• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join freeLog in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Cabs in America

If you like that Eden sound, maybe PM @Rip Van Dan regarding the DNA stuff. He can tell ya about it.
Yeah, I'm definitely the guy to tell you about DNA amps and cabs as I am a DNA Endorser (was accepted to their group in 2019) and I have amps and cabs by DNA. I also have Eden amps and cabs, which was the first company David David Nordschow (aka David Eden) founded before he sold and left Eden (left in 2009) and founded DNA (David Nordschow Amplification) releasing his first cabs in 2010.

Arguably, David's best cab designs when he owned Eden were his XST cabs, which had tighter and lower bottom end, and higher power handling than his XLT cabs as well as a very flat frequency response. Lots of folks still preferred the sound of the low-mid hump in his XLT cabs but some EQ adjustment in the low-mids between 250Hz and 500Hz will get really close to the XLT sound. Regardless of which cabs you prefer, clean, clear, and articulate sound is the hallmark of Eden amps and cabs and all of David's designs.

One of the things that David has always done was design and build new speakers to integrate with his cabinets. So the first thing he did starting DNA is design new speakers and cabs. He came up with cabs that are a level above the XST cabs he designed for Eden. The DNA cabs use long-throw speakers as well as flared and textured ports. They have very high sensitivity and HUGE power handling. Often those two features are often mutually exclusive of each other, but not with these cabs.

In 2010 he came out two [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]'s (regular and mini) a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed], a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed], and a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]. I wanted to get two of the 112's because they are amazing speakers but would need to get two of them and they weren't cheap. For a few hundred $$ more I could get the DNS-410. It will handle 1400-watts rms (mechanically and thermally) and has a maximum SPL of 137db, which is well above the threshold of pain.

It also has a very low and tight bottom end as well as clarity, articulation, and a super-clean sound a step above all of his Eden designs. Figured using the Eden 800 watt amp that I bought directly from David (was his cab testing bench amp at Eden) when he left in 2010, I could drive that cab as loud as I would ever need it and would never have to buy another cab. My 800-watt amp will drive it to 134db, which is still above the threshold of pain.

Well, it took me a while to get the $$, but in 2015 I finally bought it. Paid $1,000 for it then and now street price is between $1,049 and $1,149. It arrived 2-days before our move from Virginia to the Pacific Northwest east and we live in the greater Seattle area. So I loaded it in our moving van and away we went. In 2016 I started gigging with it and found I really had a problem with it in small venues. Don't get me wrong, it sounds great at low levels as well as deafening levels, but it tends to scare owners of small brew-pubs when you roll in a 410. Their eyes get big and round, they shake their head "No", and they typically point to a small combo they want you to use. So I really needed to buy another cab.

Got an Eden EX-112 for $269 and used one of my older Eden amps with it to get away from that problem. Sounded so good the first time I used it that I bought a second one and started using two of those 112's for medium-sized venues reserving my DNS-410 for large venues, outdoor venues, and Festivals. It was a great set-up and I got a lot of compliments on my sound using them. But I really missed the sound of my DNS-410, which was the next step up in clarity. So I started thinking about getting the DNS-210. Nobody looks sideways at a bassist bringing in a 210 and it supposedly had the same sonic characteristics as my 410 but in a smaller, lighter package.

In 2019 I wrote to David, gave him a bio and asked if there was a chance I could get into his Endorsing Program. He passed off my info to John Vitale who is in charge of Artist Relations at DNA. He called me back and told me what I needed to send in and then asked what cab I wanted to buy. Told him I would really like the DNS-210. He said, "yeah, great cab" and then gave me a good price on it. Wasn't free and wasn't
dealer wholesale, but it did save me a chunk of $. The street price on it seems to vary between $849 and $969.

The first night I used it, I also brought my DNS-410 and stacked my 210 on top of it. The venue wasn't quite large but it was bigger than a medium-sized club. So it was an "almost large" venue. From the specs on paper, it shouldn't be a problem, but real life sometimes doesn't cooperate. With it stacked on top of my 410, if it wasn't enough to cover the room adequately, I could quickly unplug the 210 and plug the 410 in - no question the 410 could cover it. Did a sound check and using my wireless, I walked the perimeter of the club as well as walking through the dance floor to make sure everything was good. It does have the same sonic characteristics as my 410 and had a nice balance throughout club. So I thought we were good to go.

