think I'm such a hack). But that's often followed, quickly, by a "F- em. This is who I am, and if I'm putting my best out there, that's it. I'm playing for me, not them."

I'm probably less bothered by other bassists in the room, because they likely won't be hiring me no matter how good or bad I play.

 

[lordradish]

i’m always nervous
before gigs. especially when there are other players i respect in the room.

and i know that any bass player in the room knows what a fraud i am.


re pretentious: it’s pretentious just to get on stage, so might as well go for it and enjoy it.

I will say, after hearing your stuff, I have no idea why you'd be nervous. You slay. Is it just the big gigs? Get nervous in a small coffee house gig?