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Building Walking Basslines Lesson 1
- Thread starter Pbassred
- Start date
Oh geez.... I turn my head for a week and now there's 7 pages of thread. You guys started without telling me! I assumed I'd get a notification via email. Okay... I tried to read through the whole thread... but I didn't make it. Makes my head spin... So here is what I wanted to tell you all BEFORE it started:
This book presents you with the task of learning a thought process that bassists use to create walking lines. The examples are written out mostly as a standardized way of showing you a concept. The reading of these lines is necessary to get the concepts down, but the reading is NOT the point of this book. When you get asked to walk a bass line, it will not be written for you. You have to make it up. So the reading is really secondary to the process. The R-5-8 u/chr, l/chr symbols under the notes are there to help you grasp the relationship the notes have to the chord structures and to each other. If it makes learning the lines easier, that's fine. If you need to listen to them on the CD, that's fine. I believe reading is an essential part of musicianship training, but walking bass lines through chord changes is not a reading-based skill.
That said, I encourage you all to take your time. You could probably cruise through this book in an afternoon, but what will you have? The point is, this process takes time to settle in, especially when it comes to making it happen in tempo. So, frankly I think you should all stick with the very first thing in the book and that is playing the root. Sure, you all know how to play the root... but take examples 4 & 5 (More practice with roots). If you can play these examples with the track all through the neck, then you can go to the progressions found in More Practice with the Fifth (8 & 9?) and do the same thing with those. Only roots, ALL through the neck. Then go to the 10 standard progressions in the back and be able to play all of those tunes using just roots all through the neck.
It may seem easy, but if you can't do it... you can't do it. Don't be in such a hurry to move through the book. It is not another notch in your belt to simply get through it. The bottom line is: it takes a while to be able to generate good lines through jazz changes, and you need to exercise each step of the way as much as possible. If you rush the process, you won't be much better off than before you started.
This book presents you with the task of learning a thought process that bassists use to create walking lines. The examples are written out mostly as a standardized way of showing you a concept. The reading of these lines is necessary to get the concepts down, but the reading is NOT the point of this book. When you get asked to walk a bass line, it will not be written for you. You have to make it up. So the reading is really secondary to the process. The R-5-8 u/chr, l/chr symbols under the notes are there to help you grasp the relationship the notes have to the chord structures and to each other. If it makes learning the lines easier, that's fine. If you need to listen to them on the CD, that's fine. I believe reading is an essential part of musicianship training, but walking bass lines through chord changes is not a reading-based skill.
That said, I encourage you all to take your time. You could probably cruise through this book in an afternoon, but what will you have? The point is, this process takes time to settle in, especially when it comes to making it happen in tempo. So, frankly I think you should all stick with the very first thing in the book and that is playing the root. Sure, you all know how to play the root... but take examples 4 & 5 (More practice with roots). If you can play these examples with the track all through the neck, then you can go to the progressions found in More Practice with the Fifth (8 & 9?) and do the same thing with those. Only roots, ALL through the neck. Then go to the 10 standard progressions in the back and be able to play all of those tunes using just roots all through the neck.
It may seem easy, but if you can't do it... you can't do it. Don't be in such a hurry to move through the book. It is not another notch in your belt to simply get through it. The bottom line is: it takes a while to be able to generate good lines through jazz changes, and you need to exercise each step of the way as much as possible. If you rush the process, you won't be much better off than before you started.
Holy crap! Is that the Ed Friedland? This thread is incredible.
I'm up to pg 23 but I'm going back to the beginning now and re-working each step as you said. Ed, you're like a celebrity here. Thanks for commenting on this thread. Any chance you get to chime in will be of great value.
This thread is on fire now!
I'm up to pg 23 but I'm going back to the beginning now and re-working each step as you said. Ed, you're like a celebrity here. Thanks for commenting on this thread. Any chance you get to chime in will be of great value.
This thread is on fire now!
Fair enough. I know that the focus of this book is on creating walking lines, not reading. I just want to make sure that if people have questions about the pages of the book that relate to reading, they are comfortable asking them here.
Great that Ed is checking in.
Nice training tool.
Did not pickup on how we were to use the Standard Progressions (and CD) in the back of the book. Yes help ourselves to backing tracks for what we have JUST learned. Took for granted the progressions were for later stuff......
Nice training tool.
The root motion is the starting point for everything in bass playing. And while many take that for granted, with more complex chord progressions, it will still be a challenge for a lot of people. If you can't turn on the track and immediately play through it with just the roots in tempo, you still have work to do.
Regarding the use of the metronome with this book - I have amended my thoughts about that since I wrote it in 1991. Yes, at some point the metronome will be necessary, but first you should make sure you can construct a line. Sitting there with tempo clicking away before you can do this will prove frustrating and pointless. It is a good idea to look at the progressions and just construct your line in free tempo, take as long as you need to get to the next note. No point in being in a hurry to get nowhere, if you don't know what the next note in the line is...sit there until you figure it out. Once you've got the process working in your head - THEN you can add slow tempo.
Regarding the use of the metronome with this book - I have amended my thoughts about that since I wrote it in 1991. Yes, at some point the metronome will be necessary, but first you should make sure you can construct a line. Sitting there with tempo clicking away before you can do this will prove frustrating and pointless. It is a good idea to look at the progressions and just construct your line in free tempo, take as long as you need to get to the next note. No point in being in a hurry to get nowhere, if you don't know what the next note in the line is...sit there until you figure it out. Once you've got the process working in your head - THEN you can add slow tempo.
I'm with you, Malcom. Understanding these are in the book for practicing wherever we are in the learning process is a huge help!
Ed, thanks so much for your input! Your last two posts have helped me view this learning experience in a new and much less stressful light. Thanks!
