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Does playing an instrument make you a musician?

Who do you think is right?!


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To me, "musician" is a term describing an occupation or trade.

I think the real debate should be "instrumentalist" vs. "artist"

There are millions out there who dedicate themselves 100% to becoming techinically masterful who can shred on an instrument, but the music they play is vapid and awful.

Music is like many other things, e.g., web design, cooking, etc. There are loads of people out there who know advanced website coding, who can write code in their sleep, etc., but their websites look like total crap. And just because you studied cooking for 10 years straight and can amaze onlookers with your flair with your knives and utensils doesn't mean you can cook anything from scratch that tastes good. There are way too many techies out there with meager artistic sense, and too few true artists. Many artists are technically inept but still produce amazing things. I like to call those who are techincally as well as artistically proficient true "craftsmen" (or "craftswomen," of course).
 
My primary income source is from playing bass. I also love music, but that has nothing to do with being a musician or not, any more than it matters whether the guy at Jiffy Lube (who makes more than I do, by the way) loves cars or not. It's a job. I don't always love the music I have to play when I'm doing sessions, but I still give it my all, and overall, I'm doing something I love. My band is more-or-less a hobby. We make some money when we perform, but we don't do it often enough (once a month or so) for me to really consider it a steady income source, and thus it is rightfully called a hobby.

Not anyone can be a musician. It takes skill and training and natural talent, just like any other job. To be really good at it, you also have to be creative and ambitious and persistent, etc, just like any other job.

It doesn't really bother me either way; if someone wants to say he's a musician, it's of no consequence to me whether he makes money from it or not (unless I'm competing with him/her for the same gig, haha). I admire anyone who puts up with all the crap involved in performing music and sticks with it, but the more appropriate name for it would be aspiring, if you're not yet pro. Like I said, there is no shame in that at all, it's just the meaning of the language. If you call yourself a musician, people will presume you do it for a living. In the interest of good communication, it would be better to say "aspiring" if that's what you really are, lest people presume you're already a professional.

every1 i talk 2.......if i say i'm a musician..they assume i play an instrument........

i dont know where u get your facts....

but lets jsut agree 2 disagree ok?

:bassist:
 
OMFG......i still dont agree with u.......but w/e......that means any1 can b a musician...it takes talent to b a musician...if thats wut u think music is all about....then you're not a musician yourself........

:bassist::mad:
This is just a misunderstanding of terms, I think. What Dave is saying is absolutely true, and I think at this point all you're doing is arguing semantics. Wasn't your main point in the first place that your "friend" considered himself a bassist just because he had one?

So let's replace the term "musician" with "bassist" and move on:

The guitard in one of my bands has a great saying for situations like this, "There is a difference between a bass PLAYER and a bass OWNER. This guy's the latter."
 
A musician is someone that makes music. You don't even have to play an instrument.

This is about as ******** as the "not a real sport" arguement. Well, 13 people on an internet message board don't think I'm a musician, so I guess I'm not!
 
For what it's worth, here's the dictionary definition of "musician":

one skilled in music ; especially[emphasis theirs] : a composer, conductor, or professional performer of music

"musician." Webster's Third New International Dictionary, Unabridged. Merriam-Webster, 2002. http://unabridged.merriam-webster.com (6 Feb. 2008).

---

So I guess we're both right - if you're skilled in music, you're a musician, but I'm "more" right, lol, because the term usually means a professional performer of music (professional meaning "one that engages in a particular pursuit, study, or science for gain or livelihood," gain being in the financial sense of a net gain, from the same dictionary).

If you regularly perform but don't get paid, that's usually/more correctly called an aspiring musician. I'm not saying you're wrong, but it's more correct to say aspiring first.

:)

Now your hitting it where i'm thinking here's my 2cents. I have always refered to myself as a player...a Bass player why? I play the bass and although im pretty good im not an expert or at the level to teach,instruct etc. I also cant write music or read or transcribe written music or teach theory classes etc. I also have no professional experience just bar/club bands so im a player IMHO.

