Avatar 3 way 15/6/tweet

[greenboy]

If the Av 153 is anything like fEARfuls one of the biggest changes is (if your bass electronics and preamp/head allow it) that picking/plucking hand technique is now extremely revealing. Tons of tone changes in hand positions and nuance of attack.

Don't get too crazy on EQ changes until your ear has really had some time to accomodate the "new" cab thang ya's all into.

 

[Michael Vee]

And now, the price has gone up. I noticed it on Dave's eBay listing for the TB153 yesterday. Also "Temporarily Sold out until mid February. Orders accepted for Feb ship date." on their website.

I don't really need any more cabs or amp pieces, but might try one of these later this year if Dave offers them with covering/grille options like the other cabs. He probably will, since the box is the same size as the 2x12 and 4x10's. Otherwise, I might lurk for a used one.

 

[lomo]

If the Av 153 is anything like fEARfuls one of the biggest changes is (if your bass electronics and preamp/head allow it) that picking/plucking hand technique is now extremely revealing. Tons of tone changes in hand positions and nuance of attack.

.

+10! More clarity, esp down low, has shone a brighter light on my weak technique......but makes me work harder and focus more.....at least until the 2nd bourbon seeps in

 

[BurningSkies]

If the Av 153 is anything like fEARfuls one of the biggest changes is (if your bass electronics and preamp/head allow it) that picking/plucking hand technique is now extremely revealing. Tons of tone changes in hand positions and nuance of attack.

Don't get too crazy on EQ changes until your ear has really had some time to accomodate the "new" cab thang ya's all into.

I agree...with the caveat that the first time you use this cab you SHOULD bring your amp back to a neutral setting, otherwise you may find yourself surprised with what you hear that first moment. Because of the lack of significant low end roll off you may boom yourself out of house and home if you boost your lows from the start.

 

[tink9975]

yeah I'll be setting the EQ on the Eden and the Agro flat before I fire up the cab tonight. I expect to hear just how bad my playing is and how badly my PJ needs a fret-leveling

 

[thumbs&fingers]

+1, just got mine yesterday. I plugged it into my GB shuttle 6.....had to back the volume down significantly. This was in a non rehearsal environment (my living room) so i javent had time to do a proper comparison. I agree with the info offered in the previous posts.

 

[IntrepidCellist]

I think these'll be out of my 2011/12 budget, running a nonprofit label and all. Maybe 2013 used....(I like the budget 4x10 I just scored, but I'm always looking to improve tone ya know?)

Another possibility is just an Eminence 3012LF. Anyone run one of these w/o a mid or tweeter? Can a graphic eq make one not really miss a mid-driver? I asked Dave at Avatar if he'd offer an option for the SB112 cab like that (3012LF instead of stock driver, c/o, & tweet) for the same price of $350 shipped (black carpet) and I got a friendly maybe.....

You'd be better off with an HO if you're running full range, generally.

Also, recording-wise, you're not going to necessarily get the "full picture" from one of these without some creative mic'ing.

 

[BurningSkies]

+1, just got mine yesterday. I plugged it into my GB shuttle 6.....had to back the volume down significantly. This was in a non rehearsal environment (my living room) so i javent had time to do a proper comparison. I agree with the info offered in the previous posts.

Its a different world, ain't it?

It really took me a while to relearn the EQ needed on my 'similar' cab(s). After years of making up for the lack of real lows in pretty much most production cabs, having one with extended response down there made for some re-thinking. Also, since so many cabs are voiced mid-scooped that even running mids flat, you may find that you think your mids are too hot. If you find yourself not feeling the kick or punch you're used to hearing, add some content in the 120-200hz range, or so.

 

[thumbs&fingers]

Thanks burningskies, ill try that-and yes way different world. A better one in my opinion.

 

[greenboy]

Also, recording-wise, you're not going to necessarily get the "full picture" from one of these without some creative mic'ing.

Non-issue for a competent live sound / recording engineer. Except for that stupid TB153 tweeter placement, that is (is someone is using the tweeter in the first place). That's one of several reasons fEARful baffles place everything right up against each other.

 

[masonsjax]

Since I started playing through a fEarful cab, I've started focusing a lot more attention on my playing technique with both hands. It's not that I was especially sloppy before, but the extra clarity did reveal some areas I needed to improve upon. It's actually training me to play like I'm in the studio all the time, which is a very good thing IMO.