About 20-minutes later we started the set and I had to physically move over by the drummer and behind my amp because it was killing my ears - painful! I couldn't move my amp farther back on my corner of this shallow stage so I moved it over next to our mains. Still killed my ears on the next song...my drummer was laughing at me. After the second song, I moved our mains over as far as they would go and then moved my amp next to it and up towards the front of the stage a bit. This finally got me out of that 60° cone of dispersion and my ears stopped hurting. So, yeah, it can easily handle that space.

Here's what it look like that night before I started moving it over and up:

1_709x1082.jpg
 
Yeah, I'm definitely the guy to tell you about DNA amps and cabs as I am a DNA Endorser (was accepted to their group in 2019) and I have amps and cabs by DNA. I also have Eden amps and cabs, which was the first company David David Nordschow (aka David Eden) founded before he sold and left Eden (left in 2009) and founded DNA (David Nordschow Amplification) releasing his first cabs in 2010.

Arguably, David's best cab designs when he owned Eden were his XST cabs, which had tighter and lower bottom end, and higher power handling than his XLT cabs as well as a very flat frequency response. Lots of folks still preferred the sound of the low-mid hump in his XLT cabs but some EQ adjustment in the low-mids between 250Hz and 500Hz will get really close to the XLT sound. Regardless of which cabs you prefer, clean, clear, and articulate sound is the hallmark of Eden amps and cabs and all of David's designs.

One of the things that David has always done was design and build new speakers to integrate with his cabinets. So the first thing he did starting DNA is design new speakers and cabs. He came up with cabs that are a level above the XST cabs he designed for Eden. The DNA cabs use long-throw speakers as well as flared and textured ports. They have very high sensitivity and HUGE power handling. Often those two features are often mutually exclusive of each other, but not with these cabs.

In 2010 he came out two [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]'s (regular and mini) a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed], a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed], and a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]. I wanted to get two of the 112's because they are amazing speakers but would need to get two of them and they weren't cheap. For a few hundred $$ more I could get the DNS-410. It will handle 1400-watts rms (mechanically and thermally) and has a maximum SPL of 137db, which is well above the threshold of pain.

It also has a very low and tight bottom end as well as clarity, articulation, and a super-clean sound a step above all of his Eden designs. Figured using the Eden 800 watt amp that I bought directly from David (was his cab testing bench amp at Eden) when he left in 2010, I could drive that cab as loud as I would ever need it and would never have to buy another cab. My 800-watt amp will drive it to 134db, which is still above the threshold of pain.

Well, it took me a while to get the $$, but in 2015 I finally bought it. Paid $1,000 for it then and now street price is between $1,049 and $1,149. It arrived 2-days before our move from Virginia to the Pacific Northwest east and we live in the greater Seattle area. So I loaded it in our moving van and away we went. In 2016 I started gigging with it and found I really had a problem with it in small venues. Don't get me wrong, it sounds great at low levels as well as deafening levels, but it tends to scare owners of small brew-pubs when you roll in a 410. Their eyes get big and round, they shake their head "No", and they typically point to a small combo they want you to use. So I really needed to buy another cab.

Got an Eden EX-112 for $269 and used one of my older Eden amps with it to get away from that problem. Sounded so good the first time I used it that I bought a second one and started using two of those 112's for medium-sized venues reserving my DNS-410 for large venues, outdoor venues, and Festivals. It was a great set-up and I got a lot of compliments on my sound using them. But I really missed the sound of my DNS-410, which was the next step up in clarity. So I started thinking about getting the DNS-210. Nobody looks sideways at a bassist bringing in a 210 and it supposedly had the same sonic characteristics as my 410 but in a smaller, lighter package.

In 2019 I wrote to David, gave him a bio and asked if there was a chance I could get into his Endorsing Program. He passed off my info to John Vitale who is in charge of Artist Relations at DNA. He called me back and told me what I needed to send in and then asked what cab I wanted to buy. Told him I would really like the DNS-210. He said, "yeah, great cab" and then gave me a good price on it. Wasn't free and wasn't
dealer wholesale, but it did save me a chunk of $. The street price on it seems to vary between $849 and $969.