The definition says "Skilled" in music a conductor ,composer or professional performer. I am not a musician by label although i have been paid to play. I dont feel pay has anything to do with it at all...this definds it right here....BTW if a painter paints a picture gives it to a gallery to hang and keep and charges nothing (donates) is he/she an artist or just a painter?
 
every1 i talk 2.......if i say i'm a musician..they assume i play an instrument........

i dont know where u get your facts....

but lets jsut agree 2 disagree ok?

:bassist:

I think it just depends on your age. If I recall correctly, you said you're 15? At 15, if you say you're a musician, no one will presume you do it for a living, since at 15, society does not expect to be supporting yourself with an income. I'm only 24, but when I say I'm a musician, IMO because I'm an adult, people presume I mean "professional."

It really is just semantics. We are both musicians. If you don't do it for a living, technically/according to the dictionary, you're an "aspiring" musician; and if you do, technically, you're a "professional" musician. But these are both adjectives to describe what you are: a musician, so I don't even think we're disagreeing in the first place, lol. IMHO. The only thing I'm saying is that, if you don't specify whether you are aspiring or professional, past a certain age, people will assume you mean professional.
 
:bassist:
This is just a misunderstanding of terms, I think. What Dave is saying is absolutely true, and I think at this point all you're doing is arguing semantics. Wasn't your main point in the first place that your "friend" considered himself a bassist just because he had one?

So let's replace the term "musician" with "bassist" and move on:

The guitard in one of my bands has a great saying for situations like this, "There is a difference between a bass PLAYER and a bass OWNER. This guy's the latter."

he doesnt even own a bass...he just plays one from school every once in a blue moon.....
 
I think it just depends on your age. If I recall correctly, you said you're 15? At 15, if you say you're a musician, no one will presume you do it for a living, since at 15, society does not expect to be supporting yourself with an income. I'm only 24, but when I say I'm a musician, IMO because I'm an adult, people presume I mean "professional."

It really is just semantics. We are both musicians. If you don't do it for a living, technically/according to the dictionary, you're an "aspiring" musician; and if you do, technically, you're a "professional" musician. But these are both adjectives to describe what you are: a musician, so I don't even think we're disagreeing in the first place, lol. IMHO. The only thing I'm saying is that, if you don't specify whether you are aspiring or professional, past a certain age, people will assume you mean professional.

ok i can swing with that....but i'll prolly same i'm a musician for the rest of my life.....unless i stopp...wich i doubt...cause i could never give up music...i would die.....seriously...i can barely make it a day without playing music
:bassist:
 
Now your hitting it where i'm thinking here's my 2cents. I have always refered to myself as a player...a Bass player why? I play the bass and although im pretty good im not an expert or at the level to teach,instruct etc. I also cant write music or read or transcribe written music or teach theory classes etc. I also have no professional experience just bar/club bands so im a player IMHO.

The definition says "Skilled" in music a conductor ,composer or professional performer. I am not a musician by label although i have been paid to play. I dont feel pay has anything to do with it at all...this definds it right here....BTW if a painter paints a picture gives it to a gallery to hang and keep and charges nothing (donates) is he/she an artist or just a painter?

THANK U!!! pay has nothing to do with it......

as for the painting thingy....hmmm......yeah i would assume that person is an artist.....just because u dont get money...doesnt define wut you are (in this particular situation)

:bassist:
 
ok i can swing with that....but i'll prolly same i'm a musician for the rest of my life.....unless i stopp...wich i doubt...cause i could never give up music...i would die.....seriously...i can barely make it a day without playing music
:bassist:

Radical! Like totally, for sure! I would so die too!


















sorry, I couldn't help myself......:D
 
Oh, so he's one of those guys that goes around telling people he's a bassist just because he may have sneezed on one a few months back, I gotcha.

This particular specimen is what I like to call a "douche". Don't worry about him.

yeah i know tell me about it....he also makes fun of the way i walk and talk....cause i talk quietly and mumble sometimes....but my walk is totaly normal....hes a douche......
yeah he only touches it when he begs and begs the teacher to let him play on teh simplest of songs....and then i still have 2 teach him everything all over again....god..its like a friggen 3 year old....he has the potential...but he's nowhere close to being a bassist



lol!! :D :bassist:
 
...I think at this point all you're doing is arguing semantics....

