Are bass amps obsolete?

[BurningSkies]

I like to think so! I really only work with two sound guys, one of whom I've been working with for 6 years and the other for 2.

At any rate, I think the fact that some bass players on the forum get walked on and skimmed over by sound-guys because they either 1) aren't assertive about giving input on their tone or 2) don't bring the appropriate equipment to achieve said tone is a little bit disappointing.

Unless something goes terribly wrong, having a friendly professional conversation with a sound engineer works way better than walking in a room and demanding. That includes having properly advanced the gig, provided good tech documents, etc.

You're either playing a limited number of venues or have enough band success to have a dedicated full time touring sound engineer on board. I fall above the first but below the second. We average about 100 gigs a year in probably something like 50-70 different venues. There's only a few where I've walked on stage to find someone that I couldn't comfortably say "this is what I like to do and the usual way we proceed, let's talk".

 

[Hambone70]

IMO, it's more about the sound quality than the look.

And with the quality and low cost of modern PA gear, bands can do their own sound. In many cases, no need for a dedicated engineer.

 

[SactoBass]

No. Bass amps are not obsolete.

I much prefer having an amp. Much!

 

[BlueShox]

Unless something goes terribly wrong, having a friendly professional conversation with a sound engineer works way better than walking in a room and demanding. That includes having properly advanced the gig, provided good tech documents, etc.

You're either playing a limited number of venues or have enough band success to have a dedicated full time touring sound engineer on board. I fall above the first but below the second. We average about 100 gigs a year in probably something like 50-70 different venues. There's only a few where I've walked on stage to find someone that I couldn't comfortably say "this is what I like to do and the usual way we proceed, let's talk".

I do believe you took my use of "demand" very literal. In the event that our sound-guy was not available, I would not run up to the venue provided help as soon as he pulled in the parking lot to begin informing him of my preferred methods of sending a signal. During sound check, when it came time to talk about bass, I would politely explain that I have a DI preamp on my pedalboard that I have a lot of experience with and I would state my strong preference be for him to not simply plug my pre-eq signal into a Radial DI to send to FOH.

My main gig has an auxiliary member who doubles as a dedicated sound guy. When we started using tracks and in-ear monitors it became necessary. As an originals act, it can be challenging to get the appropriate mix especially if the venue already has a sound-guy who is accustomed to setting pre-determined levels because he "knows" how a rock band is supposed to sound. It has been very easy having a well experienced tech of our own who can communicate and collaborate to get our needs met.

 

[Slevage]

I like an amp on stage.

I often use a 1-12 combo.

Even when I control my own FOH, I use a 1-10 combo for my stage monitor.

 

[Scott Baiowulf]

They don't seem like they be obsolete anytime soon as I've yet to play a club where I can trust I'll be able to consistently hear myself in the monitors

 

[DonaldR]

Playing without an amp for 10 years. I developed my sound around: preamps, effects, cab sims and DI.
I have an SVT and 8x10" emulation in my Eleven Rack (I also play electric guitar). That's the sound I hear on stage and from FOH.
When the guitar player is using my Eleven Rack I'm using an Ampeg SCR-DI, same good sound.
Drummer is using V-Drums. So we are all direct.
We don't use IEM as we don't need it. We simply use 1-2 powered PA cab as monitors turned our side. We always have 1-2 subs, so I feel my bass as much as a real amp (if not even better). The sound is so well balanced and we don't have ears ringing at the end of the night.
Same setup for home: 1x12" powered top + 1x12" sub. I have more fun than when I had an amp.

 

[MojoPenguin]

In doubt having a nice preamp is a safe bet I'd say.

 

[oZZma]

We'll probably all have wireless basses with transmitters you can't see that send a signal directly to the computer used to run sound (that is the size of a pack of gum). Every audience member will be wearing headphones (tiny earbuds) that allow them to control the volume of their live band. Take out your earbuds and all you will hear are people talking and the sound of sticks hitting electronic drums pads. Your average bar will sound like a library until you put in earbuds.

