Are modern amps "harsher"?

[Maynjo]

This is a pretty good demo of the AG 700. I feel like Aguilars studio videos do make it sound pretty harsh. This one seems more accurate to me.

 

[agedhorse]

I'm not sure what you mean by "old A/B amps". Sure, the market has an upswinging trend in class D, but there's still a VERY HIGH demand for BRAND NEW "old A/B amps" in the professional/amateur market. Not everyone is going out and selling their gear either.

Looking around at the market as a whole, I'm not seeing this...

 

[Coolhandjjl]

I've a Demeter VTBP-M-800D, and a Orange TB1000H. They are on opposite sides of the tonal spectrum. Neither is what I would ever describe as 'harsh'.

...Sure, the market has an upswinging trend in class D...

Upswing? I remember way back in January of 2010, I spoke to the buyer of a large locally owned music store after he came back from NAMM. His only comment was It's all going Class D man...

I would surmise that today is full out market dominance of Class D. (Yes, I am aware there are also A/B offerings by manufacturers out there, as well as G and H)

But when market stalwarts like Ampeg get "acquired" by a private equity firm, you know it's a different ball game today. (Which is typically a hail mary before the banks and other investors force a liquidation to get their money back)

 

[PDGood]

The new ones don't sound harsher to me. I've got Mesa D800+, LMlll, and Ampeg PF350.
I used to have Acoutic 370, Peaveys, Fender 400PS.
Each is different from the other. Some more aggresive than others, but I can't say it's related to old vs new.

 

[RickyWoo]

Looking around at the market as a whole, I'm not seeing this...

Admittedly and somewhat ignorantly, I was lumping class A in with class AB here. 100% my bad. I clarified myself afterward. And (again) I agree.

 

[RickyWoo]

Upswing? I remember way back in January of 2010, I spoke to the buyer of a large locally owned music store after he came back from NAMM. His only comment was It's all going Class D man...

I would surmise that today is full out market dominance of Class D. (Yes, I am aware there are also A/B offerings by manufacturers out there, as well as G and H)

But when market stalwarts like Ampeg get "acquired" by a private equity firm, you know it's a different ball game today. (Which is typically a hail mary before the banks and other investors force a liquidation to get their money back)

Again. I lumped class A into A/B. I misspoke. So everyone's clear... I agree that class D trumps A/B. And it's exactly the reason why I bought a class D amplifier myself. It was a misunderstanding on my part.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

A or A/B, doesn't matter. (Were there any bass gear mfgrs using Class A power-amp sections? Pre-amp sections, yes.)
Class D is here to stay as to where the market is until something new arrives, (but it won't be dominated A/B again).

 

[pigpen1]

This is a pretty good demo of the AG 700. I feel like Aguilars studio videos do make it sound pretty harsh. This one seems more accurate to me.

I think its helpful when people post examples, like this, when we talk about these kinds of things. I've seen this video before, just watched it again. Honestly, set flat, it sounds lifeless and yes, "harsh" to me. But you don't have to leave it flat, of course. It doesn't get what I'd call a rich, warm sound until the last playing example.

Like I posted earlier at about 3:20 in is what I'm call "warm and round"

 

[rockosocko]

I've been using Epifani amps for a number of years. For my part, they are far from harsh, I've often been complimented on how warm my sound is.

 

[Maynjo]

I think its helpful when people post examples, like this, when we talk about these kinds of things. I've seen this video before, just watched it again. Honestly, set flat, it sounds lifeless and yes, "harsh" to me. But you don't have to leave it flat, of course. It doesn't get what I'd call a rich, warm sound until the last playing example.

Like I posted earlier at about 3:20 in is what I'm call "warm and round"

I agree with you, that bass sounds amazing, I'm just not sure how much of that has to with the amp, or if it's the bass, or if it's a combination of the two.

 

[pigpen1]

I agree with you, that bass sounds amazing, I'm just not sure how much of that has to with the amp, or if it's the bass, or if it's a combination of the two.

Or what is done in post production. You never know with youtube

 

[PullThePlug]

Whoa, not at all.

I'll take a Mesa subway over a Diesel any day of the week. You just can't EQ out those harsh unmusical high mids in the Diesel cabs.

 

[groooooove]

i sold my genzler magellan 800 because it was too warm and round for my taste.

 

[pigpen1]

i sold my genzler magellan 800 because it was too warm and round for my taste.

What kind of stuff do you normally play?

 

[Passinwind]

A lot of us are I think. Not everybody wants a Jaco or Flea type of sound. Some of us even don't care for slapping and popping. At all.

Big world. There's room for all tastes.

Yep, absolutely.

But I think it's kind of hilarious that the Jaco or Flea or Stanley or Marcus tones are spoken of by some as modern. If those tones were cars they'd be antiques. NTTAWWT...

 

[BuffaloBill]

I think they are. I really do. It's been discussed to death on here before in the context of class D vs everything else and the discussion always ends with people saying its not the class of the amp, but the designer's choices. Having said that, are modern designs trending "harsher"?

I feel like the emphasis on warm, round sounding tones has taken a backseat to clarity? I quite playing for a long time and when I started again, I noticed this immediately.

The old amps you're comparing to are how old??? 1960s-70s-80s-90s-2000s??
Speakers, tweeters and cabinets???

 

[pigpen1]

The old amps you're comparing to are how old??? 1960s-70s-80s-90s-2000s??
Speakers, tweeters and cabinets???

Mostly 90s and 2000s up to about 2006. So up to the class d revolution.

 

[Acoustic356]

After reading this post and several others, it occurs that the terms I'm using to describe the sound I'm looking for are not the same as most people on TB. I feel active passes are always warmer and rounder sounding, if you kill a the treble on them a little.

For example there is a youtube vid of a guy playing a 4 strting warwick thumb bolt-on with an eden combo amp. I would consider this sound, in this specific case, to be warm, if not round, aleast until about 2:25 into the video. I know a lot of people will disagree. I think passive p's and j's are only warm with the tone mostly closed. P's to me sound brutal with open tone.

I think I can get a sound like this out of my Mesa if I swapped out the aggie DB cab for something less mid present.

I agree. I spent a lot of time swapping heads and cabinet combinations to get the desired tone based on which bass I was playing.

Learning the EQ points let me go from 6 rigs to 2.

 

[sawzalot]

No. I own a modern class D amp, with a digital front end that does eq, compression, and a sort of dirt sound. It doesn't sound harsh at all.

Ton

 

[-Asdfgh-]

Plenty of examples of both harsh and mellow amps in the Class D category. For a good, warm, pillowy sound, check out the TC Electronic RH-450.

Maybe the one I once played through was set up oddly, but I thought it sounded middly and like cardboard compared to my YBA-1A, which could sound warm and pillowy. But then you could tweak the EQ, plug in a Telecaster and get a complimentary trepanning.