You say "all you're doing is arguing semantics" like it's a bad thing. The whole point of this thread is semantics, isn't it? Semantics is "the study of meanings of words in language." If we're not going to get into semantics, what's the point of this thread? lol

The thread title is "Does playing an instrument make you a musician?" The implied alternative is that there is more to being a musician than playing an instrument. What that difference actually is depends on who you ask -- which is what the field of semantics is all about. Is it skill, love of the instrument, love of music in general, getting paid to play, being able to charge regardless of whether you actually charge or not, making a net profit from play, music being your primary source of income?...

None of these are right or wrong answers on their own; they depend on the situation. To answer the question posed in the thread title, it depends on who you ask.

If you ask your average teenager, who doesn't pay any real-world bills, "What is a musician?", you are likely to hear that it's someone who performs music in some way, usually on an instrument, presumably because they enjoy it (why else would they do it?). You may not hear any mention of money at all.

If you ask a 30-year-old woman with a degree in psychology and a master's in secondary education, who has a full-time job as a career counselor at a high school, "What is a musician?", you are likely to hear that it's someone who makes a living writing, performing, and/or recording music. Love for music, skill, talent, and natural musical ability probably won't even come up - it's may not be part of her off-the-top-of-her-head definition at all.

If you ask a 53-year-old adult with 3 kids and 1 grandkid, who has a degree in electrical engineering and has been working as an engineer with the same company (full-time with salary & benefits) for 30 years straight, who has a couple of nice guitars he bought in the '80s from when he used to play in a bar-band on weekends for extra dough, "What is a musician?", he might tell you that he used to be a part-time one, and although he still loves music, aside from the annual neighborhood barbecue or playing at his church for free, he hasn't really performed in years and now mostly just plays at home for fun. To him, a musician might be someone who loves playing music *and* makes money from it, full-time/professionally.

If you ask me or any adult working musician, "What is a musician?", you are likely to hear something similar to/a combination of the career counselor & the engineer's responses - someone who writes, performs, or records music, usually on an instrument, and it's his primary income source. The word "composer" is usually reserved for someone who earns his living from writing and licensing music, perhaps recording as well, if he doubles as an instrumentalist. Composer also imply classical "art" music, or alternatively, commercial music (jingles, etc). Songwriter usually means just what it sounds like - someone who works for a publishing company or record label, etc, who writes music for others to record, and that's his job.

On the other hand, "singer/songwriter" means something totally different. A singer/songwriter has the same implication, in my opinion, as "aspiring actress," in that most people will assume you mean that it's not a full-time job, you may not get paid at all, and you do it completely out of passion, to balance out the reality of working at a coffee-shop or retail store, etc. "Singer/songwriter" can also be used for someone who makes a full-time living writing songs and singing them, such as Fiona Apple, etc, and usually accompanying him/herself on guitar or piano, often without a backing band, or the term can even used as a description of the genre of acoustic, rootsy/folksy music usually without a backing band.

In my humble opinion, to most adults who earn their own incomes, the label "musician," given without further clarification, is taken to meant "professional musician." If you specify "aspiring musician," just like "aspiring actress," etc, everyone understands that this means you hope to be making a living by doing it someday, but right now, you are not making money from it or even losing money doing it. This is different from a "hobbyist," like the electrical engineer, who isn't even trying to make money from it and doesn't charge to perform (e.g. playing at his church).

Hobbyist musicians, aspiring musicians, professional musicians, singer/songwriters, composers, etc are all musicians. Musician is the umbrella word for all of these things. However, my main point is that, if we're talking semantics (which is, from what I gathered of the original post and the thread title, what the point of this discussion is), "musician" said alone implies you mean it as a job title, and without further clarification, to most people is implied to have the word "professional" in front of it.

Whew! Hope this helps. Personally, I just say I'm a bassist :D

:bassist:
 
Very well said, Dave. :D

I was actually referring more to the fact that the OP was originally griping about a guy who called himself a bassist just because he plays one once a year. Way I see it, it was just the wrong word put in the wrong place and suddenly the whole thread got derailed.

That said, your standpoint on the whole situation is the same as mine. :D
 
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