AudioKinesis Cabs Part VI...

[monsterthompson]

Sounds like 5-string low B.


"Comparison is the thief of joy."
- Theodore Roosevelt

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Sounds like 5-string low B.

That makes more sense.

 

[nostatic]

Low B (B0) is 30.8hz. The TC can get a bit more of that (though I assume it is down considerably in response) but the H1203 won't really reproduce it. So you're getting the first fundamental and other overtones. At least that's my understanding - Duke knows better than me. I just whack at the strings...

 

[monsterthompson]

I just whack at the strings...

Tom Anderson does not approve.

"Comparison is the thief of joy."
- Theodore Roosevelt

 

[Coolhandjjl]

...........

The 1855 is growlier in growly mode and goes deeper, trading off a bit of efficiency along the way. The 1855 is borderline "low-F# capable", in that it's about -3.5 dB at the 46 Hz first overtone.

The pair of 1203s are more efficient, and of course more flexible and portable.

While there is of course a family resemblance, fwiw the 1855 is probably my closest approach to "the sound in my head", in growly mode.

Let me see if I got this straight...a pair of the 1203's, a 4 ohm load, will be louder than an 1855? Is that a 4 ohm 1855?

 

[dmrogers]

Here is what Tom said when he first compared the 1855, 1203 stack, and the 1544:

Comparing the 1855 to the double 1203 stack, the 1855 has tighter, slightly bigger, almost growly lows. Very nice, and very addicting! The 2x1203 stack is a bit more warm/round down low, with more bloom. This can also be very nice in the right situation, and some folks will certainly prefer this kind of low end presentation.

Moving on to the midrange, this is where the meat of the story lies, and it'll take some time to suss out the details. At first, the 1855 sounded more lean in the mids, but I think this is just the lower to middle mids. It is definitely more articulate and more present the upper mids. The more I played around, the more I felt like the 1855 had more peaks and valleys in the mids and the 1203's were more consistent and balanced. One big caveat is that this initial round of testing was all done from a seated position a few feet in front of the cabs. I am guessing that as I move around, the perceived mids (and the relative balance through the mids) may vary quite a bit.

The "high end" (which might technically be the upper mids, not sure on this one) between the two was probably their most similar feature. The 1855 is a tad more pure and clean, and the 1203's seemed to have more harmonic content through the highs. Both setups leave you wondering why you'd ever need a horn.

Now, things got interesting when I switched from my MTD 535 (a two-pickup, active bass) to my Carvin PB5 (a passive P-bass). The 1855 became much more burpy/growly and has a lot more upper mids. The 1203s were much more round and smooth by comparison. This was not a subtle transition, and I view this as a credit to the cabs' (both the 1855 and the 1203's) abilities to reflect the character of the signal being fed to them. In fact, the 1855 may be the best-performing cab that I have ever tried in this regard. First impressions can be misleading, mind you, but out of the gate, I was floored by its ability to just entirely transform its sound when switching instruments. The only potential downside to this is that if a player hears this cab at a GTG or demos one at home, unless he/she tries a variety of basses (and I'm guessing, amps) with the cab, they may not really get to know its capabilities.

Comparing the 1544 to the 1855 or the two 1203's, the 1544 just sounds boxy and thin. With the right head (something big and meaty), this cab can sound great – especially when you throw some overdrive at it. But when I compare it to your other cabs, I definitely prefer the 1855 and 1203.

I agree with Tom on the switching basses and/or heads with the 1203 stack. I think with lesser cabs (less clear & articulate) the differences might not be as noticeable. Believe me, you instantly hear the difference going from a P to a J. Or Monique to Thunderfunk to TH500.

One thing I noticed as I purchased better gear is: your mistakes (or lack of technique/sloppiness) are instantly pointed out. I see this as a good thing. It has made me a better musician. I try to improve my technique, and choice of notes.

And if you just look at the drivers, and not consider all of the other cabinet magic that Dukes does, you have 2x12+2x3 versus 1x18+2x5. They are going to be different, but I would say, probably different flavors of awesome. I can't tell you how happy I am with 2 cabs that weigh 24.6 pounds each!

I don't have a clue as to which combination would be louder, I just know I wouldn't want to be standing near by when someone was trying to find out.

 

[Smallequestrian]

Got to meet Duke at the Rocky Mountain Audio fest yesterday. Not that I didn't already know this, but he's a really nice guy!

 

[anderbass]

tombowlus said:


Comparing the 1544 to the 1855 or the two 1203's, the 1544 just sounds boxy and thin. With the right head (something big and meaty), this cab can sound great – especially when you throw some overdrive at it. But when I compare it to your other cabs, I definitely prefer the 1855 and 1203.

Hi Duke, I'm the beta tester that ended up buying your prototype Hathor 1544 cab.

