ASH vs. ALDER - PART II

[nutdog]

Ok, time for the big reveal!

Clip C matches Clip B (They were both Ash)
Ramble On was recorded with a different bass on each verse (Alder in the first verse, Ash in the second)

I went with C-B and different basses. I would also say I am an average listener as opposed to a highly trained bassist/builder/repairman/sound guy. And I bought my ash bass because I thought it was pretty.

Are the ear buds that come with an iphone high quality?

I'd like to thank Dan, Fender, Trees, Apple, all the little people...

I guess that proves all the naysayers wrong. Iphone earbuds ARE high quality!

 

[fish slapper]

I got the first question wrong and the Ramble On question right but when doing the test I was much more confident on question 1. Question 2 I could have gone either way.

Shows to go you.

But, please, don't make me listen to more Zep for the fretboard test.

 

[Fuzzbass]

Dan, these are awesomely fun and useful threads, and I thank you for them.

I would say this even if I disagreed with you, however the fact is that I'm with you. When I was younger I was in the ash=this and alder=that camp (maple/rosewood too), but after decades of constantly saying things like "wow, that bass sounds awfully bright for being alder/rosewood" or "warm for ash/maple", I decided that exceptions were the norm and that the differences between tonewoods were being exaggerated.

 

[-=DanAtkinson=-]

I got the first question wrong and the Ramble On question right but when doing the test I was much more confident on question 1. Question 2 I could have gone either way.

Shows to go you.

But, please, don't make me listen to more Zep for the fretboard test.

How can you not like Zep???!!!

 

[pasco jacorius]

The difference was very subtle , but ash have more lows . Once again , when comparing woods that are so close , it's always difficult to notice. Though with woods who are radically different , you can feel it better.

 

[boynamedsuse]

Hey--I actually got them both right. A definite first for yours truly in a listening test. The "reveal" for me was that I liked Alder better. And here I thought I was an "Ash guy."

 

[GroovyBaby]

Fretboard test next? I need to know if I should go with rosewood because it is deeper, or ebony because it has more attack, or rosewood because it is cheaper, or ebony because it looks so pretty.

 

[Russell Bergum]

Thanks for playing!

P.S. Since the results of this test went narrowly in favor of the "wood matters" crew, I wonder if they will scream about it being "flawed" like they did the last test.

Yay! I got them both right! That's the second test I've passed, now we have to see if I can make it 3:0 with the fingerboard test Dan, you're converting me into a "wood matters" tone wood convert with these 2 test threads . For the record, I congratulated you on a good real-world test right up front.

I will say that I had to listen to the A-B-C clips several times before I voted B=C with any confidence. The Ramble On clip was pretty easy to hear the difference, but one could account for the same amount of difference with a change in right hand position and fingering technique. I thought it was recorded with 2 basses BUT I thought the first verse was Ash... I thought there was more high end to the tone that I would assign to ash...shows what I know.

So what do these threads teach me personally? 1) I think there is a discernible difference in tone between ash and alder, but it's not HUGE 2) In this sample (and possibly in all - who knows), the difference is VERY hard to hear in a band setting, and is by far a small player in the tone picture compared to everything else.

Thanks for taking the time to record and post these tests! Very informative.

 

[GroovyBaby]

Perhaps I missed it but was it northern hard Ash or southern Swamp Ash?

 

[mouthmw]

Do basswood with something! Plenty of people consider it a cheap wood, so I'd wonder how it would tonally compare.

 

[MrWalker]

Thanks for a very interesting thread!

Very subtle difference indeed! I couldn't really tell much difference between A/B/C, but thought I could hear a slight difference in the attack on the high notes on the Ramble-on recording between the verses. However, I thought it was ash that had the "brightest" tone. So again, my woods were reveresed. I cast my vote anyway, and got 50% right.

This time i can't hide behind anything. I just can't hear the difference that well! Maybe in a future poll, where I now have learned to distinguish my alder from my ash (yeah, right), I might be able to do better.

Thanks for your time, Dan!

 

[Russell Bergum]

Hey--I actually got them both right. A definite first for yours truly in a listening test. The "reveal" for me was that I liked Alder better. And here I thought I was an "Ash guy."

+1
I like the wood grain of ash in translucent/burst finishes and thought I like the tone more too. Listening to these clips, I like alder better. Again, the diffence is very subtle, and could be overcome with technique, strings, etc,etc,etc.

 

[SharkUSMC]

I got it right, but the first part took several listens to be able to pick up the difference. The ramble on portion was easier. I still think even though I was correct in my beliefs, that had you just put the clips out there without mentioning the tone wood being changed, I would never have noticed the difference.

Knowing something is different, and searching it out after careful study is one thing, but if you couldn't just hear the difference if you heard two recordings without knowing it was a different body, is the impact large enough for it to even matter?

It isn't in my book, but I'm relatively unlearned with an untrained ear compared to most of you.

 

[honeyiscool]

Personally, I think that for bass, assuming a reasonably good quality of construction, the most important contributors to tone are, in order:

1. Strings
2. Pickups/Electronics
3. Fretboard
4. Bridge

I really think that at this point, you have 99.5% of what people consider tone.

For guitar, I'd rate like this:

1. Pickups/Electronics
2. Strings
3. Bridge
4. Fretboard

For me, body wood is more about the durability and weight than anything.

 

[bass12]

These tests are great fun. I got this one totally wrong (I thought C matched A and that the verses were recorded with the same bass). Looking forward to the fingerboard test!

 

[Daede]

Personally, I don't think you should have re-issued what was already a fairly successful test (no matter how you look at it) to appease a couple of people who are already very set into their "it's this way and that's all there is to it" opinions.

I do find it interesting, however, that both of your tests yielded similar results, further encouraging the notion "wood matters, but not much, and should not be anywhere near the determining factor in buying a bass".

+1, Dan.

 

[MikeBass]

I didn't see the reveal, but I really couldn't tell that much of a difference. But then again, I don't have anything good to listen to them through either!

 

[BassyBill]

I got the first question wrong and the second question right. Aw shucks - spoils my otherwise 100% record in these comparison threads that Dan has done recently. Curses!

The fact that very few people are getting these consistently right every time confirms my belief that these differences are all pretty subtle, though. If they were easy to discern, the threads would be pretty boring, like this:

Which bass is black, A or B?
Bass A:

Bass B:

 

[honeyiscool]

Haha, we actually should have a nitro vs. poly thread.

Pickguard vs. bare wood, too.

 

[pklima]

For me, body wood is more about the durability and weight than anything.

For me it's about looks. Looks definitely matter, and wood is a contributor to those.