So, not yet... but it's coming.

Kill me before it happens

 

[Christcr]

Are bass amps obsolete?

No.

And if/when they become obsolete, that's when I will stop playing bass live and do guitar, mandolin, upright bass, etc in an acoustic-only band.

I hate the sound of electric bass through in-ears and I hate the way 99% of the "sound technicians" (if we can call them that) at the mixing board EQ the bass. Not only that, I've yet to hear a stage monitor that doesn't make the bass sound like crap.

At one point, my desire to perform prompted me into tolerating idiotic sound men, bass through stage monitors, and in-ear monitors. At this point, I simply refuse. No amp, find someone else--it doesn't bother me because when I can have more fun sitting at home playing along to MP3s (WITH a small amp) than performing on stage... well, that's when I simply don't care whether I perform live or not.

Luckily, the band I'm in now does things retro... only the vocals go through the PA system and NO sound man. And it hasn't sounded this good to me in a long time. Everyone knows where their volume should be and where they should be in the mix. Once in awhile we also run the bass drum through the PA, but not much. Then again, we aren't loud, nobody in the band is a showboat/sonic hog, and all of us have been doing it for thirty plus years.

 

[DeltaDelta]

Playing without an amp for 10 years. I developed my sound around: preamps, effects, cab sims and DI.
I have an SVT and 8x10" emulation in my Eleven Rack (I also play electric guitar). That's the sound I hear on stage and from FOH.
When the guitar player is using my Eleven Rack I'm using an Ampeg SCR-DI, same good sound.
Drummer is using V-Drums. So we are all direct.
We don't use IEM as we don't need it. We simply use 1-2 powered PA cab as monitors turned our side. We always have 1-2 subs, so I feel my bass as much as a real amp (if not even better). The sound is so well balanced and we don't have ears ringing at the end of the night.
Same setup for home: 1x12" powered top + 1x12" sub. I have more fun than when I had an amp.

Nice clean setup.

 

[RoaDan]

Bass amps are not simply about convenience and/or practicality (or the lack thereof) for many of us.

I simply enjoy hearing myself through speakers. When I can, I will bring an amp. If I can get away with it, I'll bring an Ampeg SVT. The sound of that heavy beast makes me smile.

They absolutely will be less common in a decade or so. We'll probably all have wireless basses with transmitters you can't see that send a signal directly to the computer used to run sound (that is the size of a pack of gum). Every audience member will be wearing headphones (tiny earbuds) that allow them to control the volume of their live band. Take out your earbuds and all you will hear are people talking and the sound of sticks hitting electronic drums pads. Your average bar will sound like a library until you put in earbuds.

So, not yet... but it's coming.

That sounds like a nightmare...

 

[B-Lo]

Interesting debate. Being that I'm the new kid on the block, IEMs are what I cut my teeth on and all I've known for the past few years and I'm completely comfortable with them (probably because that's what I started with...subs being on both sides of the stage with the typical array of mains, stage monitors, etc).

I have a Rumble 500 combo and never needed to invest in anything beyond that because I can count on one hand the number of times it has left my home.

It probably helps that I was running sound well before I even first laid hands on a bass and I have confidence in our sound guys and/or the presets on the FOH board (Yamaha TF5 or Behringer X32 depending on the venue I'm playing). I know that what I'm hearing in my IEMs are being translated out to the house pretty well...I get it that I'm probably in the minority though lol.

 

[RoaDan]

I play in a rock n' roll DANCE band. I have no idea how earbuds would work on the dance floor but if people want to talk and dance at the same time... you see where I am going with this... not every show is a concert. In any case, I love my amps, speakers and the ability to feel the sound. That does not happen if all I am getting pushed back to me is coming from some monitor, either floor or in the ear. I quit playing at our church because they went full in ear, no amps on stage. Talk about inspiration-less. I am also tired of sound-persons who want to control everything... especially those that are not members of the band (rented PA's that come with an "engineer"). I work with my gear to achieve the desired sound. FOH dudes or dude-ettes cannot get my sound from their speakers but they can make sure there is a balance... that is their job. Not to modify my sound but to enhance it.

