Baer Amplification Megathread!

[KJung]

Funny thing for me is over the years, I was always a 10's guy, and really disliked 12's, except for my B12 Portaflex. I also have the Epifani UL2x12 and I never use it, too scooped for me. The ML112 is the first 12 I ever liked, let me rephrase that, LOVE!

I don't miss my 10's at all... And I had them all over the years.

Well except maybe for my mesa boogie 4x10 roadready cab circa '92. That was one killer cab, but it killed your back too!

I think you will see two things happen (already happening) in the bass cabinet category:

1) You will see fewer and fewer multi-10 cabs. Given the improvements in speaker design, most high end 112's can EASILY perform at the level of an older 210 box, in a smaller size and less cost (1 driver versus 2). The cost advantage is even bigger when the cabs are neo. I believe, for example, the Eminence 3010LF is about the same price as the 12 and 15 variants.

2) You will hear fewer bassists talk about 'the sound of 10's' versus 'the sound of 12's' versus the 'sound of 15's'. Given the improvement in design over the last 10 years, it really is more a matter of scaling and volume than frequency range.

A 112 (for those who don't need a ton of volume) and a 212 ( or 2 x 112) for those that do seems to be the sweet spot these days regarding volume, size, overall performance, weight, and cost.

 

[R Baer]

Funny thing for me is over the years, I was always a 10's guy, and really disliked 12's, except for my B12 Portaflex. I also have the Epifani UL2x12 and I never use it, too scooped for me. The ML112 is the first 12 I ever liked, let me rephrase that, LOVE!...

Appreciate the compliment! That 12" driver Eminence made for us is just a really special driver, IMO. Also, in todays world of expensive neodymium magnets, trying to do something like a 410 neo these days is a very expensive proposal, as the good neo 10's really aren't any cheaper than the 12" drivers. Given that the price is similar and our 12" driver easily outperforms the 10" drivers, it just makes the 12" loaded cabs a pretty good bang for the buck. I have kicked around the idea of a 210 specifically made for the micro head crowd, but we need to get a couple other projects out the door first.

... I really may NOT know what good bass tone is!...

Tone is such a subjective thing. Good tone is whatever works for you and lets you enjoy being on stage with a tone that inspires you and lets you enjoy the experience without spending the entire gig trying to get a sound you like out of your rig.

 

[monsterthompson]

ken's arguments are working to sway me to a 12 box.

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

ken's arguments are working to sway me to a 12 box.

I know! I am thinking about a ML-112, but I am really working hard to wait on the ML-115 first before deciding.

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

Tone is such a subjective thing. Good tone is whatever works for you and lets you enjoy being on stage with a tone that inspires you and lets you enjoy the experience without spending the entire gig trying to get a sound you like out of your rig.

Absolutely true! Which is why I hope someone will tell me if my tone sucks, so as not to blindly toil away in my subjective bliss! LOL!

BTW, how's that ML-115 coming along?

 

[Chef]

"210"

My response to this would be: "why?"
The ML112 already outperforms most 210 boxes.

"1-10"
My response, again: "why?"
There's nothing for me in a 1-10. I can't gig it. I don't want 4 of them.
The ML112 is easy enough to move as a single small venue/rehearsal rig.

If it were me; and, it's not; my "future think" would be "D-Class Valkyrie-Lite ML112 ML212 combo."

ymmv of course.

 

[monsterthompson]

I have been jonesing for a small, low-volume cab. I wanted to like the ML 112, but it didn't fit with my "old" rig when I did the demo of it. I'm tempted to try again, now that I've changed some factors. I'm also being tempted by other brands, which are hard to find and demo, so it is a tough call. Right now I've got my eyes on the Glasstone, which other TecAmp users love, and it also has the ability to run two 12" drivers in a box of a similar size and weight, for not much extra cash. Of course, I'm tempted to wait for the Baer 115. Right now, my bottleneck is waiting on the new Mesa Prodigy release to see if that is the head I want. Cab choice is next in line. I'm also happy with my current "loud" cab (a composite 15/6), so I'm not in any rush.

