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Creating space

#61
There’s probably wisdom to be gained from the harsh words your “friend” gave you, and also, don’t play with someone who’d rather insult your playing than give constructive critique.

Those comments aren’t really gonna help you play better. They’re just insulting for the sake of posturing and acting like they’re hot isht. Saying your bass lines are generic doesn’t help you play less generically. Saying there isn’t enough space doesn’t explain what space they're looking for. Your friend is playing some ego bs and isn’t really helping.

Yes there’s something to be said about not playing “generically.” There’s even more to be said about leaving space. But if they’re only telling you what’s wrong without offering fair and clear explanations as to what generic means to them and what space they’re looking for, that’s useless to you.

I’m a huge fan of leaving a lot of space. If you can do with one note what others need 3 to do, that one note is three times more valuable. And also, maybe your guitarist friend just wanted more “space” so they can solo endlessly over the space. A lot of guitarist complain about bassists playing too much because it gets in the way of them playing too much themselves.
 
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#64
pLewis said:
Good afternoon everyone, I don't think this is the area I should be posting this thread, however I need some help. I had a friend of mine come over to play/jam we've been talking about getting something moving for a while. We ended up playing for about 30 min. He then turned to me and said "I don't want to just jam on the same three chords, I need a bass line that creates space" what on earth does that mean?
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As if generating “space” is just a duty of the bass player …
 
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#65
pLewis said:
...
He then turned to me and said "I don't want to just jam on the same three chords, I need a bass line that creates space" what on earth does that mean?
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If he is noodling/soloing/wanking on the guitar and there are only two of you then he is to a large extent reliant on you to provide an improvised harmonic foundation. The notes and lines you play on the bass will by their very naure imply a certain harmony, chord, chord sequence, change or cadence. There must be something in what you are playing that implies the same 3 chords and he is just asking you to mix is up a bit. I would go away and learn a handful of songs that have different harmonic structures/rhythms beyond the basic 12-bar (or whatever) structure it is that you and he together* are locked into. Try to identify other typical, popular or common sequences used in contemporary song-writing. Examples might include I-V-IV-V, ii-V-I or iv-iii-IV-V-I in major and i-b7-b6-b7 or v-I-II-i in the minor key.

* Whilst a lot of this may rest on your shoulders, it is also highly likely that his 'solos' are leading you around certain changes by setting up certain cadences or other signposts that pull you in certain directions. So this should not be a one-sided affair when in comes to breaking out.
 
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#67
pLewis said:
Good afternoon everyone, I don't think this is the area I should be posting this thread, however I need some help. I had a friend of mine come over to play/jam we've been talking about getting something moving for a while. We ended up playing for about 30 min. He then turned to me and said "I don't want to just jam on the same three chords, I need a bass line that creates space" what on earth does that mean?
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do you perhaps know the locrian mode? I think I might know a way to shut your friend up pretty quick. honestly you can't blame your lack of creativity on others in the band... but that said... rise to the occasion. 3 chords... well if they are just root/5th then modally you have left MORE room for him to interpret and change mode. Perhaps channel christopher walkins "explore the space... really... explore the space".
 
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#68
I'd just ask him to show you whatever it is he's talking about. Give you some examples.

There's no way to really know what he means without him being a little more clear. The amount of chords you're playing has nothing to do with creating space, so he may not be communicating all too well.
 
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#70
pLewis said:
No I appreciate yalls feedback, guitarist said and I quote "your baselines are generic you need to create more space" I guess thats where I am confused.
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Well, maybe your bass lines ARE generic and you DO need to create more space. But I don't think people here are going to be able to say what you could be doing differently without hearing what it is that you're doing now.

Like, what tunes were you playing? How were you playing bass on these? What style?
 
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#75
Egg250 said:
Maybe, I'd reply with nothing but roots and then find another gig. Showboating with riff salad is one thing. Playing fills that support the music is quite different.
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My dad told me when I was still a kid the difference between a lesson and a reprimand is how it is received. I chose to take it as my boss telling me to just relax and serve the song.
 
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#76
What the drummer is asking, is not "harsh" at all, as others have suggested.
It's a sign of a drummer that knows his stuff.

What you are being asked to do is to create a groove that does not lock him, the drummer, into a particular pattern.
When a drummer is locked into a particular pattern, the music can become very stale or monotonous very quickly.
Following a guitarist is the quickest path to causing this problem.

How to give him that space or freedom he requires?

Play your groove for the first bar, on the second bar, break it down into two sections: for the first section play half notes. Second section, play quater notes (or triple notes or whatever), just stay inside the primary structure of the given song. Then again, on the 3rd bar, play your groove, on the 4th bar, mix it up a bit...
This is just an example and I hope it makes sense.

It's a simple trick that adds so much depth to the music as it frees up the rhythm section and makes the music much more interesting.

I encountered the same thing just the other day, when my brother, who's been playing drums for almost 50 years explained this to me.
Instantly, the penny dropped and it had a huge effect on the band and its music.
 
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