The first night I used it, I also brought my DNS-410 and stacked my 210 on top of it. The venue wasn't quite large but it was bigger than a medium-sized club. So it was an "almost large" venue. From the specs on paper, it shouldn't be a problem, but real life sometimes doesn't cooperate. With it stacked on top of my 410, if it wasn't enough to cover the room adequately, I could quickly unplug the 210 and plug the 410 in - no question the 410 could cover it. Did a sound check and using my wireless, I walked the perimeter of the club as well as walking through the dance floor to make sure everything was good. It does have the same sonic characteristics as my 410 and had a nice balance throughout club. So I thought we were good to go.

About 20-minutes later we started the set and I had to physically move over by the drummer and behind my amp because it was killing my ears - painful! I couldn't move my amp farther back on my corner of this shallow stage so I moved it over next to our mains. Still killed my ears on the next song...my drummer was laughing at me. After the second song, I moved our mains over as far as they would go and then moved my amp next to it and up towards the front of the stage a bit. This finally got me out of that 60° cone of dispersion and my ears stopped hurting. So, yeah, it can easily handle that space.

Here's what it look like that night before I started moving it over and up:

View attachment 4362470

In early June of this year, I finally was able to get the DNA-800 amp I had expected to buy in April of 2020. Covid-19 had different ideas. In May of 2021, after ordering the amp through the the DNA Artist Relations rep, John Vitale, I found out that they were out of them at the factory but that David had enough parts on hand to build one for me. Said it would probably take a week to get it built and another week to get it to me, but he would get one built and sent to me. He did and he was kind enough to sign it too. Kind of a kick to get an amp built for you by the designer of that amp!

My Eden WT500/800 is a great amp with great sound. But I don't care for the auto-compressor (good for slap and that's about it IMO) and, being a Class A/B amp, it weighs about 36-lbs in its rack. The DNA-800 on the other hand is a class D amp weighing just 4.7-lbs., that will deliver 800-watts rms into 4Ω and will go down to 2 ohms if needed. It will only deliver 400-watts into either of my 8 ohm DNS cabs, but that should be enough to take them to gig levels without a problem. Plus, if I ever actually play both my DNS-210 and DNS-410 together, it will happily deliver 800-watts to that stack.

DNA-800-Front.jpg


The front of the amp has a mute button (mutes everything except the tuner out); a gain control with "set level" light (basically you want that light dancing, not being off or solidly on all the time). If you are using an active bass with a really hot signal, just pull out the Gain control for a 10db pad on the signal. The Shape control boosts bass, cuts low-mids, and slowly boosts treble. This Shape control has much more granularity and is far more usable than the David's Enhance feature on his Eden amps. You can bypass it by with the optional footswitch if you want to. Or you can use it and still dial in a bit of any of the rest of the EQ you want to augment that sound. I used it just slightly and also boosted the Low-Mids with it to get a nice sound. Got a similar sound by boosting both the bass and the low-mids slightly while the shape was turned all the way off.

Next comes the EQ section which is a simplified EQ with some really musical frequency centers. The Bass EQ is centered at 35Hz, the low-mids at 500hz, High-mids at 2KHz, and Treble is a shelving unit boosting or cutting everything above 2KHz. So there's not as much granularity (there's that word again!) as my WT500/800 has with its three semi-parametrics plus bass, treble EQ's, but in actuality it's really easy to dial in a good sound with it.

The built-in studio quality compressor is the next item. It has adjustable Threshold and Ratio controls so you can dial in how quickly you want it to activate and what ratio you want to use. You can take it everywhere from just compressing the top of the peaks and adding a little extra sustain, all the way up to an organ-like sound with no attack and sustain that just doesn't stop. It has a small purple LED that flashes at you as the compressor engages and disengages. When the light is on, the compressor is compressing. You can bypass the compressor by pulling out the Threshold control.