 

[R Baer]

...BTW, how's that ML-115 coming along?

I went back in and trimmed a bit of the depth of the ML115 to make it a little easier to carry, so I am waiting on the final prototype to arrive for testing. Should be here next week. I know it goes against conventional TB wisdom about mixing drivers, but the ML115 with a ML112 on top is just crazy good. The ML115 adds low end girth, while the ML112 adds the upper mid bite.

 

[Chef]

I did this with Mesa Scout 112/Mesa Diesel115.
Convention can suck it sometimes, as far as I'm concerned.

I went back in and trimmed a bit of the depth of the ML115 to make it a little easier to carry, so I am waiting on the final prototype to arrive for testing. Should be here next week. I know it goes against conventional TB wisdom about mixing drivers, but the ML115 with a ML112 on top is just crazy good. The ML115 adds low end girth, while the ML112 adds the upper mid bite.

 

[R Baer]

I have been jonesing for a small, low-volume cab. I wanted to like the ML 112, but it didn't fit with my "old" rig when I did the demo of it. I'm tempted to try again, now that I've changed some factors. I'm also being tempted by other brands, which are hard to find and demo, so it is a tough call. Right now I've got my eyes on the Glasstone, which other TecAmp users love, and it also has the ability to run two 12" drivers in a box of a similar size and weight, for not much extra cash. Of course, I'm tempted to wait for the Baer 115. Right now, my bottleneck is waiting on the new Mesa Prodigy release to see if that is the head I want. Cab choice is next in line. I'm also happy with my current "loud" cab (a composite 15/6), so I'm not in any rush.

After hearing you play, I really think the ML115 would be a great match for you, as it has a bit stronger lows and less upper mids. It would probably be a better match for that Dingwall. The downside is going to be the size/weight factor compared to your composite cab. Now, if you are using a different bass and had an all tube Mesa, I think the ML112 would definitely be the way to go. That cab loves tubes!

"210"...My response to this would be: "why?"...The ML112 already outperforms most 210 boxes...

I think it would only be practical for me if I could come up with a 210 that could significantly outperform one ML112 and at a cost of less than two ML112's. Plus, I have a couple ideas that could make it unique. If I can bring something different to the table, then I would be up for the challenge. I just don't have a lot of interest in doing the same old thing. I spent too many years buying a ton of gear that I was never really happy with. It took me a while to realize that was because I was looking for something different, while the industry tends to keep rehashing the same old designs over and over again. I want to offer something different, in the hope that there are other players out there that have always been a little frustrated by the status quo, as well.

 

[tombowlus]

I went back in and trimmed a bit of the depth of the ML115 to make it a little easier to carry, so I am waiting on the final prototype to arrive for testing. Should be here next week. I know it goes against conventional TB wisdom about mixing drivers, but the ML115 with a ML112 on top is just crazy good. The ML115 adds low end girth, while the ML112 adds the upper mid bite.

After hearing both of those cabs at NAMM, I can see where they would be very complimentary (provided that you did not end up with phase cancellation issues, and whatnot).

 

[John D Harris]

I went back in and trimmed a bit of the depth of the ML115 to make it a little easier to carry, so I am waiting on the final prototype to arrive for testing. Should be here next week. I know it goes against conventional TB wisdom about mixing drivers, but the ML115 with a ML112 on top is just crazy good. The ML115 adds low end girth, while the ML112 adds the upper mid bite.

I was musing a couple of weeks back that would probably be a killer & versatile setup.

Bongo 5 HH -> Valkyrie -> ML115 + ML112 stack =

...or so I speculate...