I haven't been following this thread very closely (so maybe I missed it), but reading Toms review got me wondering If maybe you'd come up with any mods or updates that could be done to improve my 1544?

I still love the cab and don't have any complaints, just wondering if it could be even better?

 

[Coolhandjjl]

From what I've read, many of the people buying the Hathors or TC's are Jazz guys or 5 string low tuning guys. I play rock, 4 string standard tuning, occasional subtle overdrive with a tube pedal through a Demeter VTBM800D. I was considering a stack of the fEARful 12/6's, but I do not know if thier uber extension in the lows is worth it or necessary. The popular Ampeg 8x10 "Fridge" is sealed, and down over 10dB @ 60Hz. And some folks say that sealed cabs with their less extension lows and no port design make them more forgiving in poor acoustical environments like bars. So ported or sealed, not sure, but I am re-evaluating my obscession to only seek out cabs with such extended response in the lows. I mean, my first overtone is 82Hz. Perhaps a stack of H1203's or a TC212 for my needs?

 

[shrigg]

Rock + overdrive? Sounds like a Hathor stack would suit your tonal goals well. Plugging the ports would provide a very forgiving response in challenging environments as you mentioned.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Rock + overdrive? Sounds like a Hathor stack would suit your tonal goals well. Plugging the ports would provide a very forgiving response in challenging environments as you mentioned.

Subtle, light tubey OD on occasion. No metal.

 

[shrigg]

As mentioned here often, the Hathors have a pronounced midrange voice and sound great with subtle overdrive. The 3" paper HF driver really reproduces overdrive nicely, very organic.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

fEARfuls go lower, -3dB at the first overtone of F#0 (46Hz), but do I really need it?

 

[shrigg]

I'd say not if you are playing 4 string.

 

[steubig]

From what I've read, many of the people buying the Hathors or TC's are Jazz guys or 5 string low tuning guys. I play rock, 4 string standard tuning, occasional subtle overdrive with a tube pedal through a Demeter VTBM800D.

i think there are a fair amount of guys who do 4-string playing on these.

 

[Marial]

Primarily four-string Jazz player here, usually fretless. The VTBP/TC212 (top switch up, lower switch down) combination is stunning, but I like a really warm, smooooth tone. The 212, however, really is overkill for what I normally do, so a TC112 is in my future. I still haven't turned the amp up past 9 o'clock.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Marial, I like the first quote in your sig

 

[Marial]

It's a great book, by a fantastic author.

 

[dmrogers]

From what I've read, many of the people buying the Hathors or TC's are Jazz guys or 5 string low tuning guys. I play rock, 4 string standard tuning, occasional subtle overdrive with a tube pedal through a Demeter VTBM800D. I was considering a stack of the fEARful 12/6's, but I do not know if thier uber extension in the lows is worth it or necessary. The popular Ampeg 8x10 "Fridge" is sealed, and down over 10dB @ 60Hz. And some folks say that sealed cabs with their less extension lows and no port design make them more forgiving in poor acoustical environments like bars. So ported or sealed, not sure, but I am re-evaluating my obscession to only seek out cabs with such extended response in the lows. I mean, my first overtone is 82Hz. Perhaps a stack of H1203's or a TC212 for my needs?

I'm a 4 string player exclusively, my current gig is with an Americana band. Just to give you and idea, we do everything from John Prine, Lucinda Williams, Gillian Welch, Townes Van Zandt, Gram Parsons, Neil Young, Gene Clark, Byrds, Jayhawks and others. Plus we do a fair amount of classic rock (Stones, Jackson Browne, Fleetwood Mac, etc...) and classic country. Plus I'm a big Gov't Mule fan and love/practice their stuff.

Last night at rehearsal, I was using my P bass, Tone Hammer 500 and one H1203 cab. I didn't want to stop playing! It's really hard to describe the very musical mid presence of these cabs. Just a great tone in a band mix. Plus, and I have posted this before, I can add lows with EQ and it gives me a full, low tone without any muddiness. It has all the lows I have every wanted. Usable lows.
When I dig in on the P bass, the mids of the 1203 have an almost growly effect. It's kinda hard for me to put in words. The tone is still clear, but with authority. All of this with both switches up. If I want/need something different, it's just a flip of a switch or EQ setting away.

I see where you are using the Demeter VTBM head. I use a Monique with the 1203 cabs. Although they are different heads, I would assume they have some similarities. The Monique sounds great with these cabs!

Everything Todd told me about the 1203's before I purchased them was true. He nailed the description on the tone/characteristics of these cabs. I'm not saying they are for everybody, but they were just what I was looking for!

 

[Mike Arnopol]

It's a great book, by a fantastic author.

Read it---loved it!