 

[greenboy]

Its a different world, ain't it?

It really took me a while to relearn the EQ needed on my 'similar' cab(s). After years of making up for the lack of real lows in pretty much most production cabs, having one with extended response down there made for some re-thinking. Also, since so many cabs are voiced mid-scooped that even running mids flat, you may find that you think your mids are too hot. If you find yourself not feeling the kick or punch you're used to hearing, add some content in the 120-200hz range, or so.

With this category of enclosure if one wants to make a lot of different tones beyond what playing technique and switching strings/basses/etc does, it makes sense to use preamps/heads with more EQ facilities. I'm pretty sold on at least 6 to 10 bands of graphic with shelving at each end - making sure the frequency centers are at good frequencies - or some true parametric bands. Semi parametric can be all right, it beats two or three fixed bands anyway...

 

[greenboy]

Since I started playing through a fEarful cab, I've started focusing a lot more attention on my playing technique with both hands. It's not that I was especially sloppy before, but the extra clarity did reveal some areas I needed to improve upon. It's actually training me to play like I'm in the studio all the time, which is a very good thing IMO.

Really revealing on bass setup too. Issues with pickup height, quality of strings and bridge and truss rod setup, etc.

Of course it's easy enough to hide all that stuff for actual playing/gigging, just by throwing some EQ blanket over it all ; }

 

[rpsands]

Pickup height is especially huge.

 

[greenboy]

Pickup height is especially huge.

The good thing about all that is that if it's sounding good without using EQ to obscure stuff, you are set for the studio - you've just made tracking and mix engineers lives easier.

 

[bassacechase]

I got my TB153 today! I rushed home from class to test it. I only have a Mackie PPM1008 (powered mixer) at the moment. I will start the hunt for a reasonably priced head soon. Anyway, it sounded pretty good through a powered mixer! I can't wait to get a head for it!

 

[KJung]

+10! More clarity, esp down low, has shone a brighter light on my weak technique......but makes me work harder and focus more.....at least until the 2nd bourbon seeps in

These comments are interesting. I actually found that the 12/6 and 15/6 designs that I've played are much more forgiving of technique flaws. These cabs have a much more relaxed tone in the low mids, and also in the upper mids, than many of the more traditional 2 way neo loaded cabs out there now.

What previous cabs are you comparing these designs to? I guess if you were playing a low quality 215 or something, I could understand this. However, if you want to put really put your technique to the test, try a Bergantino AE cab, or any number of high quality 112's, 210's, 410's and 212's.

I also had another of thousands of typical experiences last night, listening to a more traditional cab at an extreme off axis listening position (about 70 degrees off center, and about 50 feet away) in a club (a nice little Hartke two way 112), and the tone was even, full and articulate from the lows through the mids, all they way up.

I guess I must continue to live in an alternative universe from some of you guys. I just don't get it.

I like the 15/6/1 build quite a bit, but 'it is what it is', and has its own tone profile. Like any other cab, you can EQ it to move that inherent tone profile, but not by that much to my ear (given the typical EQ profile of most bass heads), at least not any more than moving the inherent tone profile of other high quality cab.

 

[naturalkinds]

RP & GB:

Like KJ, I am a little puzzled on your sentiment that the 15/6 derivative is especially sensitive to technique, pickup height, etc.

What specifically accounts for that? Especially the pickup height business. Bass enclosures aren't my specific specialty, but I will say that the way the nuances of electric bass come across varies greatly among high-quality studio monitors. Genelec sounds different from Focus, which sounds different from Adam, and so on. And this is on account of a number of things (temporal impulse response, sensitivity across the frequency spectrum, low end response).

Isn't it a little ambitious to attribute this to one specific enclosure design, generalizing irrespective of crossover, mid driver, etc.?

 

[lomo]

What previous cabs are you comparing these designs to?

Currently A/Bing it with Scout 12. The 153 and my LDS 15/6 are VERY similar sounding for me. This with zero slapping and tapping. I find chording/double stops to be clearer with the 3-way cabs as well. I have no clue why-and these observations are at rehearsal and playing alone-no live gigging yet and no recording (ever for me).

 

[Chef]

Lomo:
as to why things sound clearer vs the scout cab, i'm not surprised. even with it's horn and crossover, i never found either of my scout cabs to be particularly great at delivering detailed high end response.