 

[RoaDan]

Guess you're playing fancier places than me. Many of my gigs these days only have PA support for vocals etc.

Bingo!!!

 

[Microbass]

After seeing a band fully ampless for the first time last night I say no. A really good band who did play well just came across as lifeless and flat. It was really disappointing.

Long live the backlined band!

 

[Vinny Vincenzo]

No.

And if/when they become obsolete, that's when I will stop playing bass live and do guitar, mandolin, upright bass, etc in an acoustic-only band.

I hate the sound of electric bass through in-ears and I hate the way 99% of the "sound technicians" (if we can call them that) at the mixing board EQ the bass. Not only that, I've yet to hear a stage monitor that doesn't make the bass sound like crap.

At one point, my desire to perform prompted me into tolerating idiotic sound men, bass through stage monitors, and in-ear monitors. At this point, I simply refuse. No amp, find someone else--it doesn't bother me because when I can have more fun sitting at home playing along to MP3s (WITH a small amp) than performing on stage... well, that's when I simply don't care whether I perform live or not.

Luckily, the band I'm in now does things retro... only the vocals go through the PA system and NO sound man. And it hasn't sounded this good to me in a long time. Everyone knows where their volume should be and where they should be in the mix. Once in awhile we also run the bass drum through the PA, but not much. Then again, we aren't loud, nobody in the band is a showboat/sonic hog, and all of us have been doing it for thirty plus years.

Amen to that!

 

[fdeck]

I play mostly jazz, plus some other stuff like accompanying fiddle music. Often, I am the only amplified instrument on stage. When there is a PA, it's sufficient for vocals and treble instruments. The most efficient way to manage sound for these gigs is to let the instruments that need amplification, like bass and keyboard, be self amplified. Usually, gains are low enough in the PA that bleed from the speakers is enough for monitoring without having to worry about feedback.

The other thing about those gigs has to do with how the amplified sound is controlled. These bands are more like classical chamber groups than they are like rock bands. Players prefer to balance their own sound by ear from the stage. Years of playing and listening gives players a sense of how something will sound in the audience. There is rarely a sound tech.

Even for rock 'n' roll, I prefer when bands are amplified in this way. Operating a full blown PA with subs and monitors, without oppressing both the band and the audience, demands more skill and musicality from the sound crew than I think most bands realize.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

Guitar players are more often the offenders. A 30w amp screaming from stage. We're dealing with that issue on stage right now....

I agree wholeheartedly, IME. I've played with two outstanding guitarist/lead vocalists in two different bands who both could, and often did, obliterate the onstage mix with 30 to 45 watt combo amps. Then the drummer would start hitting harder.....

I was using a 1000 watt G-K amp with one of the guitarists, and his combo amp could bury my G-K. Same with the other guitarist, but I was using my Demeter/Crest CA9 rackmount and a pair of Bergantinos, and that guitarist could make me instantly inaudible with a Mesa Boogie 2×12 combo. Thank goodness for earplugs in both of these bands.

I would've looked for different bands with less volume, but both bands paid very well, and we were constantly booked. I also counted on my gigging income to make ends meet at home at the time.

 

[InhumanResource]

In every situation I have played in the last several years FOH has controlled the bass, volume and tone. My stage amp, when I have occasion to use one, serves as my personal monitor. This is not only on big stages but also in small clubs when band leader provides sound and mix. FOH always wants the stage volume down so they can control the mix. And yet, it seems almost every day, a new bass amp is out.
Thoughts?

I love having an amp, but from a technical perspective you don't NEED one.

Word around here is at the good rooms (yes, I realize this means I am not getting those gigs and just told everybody) the engineers are telling bands to show up and just plug into a mixer for the in-ear monitors, sound check, play, get the hell out.

Personally I would love to have this situation. I need better gigs.