Double Bass EA Combos

[Freddels]

No twiddling pal. We don't twiddle w/ EA gear.
If you want to compare and contrast the iAMP with your Walter Woods for us at some point too, that would be pretty cool.

OK, I won't "twiddle". As far as a compare/contrast with the WW, I'm not much of an audiophile. I just know what sounds good to me. I like to be able to just plug and play. The WW has been fine but it's been 22 yrs since I've bought a new amp so I figured I'd like to try something new and have something for a backup should Murphy apply his law.

Before the WW, I had a Sunn 2000S head (bought while in high school) with an Ampeg B-15 cab. Talk about some heavy stuff to carry.

 

[bolo]

Before the WW, I had a Sunn 2000S head (bought while in high school) with an Ampeg B-15 cab. Talk about some heavy stuff to carry.

I can relate. In college I had a 70's SVT head, SVT 8x10 cab, and a Sunn 2x15 cab. The SVT cab took up the whole back seat of my '74 Plymouth Valiant (whoa!). Going up and down stairs took two people, and was still a bear.

Funny ... I didn't think about how durn big & heavy these things were back then. They were just .. my gear.

The university (Virginia Tech) also had a B-15 fliptop that I used to play through when I was in the stage band for their travelling song & dance troupe. I didn't realize then how cool this amp really was, or how sought after they were to become eventually. At the time, I didn't spend much time worrying about gear, and I was much more interested in the female singers & dancers in the troupe.

 

[Freddels]

I had my first gig with the iAmp and Wizzy today. It didn't sound great but it's not the fault of the amp. It was in the lobby of a hospital (at 8:00 a.m. don't ask) that was was all concrete with open balconies and escalators and about a 100 ft ceiling. We were backed up against a concrete wall and I just couldn't turn it up without sounding boomy. I didn't "twiddle" with the knobs. I swear!

(At the jam sessions in a smaller room it sounds really good)

 

[Mike Dimin]

It was in the lobby of a hospital (at 8:00 a.m. don't ask) that was was all concrete with open balconies and escalators and about a 100 ft ceiling. We were backed up against a concrete wall and I just couldn't turn it up without sounding boomy. I didn't "twiddle" with the knobs. I swear!

OK, let's gt this straight - this IS when you're supposed to twiddle the knobs!

Mike

 

[mje]

...It was in the lobby of a hospital (at 8:00 a.m. don't ask) that was was all concrete with open balconies and escalators and about a 100 ft ceiling. We were backed up against a concrete wall and I just couldn't turn it up without sounding boomy.

There really isn't much way around that sort of environment- other than to say that playing acoustic might cut the amount of echo. Without some surfaces that can absorb sound instead of reflecting it, you're #!%^$@.

 

[Freddels]

OK, let's gt this straight - this IS when you're supposed to twiddle the knobs!

Well they want us back at the end of the month for another go at it. I guess I could show up at 6:00 a.m. and start twiddling.

 

[Mike Dimin]

Well they want us back at the end of the month for another go at it. I guess I could show up at 6:00 a.m. and start twiddling.

read the primer - it is really the best way to approach the iAMPS EQ section:

http://www.euphonicaudio.com/2005/technology/iamp_eq.htm

 

[drurb]

OK, let's gt this straight - this IS when you're supposed to twiddle the knobs!

Mike

Twiddle all you want-- you're not going to tame that kind of reverberation by tailoring the spectrum with the EQ. Now, you know I love the parametric EQ on the EA head, but it cannot perform miracles.

 

[Mike Dimin]

Twiddle all you want-- you're not going to tame that kind of reverberation by tailoring the spectrum with the EQ. Now, you know I love the parametric EQ on the EA head, but it cannot perform miracles.

You will definetly have some control, at least in the near field - so you can hear yourself OK

Mike

 

[drurb]

You will definetly have some control, at least in the near field - so you can hear yourself OK

Mike

The near field? Well you'd have to have your head quite close to the speaker to be in the region where the inverse-square law does not apply (within one wavelength of the frequency under consideration--that's the near field)! If you mean in the region where the energy from the direct wavefront dominates that from the reverberant field, that begs the question. In the environment described, it would be difficult to find such a position. Shaping the spectrum would not be likely to result in a meaningful improvement. In fact, the more high-frequency content one included (in an effort to make things less muddy), the more the reverberation would be apparent.

The circumstances under which spectral shaping could tame nasty room responses would be when the problems stem from room resonances/standing waves.

My intent is not to be argumentative. Some rooms are just plain nightmares and there is little one can do to alleviate their problems with the controls offered on typical, and even atypical amplifiers. I condier the EA heads atypical and have trumpeted the benefits and advantages of their parametric EQ several times.