I did some investigation and figured out the titles of the "Standards" in the back of the book. (Some may be based on the actual standard tune.)
I can post these if anyone is interested. It really helps to listen to the songs to hear different interpretations of the great musicians that have recorded these tunes.
I'm not sure if there are any kind of copyright laws that prevent me from posting the titles. I imagine that's why Ed didn't include them in the book.
I can post these if anyone is interested. It really helps to listen to the songs to hear different interpretations of the great musicians that have recorded these tunes.
I'm not sure if there are any kind of copyright laws that prevent me from posting the titles. I imagine that's why Ed didn't include them in the book.
Hi Ed do you mean with the book, or by ear?
Also once I can do More Practice and 10 standard progressions in the back using just roots all through the neck, the next step would be to do so with R-5-8?
Thanks
Either way, if you can deal with this material strictly by ear, you have good ears, and you might as well use them. Jazz playing is as much about the ear as it is the brain, except the brain tends to get overlooked by a lot of folks.
Yeah, add the 5, the 8 is a given when you work on the root motion.
Guys, we just made Google. ........ I asked Google for some Country bass interval patterns. Guess where it took me?
Yep, right here Building Walking Bass Lines Lesson 1. We have arrived!
Yep, right here Building Walking Bass Lines Lesson 1. We have arrived!
Actually I'm the opposite. Very good at sight reading, piss poor at using my ears. This is why I chose Building Walking Basslines. It's NOT a sight reading skill. Thanks for helping us out with this.
I see what is confusing you. Dominant of Dominant (aka V/V) is part of an analysis of the function a chord is playing within the harmonic structure of the changes. Functional analysis is a way to describe the overall harmonic character of the piece & re-harmonize within the existing structure. Functional analysis is not really going to help building a walking bass line.
Dominant approach (upper or lower) has to do with the note you play before a target note. If you target the chord root on beat 1 of the measure, the note on beat 4 of the preceding measure is the approach. Ed is illustrating using the dominant above or the dominant below the target as an approach note. Play them slowly & hold the notes. Can you hear the difference in sound & movement. Try each with the practice track on the CD.
Does that make sense?
I think his question related directly to the dominant approach of the 5.... you can call it the 2nd... it IS the 2nd... but for understanding what it does in the line, I call it the upper or lower Dom approach to the 5. Essentially, you are creating a II-V-I movement within the line - creating dominant root motion where there was none. Bassists do this all the time, it makes for a very strong line.
Same concept as backcycling, which is easy to grasp if you lay out the circle in a flat line and paste it where you can take a peak.
C-F-Bb-Eb-Ab-Db-Gb-B-E-A-D-G-C
What leads to the target? Target is C what leads to C? G leads to C. What is G to C? The fifth.
What leads to Bb? F leads to Bb. What is F to Bb? The fifth.
Little deeper. What leads to C? G leads to C. Now what leads to G? D leads to G.
D, G, C is a ii V I progression or since it's notes a 2, 5, 1. Yep, we end up building little ii V I (2 5 1) movements which do flow nicely.
We are now getting into stuff that will be fine for writing bass lines. Composing this on the fly will take time, but, you gotta start somewhere.
Example: 1st measure pp 23.
F7chord
F - G - C - F
Walk me through the logic involved with deciding the F-G-C-F order.
Do you decide to place the two Roots first and then ....... I'm lost as to which comes first. U/dom and L/dom as it relates to what? Understanding U and L to what seems to be my hangup.
Same thing with the 3rd measure. Specifics please.
EDIT - is all this just showing us how to add (use) the ii? NO we've got some 6's showing up --- back to the U/dom L/dom thing........ I'm a structured kinda guy, gotta understand the structure. This is going over my head.
C-F-Bb-Eb-Ab-Db-Gb-B-E-A-D-G-C
What leads to the target? Target is C what leads to C? G leads to C. What is G to C? The fifth.
What leads to Bb? F leads to Bb. What is F to Bb? The fifth.
Little deeper. What leads to C? G leads to C. Now what leads to G? D leads to G.
D, G, C is a ii V I progression or since it's notes a 2, 5, 1. Yep, we end up building little ii V I (2 5 1) movements which do flow nicely.
We are now getting into stuff that will be fine for writing bass lines. Composing this on the fly will take time, but, you gotta start somewhere.
Example: 1st measure pp 23.
F7chord
F - G - C - F
Walk me through the logic involved with deciding the F-G-C-F order.
Do you decide to place the two Roots first and then ....... I'm lost as to which comes first. U/dom and L/dom as it relates to what? Understanding U and L to what seems to be my hangup.
Same thing with the 3rd measure. Specifics please.
EDIT - is all this just showing us how to add (use) the ii? NO we've got some 6's showing up --- back to the U/dom L/dom thing........ I'm a structured kinda guy, gotta understand the structure. This is going over my head.
When it comes to Dom approach, up or down doesn't change what note the approach is, unlike with chrom, or scale which are different notes depending on the direction they resolve. The 5 is the 5 up or down.
F7 Bb7
F-G-C-F Bb.....
The F is the root on beat one, the G is the dom app of the 5 (C), the C is the 5, and also a dom app back to the root on beat 4, which in turn acts as a dom app to the root of the next chord Bb. It's a perfect little cadence that creates a lot of movement in a short time frame, all of it leading to the next chord. One of my favorite "patterns".
F7 Bb7
F-G-C-F Bb.....
The F is the root on beat one, the G is the dom app of the 5 (C), the C is the 5, and also a dom app back to the root on beat 4, which in turn acts as a dom app to the root of the next chord Bb. It's a perfect little cadence that creates a lot of movement in a short time frame, all of it leading to the next chord. One of my favorite "patterns".