On the back of the amp you'll find the on/off switch above the power cord connection. There are two Speakon Speaker outputs and one "emergency" 1/4" output. They call it emergency because that is sometimes the only way you can connect, but pushing 800-watts rms through that is a LOT of power and you need to be really careful that 1/4" plug is not inserted while the amp is on and the plug is protected from someone tripping over it and pulling it out of socket while the amp is on. Next on the back is the DI output. The DI defaults to Pre EQ, but can be changed to Post EQ by pulling out the "Shape" control. Next to that is the DI level adjustment. Usually just leaving it at straight up noon is fine, but if you have a sound tech, let him know that you can adjust the signal strength of your DI if he needs it higher or lower.
DNA-800-Rear.jpg

Below that is Aux-in level, which is really nice if you are running a drum machine through our amp or an mp3 player. The Aux inputs are RCA plugs for a more robust connection if you put a drum machine into the Aux-In. The jacks next to it start with the footswitch jack on top. The optional footswitch turns the EQ from whatever settings you've dialed in to straight wire flat, and also turns on and off the Shape control. Next are the inputs for the Pre FX Send and below that the FX return.

And finally for the last two jacks, we have the tuner-out on the top (mute button does not mute the tuner out signal) and below that the rear input jack. If you run this amp in a rack with rack effects that allows you to plug into the back and run all your effects through the back keeping the front of the amp clean without a bunch of wires hanging around it. I just plug my wireless into it and leave the wireless receiver behind the amp or to the side of it. It's a small thing, but it just looks cleaner than sitting on top of the amp with wires going into the front. You can use either the input in the front or the one in the back, but you can't use both at the same time.

And finally here's that video from bass musician magazine.com where Raul goes through the features of the amp while demonstrating it through a DNS-210 cab. I've cued it up to the part where he starts talking about the amp. It will give you and idea about how the amp and that DNS-210 cab sound.

 
What are you saying?

View attachment 4362443

:)

Yeah, for Oregon we have two Mesa dealers in the state. Better than some. Then Guitar Centers, you know how that goes. You really have to hunt to find the good stuff :)
:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:
yeah, don’t get me started on the whole Cleveland rocks thing and still not able to take a stronghold in the music production/recording industry.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DJ Bebop
I keep forgetting that I too have an Eden cab I play through. I forget cause the sticker fell off.
It's a CX 110 :)
The top one...
View attachment 4361981

I know, that does nothing to help with what is going on here.
:)
Years back, about the time I had the 210XLT, I had a 4ohm EX112 and loved the tone in that cab, as well. I ended up selling it because, it only had one speaker connection and I don’t have any inclination to modify my amp equipment.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DJ Bebop
Years back, about the time I had the 210XLT, I had a 4ohm EX112 and loved the tone in that cab, as well. I ended up selling it because, it only had one speaker connection and I don’t have any inclination to modify my amp equipment.
I had two 210 XLT and two D-410XLT cabs....They played very well together...To me the standard I measure others by.
My Bergantino cabs HT210 and HT15 were a great pair too
But I was not thrilled with the HT12..small and heavy/awkward

Gave up my Eden cabs for Epifani UL410 and 310 cabs....Very happy
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: BOOG
I just spoke with Grasshopper from Bass Central in Florida, and they’re enroute with ETA Wednesday (08/11).
I’m hoping I have time to do an A/B video of these and the outgoing Hartke cabs before I sell them. If I do, I’ll get it posted in here.

To everyone that contributed to the thread with thoughts, ideas and opinions I really appreciate you taking the time to do so.
 
I just spoke with Grasshopper from Bass Central in Florida, and they’re enroute with ETA Wednesday (08/11).
I’m hoping I have time to do an A/B video of these and the outgoing Hartke cabs before I sell them. If I do, I’ll get it posted in here.

To everyone that contributed to the thread with thoughts, ideas and opinions I really appreciate you taking the time to do so.
You ROCK! Looking forward to it!
 
  • Like
Reactions: BOOG
Unless you contributed Mesa content, amirite? :D:cool:

But seriously, congrats on the DNA Purchase. I look forward to your review/thoughts. Look like great stuff!
See, it’s not that I dislike or don’t value Mesa cabs. The bottom line is, I have played through and heard Eden cabs and I have also heard Mesa cabs in similar context and my ear prefers the Eden thing. That being the case, DNA is the logical choice.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DJ Bebop