If you bother to look at the video, it's obvious she's not only playing, but tearing it up. One thing is though, that the audio and video are not quite in synch. It's fairly obvious from the drums. This is pretty common for live videos that end up on Instagram, but it may throw some viewers off. That's giving them the benefit of the doubt, which they may not deserve.
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Claims about Este Haim's live playing
- Thread starter DCGuy
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If you bother to look at the video, it's obvious she's not only playing, but tearing it up. One thing is though, that the audio and video are not quite in synch. It's fairly obvious from the drums. This is pretty common for live videos that end up on Instagram, but it may throw some viewers off. That's giving them the benefit of the doubt, which they may not deserve.
This is interesting insight and it surprised me. Thanks for sharing. I would have thought the opposite. But the more I thought about it, the more it makes sense. it's almost like in the past people were not constantly talking about feminism and gender dynamics so there wasn't the level of animosity that has built up today between all the angry factions. Now the topic is unavoidable and people are picking sides versus just getting to know someone and treating them decently and professionally.
I'm sure these tools would try to claim this same lie about one of my bass hero's not being a real player Meshell Ndegeocello. I'll be honest when ever I see a woman playing BASS I'm like hell yeah because there were not many females playing bass when I was a teenager in the olden days of the 70's. The Taste of Honey was the only one I knew of at the time. There's so many great female bass players Nic West, Rhonda Smith, Gail Ann Dorsey, Ida Neilsen to name just a few. I don't care who's playing the BASS if they're jamming & Grooving I'm right there with them. I'm sure Nancy Wilson of Heart use to get this same crap. SMDH!
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While I have no doubt they deal with an overwhelming amount of sexism (especially considering the music industry), groups like Motley Crue and Kiss have been getting a lot of the “they fake it on stage” hate lately as well. Which might be the reason someone would say the claims aren’t particularly sexist.
That's pretty much it in a nutshell. I was out there before everyone got really angry about it. People seemed more willing to accept changes in attitudes. Now there are big divides and it has become about much more than just science, biology, and ability. It's now about aligning yourself with a mindset or a group or a faction or whatever. So it seems a lot different to me now.
On the other hand, I was younger then so it's possible I was less aware of some of these dynamics than I am today. All I know is that I don't recall ever noticing much of it until much later.
Sad to say, but I agree. My sisters are both pros in their fields and it grinds them to no end when people are condescending or “oh, how lucky you are”.
Right. See my comments about Verdine White. Legacy acts in particular might be having a hard time keeping up. There are reasons you might wonder about some folks being able to do in their 60's and 70's what they were able to do in their 20's. I saw Page and Plant back in the 90's and was seriously wondering if Plant was triggering samples because it was hard to believe he could still hit some of those notes. And he wasn't even that old then.
But that's not why this group of relatively young women is complaining that they've already been hearing these complaints for years. There are always reasons people think what they think. Nobody's accusing Este Haim of being too old to play.
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There are a lot of bands that are clearly all about the show (or mostly anyway) - KISS, GWAR, many others - and if it really IS about the show and nothing else, then "faking it" could even be a boon to the aesthetic if their acting chops are up to snuff. Haim does not fit into this category.
I think a lot of "The Last Waltz" was rerecorded to make a better movie. But it was members of the band that did the rerecording. You can see parts where the sound doesn't match what Rick Danko is (visually) playing, but Rick's overdubs are great. And it wasn't just Rick's parts. Robbie's as well, possibly others. But nobody claims that the Band used backing tracks or otherwise couldn't play well.
The most on-the-point comment here was the one about Este's bass face. Her famous bass face can't be faked.
Thanks for posting your insights LBS-bass.
When people give these kinds of "compliments"...its not about you, its about them, and in all areas of life I've noticed people are really into doing things like this. If you want to compliment someone on their playing, nobody is doing to dislike that, but doing what people do is basically saying "you don't play too bad for a ______"
When I saw them last year Nikki Sixx was definitely playing bass. Ironically there was a rhythm guitar backing track behind every solo when Mick was playing lead and he is the one making the claims these days. Same tracks not there with John 5.
I've seen lots of people make these claims when bands play large venues because the sounds isn't sync'd 100% to the visual when you get far enough away because...well...light moves faster than sound.
So any criticism of a female musician is sexist?
Isn’t it possible that something else started this? A live mix at some shows that made the bass inaudible, for example. FWIW I believe this criticism to be without merit. I was interested in how it propagated.
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Who said "any criticism"?
You sure do see a lot more of this kind of "she can't really play" directed at female artists than at male artists, despite the equal likelihood of a bad mix.
I think there was a time where a comment like "Is it just me or is the bass player miming to a track?" would have illicited discussion about that - speculation as to whether the audio was synced properly, whatever. These comments are often made on bands' appearances for TV. It's a common remark in feeds. These sorts of discussions may annoy artists but they have never been off limits.
It's the band's explosive reaction that made a story for the music media to write about, and the clickbait age we live in means these magazines never need much encouragement to stoke a controversy.
Each person can decide if this comment was made only because she's a woman. I suppose that's up to all of you, but the same comments can be seen on many many social media clips, and the person who made it (since deleted his instagram account) works in the industry and really has no reason to publicly blast an artist. Though people do stupid things without thinking every day as well.
Anyway.
Would I be shocked if a band just playing a fly gig, on a festival bill where they only played two songs, was miming to a track? Probably, but not nearly as shocked as I would have been a few years ago.
It's the band's explosive reaction that made a story for the music media to write about, and the clickbait age we live in means these magazines never need much encouragement to stoke a controversy.
Each person can decide if this comment was made only because she's a woman. I suppose that's up to all of you, but the same comments can be seen on many many social media clips, and the person who made it (since deleted his instagram account) works in the industry and really has no reason to publicly blast an artist. Though people do stupid things without thinking every day as well.
Anyway.
Would I be shocked if a band just playing a fly gig, on a festival bill where they only played two songs, was miming to a track? Probably, but not nearly as shocked as I would have been a few years ago.
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I think it was Mick Mars who said Nikki didn't play a note the whole tour, was miming the entire time.
Never heard of them until now, watched some of their videos. They absolutely can play. Ridiculous that anyone would even question it.
Time out, y'all.
I don't care about the one-off this or that. Anyone can be accused, yada yada yada.
The band says they hear this all the time for their entire careers. That's what people are responding to. Comparing this article with a one-off complaint about someone else who isn't saying they hear this all the time and have heard it their entire careers entirely misses the point.
My experience suggests this experience they relate is likely to be true. Why are you saying that all of us are liars? It's not like we aren't also tired of hearing that one.
When you can all tell me that you hear it all the time too, or you constantly get comments about "wow it's hard to believe you can play like that," you can have an opinion based in experience that I'll care about. Until then it's just the same tired claptrap of people with no clue dismissing the lived experiences of those who do.
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