 

[monsterthompson]

I figured it would love tubes. Nostatic and his Monique have presented a tasty case for your cabs. The more mid based tone of the 112 might be a better low volume option. The TecAmp Jag pre is so flexy that it would likely play nice even with the Ding. I'm also looking at going to the P-tone in the ABZ, and currently still loving my Nash P. I have a feeling the Baer 112 would be a good fit. I agree that the upcoming 115 might not be different enough from my 15/6 to justify making a change particularly for size and weight.

 

[BuffaloBob4343]

I went back in and trimmed a bit of the depth of the ML115 to make it a little easier to carry, so I am waiting on the final prototype to arrive for testing. Should be here next week. I know it goes against conventional TB wisdom about mixing drivers, but the ML115 with a ML112 on top is just crazy good. The ML115 adds low end girth, while the ML112 adds the upper mid bite.

Oh, you are sly! So what you're saying is i should go ahead and pick up the 112 now, and get the 115 later! I like the way you think, although I'm not sure my bank account does! LOL!

Actually, I really should have a true small rig cab, and the 112 is the best bet for that, however the fact that you are making the 115 easier to carry is pulling me back to the 115.

Arrrg! I feel like Robin Williams in Moscow on the Hudson when his character, who is a defector from the Soviet Union, has a meltdown in the Supermarket because he has so many choices for coffee alone that he just loses it!

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

1x10 with adjustable mid . . . i dislike tweeters.

I used to say the same thing about tweeters. Then I experienced several cabs with REALLY good crossovers (Crazy8, Crazy88, Thunderchild 115, Fearless 110). For a former tweeter hater, I have undergone quite a transformation.

In all fairness, I should add: the tweeter is especially beneficial for my tone when I'm playing acoustic bass. That certain element of "air" makes all the difference.

 

[nostatic]

After using the ML112, I actually prefer not having a tweeter. No matter how good the woofer/tweeter/crossover is, there'll be some gaps in the mids.

 

[maisbass]

After using the ML112, I actually prefer not having a tweeter. No matter how good the woofer/tweeter/crossover is, there'll be some gaps in the mids.

I agree. I never thought I could get by without a tweeter, but the mL112 has convinced me otherwise! That mid driver is so thick and punchy, and I especially love the way double stops sound through it!

 

[steubig]

I used to say the same thing about tweeters. Then I experienced several cabs with REALLY good crossovers (Crazy8, Crazy88, Thunderchild 115, Fearless 110). For a former tweeter hater, I have undergone quite a transformation.

tc115 doesn't have a tweeter, though, it's a horn. and i have the tc112, and it's very different from a tweeter. pleasantly so.

i like the baer 112 with the mid driver, which i got to hear at numerous listenings at casa nostatic.

 

[KJung]

I agree. I never thought I could get by without a tweeter, but the mL112 has convinced me otherwise! That mid driver is so thick and punchy, and I especially love the way double stops sound through it!

Just like tweeters, there is HUGE variance in midrange drivers (both the drivers themselves and the crossover points and crossover designs).

IMO, Roger has combined the most 'musical 'sounding mid driver (the one he uses by Faital) with a relatively high crossover point. Every decision is a compromise, but Roger's compromises are the best I've heard. There is nothing 'PA cab' sounding about his ML cabs... you would never know (IMO) there is a mid driver in that cab. Very 'top of the cone' warm, organic top end.

This is NOT true of all mid driver loaded cabs.

Huge variance in tweeter loaded cabs also.

 

[KJung]

tc115 doesn't have a tweeter, though, it's a horn. and i have the tc112, and it's very different from a tweeter. pleasantly so.

i like the baer 112 with the mid driver, which i got to hear at numerous listenings at casa nostatic.

No, it is a tweeter (i.e., a compression driver). It just happens to be a very good one, crossed over low. The 'horn' is just for dispersion.

The reason that 'tweeter' is different from so many is the magnificent crossover that has so many components, it is almost funny. Jim Bergantino's tweeters/crossovers are also a thing of beauty. They are more traditionally crossed over, but lower than most, and VERY even and musical.

Lots of ways to 'get there' with these designs, and lots of ways to mess up too!