 

[tombowlus]

OK, let's gt this straight - this IS when you're supposed to twiddle the knobs!

Mike

LOL!!!

 

[Freddels]

When I wrote the manual I never used the word "twiddle"

Mike

OK, let's gt this straight - this IS when you're supposed to twiddle the knobs!

Mike

Make up your mind

 

[bolo]

There really isn't much way around that sort of environment- other than to say that playing acoustic might cut the amount of echo. Without some surfaces that can absorb sound instead of reflecting it, you're #!%^$@.

I was talking with Rick Jones from Acoustic Image once. If I remember this all correctly, he talked about a room where he played where there was a huge glass window behind the whole band, running from the floor to the ceiling. This made it interesting to all manner of passersby outside who could basically watch the backsides of the whole band while they played.

Anyway, he said the sound was awful. So get this ... The drummer ... the drummer says "Maybe we should all just bring down the volume."

Needless to say the non-drummer dudes were shocked by this, considering the source. But he was right. They found that bringing everything down in volume made for a much better overall sound.

 

[drurb]

I was talking with Rick Jones from Acoustic Image once. If I remember this all correctly, he talked about a room where he played where there was a huge glass window behind the whole band, running from the floor to the ceiling. This made it interesting to all manner of passersby outside who could basically watch the backsides of the whole band while they played.

Anyway, he said the sound was awful. So get this ... The drummer ... the drummer says "Maybe we should all just bring down the volume."

Needless to say the non-drummer dudes were shocked by this, considering the source. But he was right. They found that bringing everything down in volume made for a much better overall sound.

Gee, I find that to be true regardless of the acoustics of the room! I am constantly imploring my band-mates to turn it down. The guitar player's gain seems to creep upward over time causing me to increase mine and so on. When they do heed my advice, they seem to be newly amazed each time when it sounds better.

While I'm on the subject, I wish the "sound guys" at venues would understand that you can actually HEAR the music better when it is not rattling your ears at 110 dB SPL. As one who studies hearing, I long for the day when there is much greater public awareness of the damage that can be done by such levels and people insist that the gain be turned down. Okay, I'll get off the soapbox now.

 

[bolo]

Gee, I find that to be true regardless of the acoustics of the room! I am constantly imploring my band-mates to turn it down. The guitar player's gain seems to creep upward over time causing me to increase mine and so on. When they do heed my advice, they seem to be newly amazed each time when it sounds better.

Alan Heckle is a fine jazz & blues guitar player that I work with. Calls himself “Handsome Al.” Hehe.

I love the guy, but I’ll be durned if he doesn’t reach over to his amp after every song, either to turn up his volume, or take a swig of beer, or both.

 

[Jason Hollar]

So Troy...

How's it going with the new Wizzyamp? Have you had any more gigs with it since the studio sesh? How does it hold up next to a drummer?

I tried an iamp800 head with a 2x10 cab last summer at AHBG's pad in NJ while on vacation. Loved the clarity and depth with the EA gear. Didn't ever come up with the $2K or so needed to step up to that kind of rig though.

I'm still on the look out for a small, powerful combo for UB jazz jobs -- so I don't have to schlepp my more "electric" SWR head and 2x10 rig. I really want a smallish amp that kicks big booty if needed.

The GK MB combos are so light and portable -- but I wish they had a wizzer type cone...or a tweeter. Not quite enough zing for my tastes...but a solid sound nevertheless.

Also interested in the newer series III AI combos...the 400 watt Contra looks very nice indeed. Have there been any recent comparisons on these combos and the Wizzy's?

However, A/B'ing the EA head and an AI head at Bobs' place made me appreciate the EQ and tone options on the iamp series more.

I, for one love twiddling with knobs. And drinking beer.

 

[wneff]

The near field? Well you'd have to have your head quite close to the speaker to be in the region where the inverse-square law does not apply (within one wavelength of the frequency under consideration--that's the near field)! If you mean in the region where the energy from the direct wavefront dominates that from the reverberant field, that begs the question. In the environment described, it would be difficult to find such a position. Shaping the spectrum would not be likely to result in a meaningful improvement. In fact, the more high-frequency content one included (in an effort to make things less muddy), the more the reverberation would be apparent.

The circumstances under which spectral shaping could tame nasty room responses would be when the problems stem from room resonances/standing waves.

My intent is not to be argumentative. Some rooms are just plain nightmares and there is little one can do to alleviate their problems with the controls offered on typical, and even atypical amplifiers. I condier the EA heads atypical and have trumpeted the benefits and advantages of their parametric EQ several times.

The experience with my EA rig is that especially in rooms with awful acoustics they are much better than anything else I heard. In a room with a good room acoustics everything sounds good, the more problematic the room, the more of an advantage is the EA stuff.

Wolfram

 

[tombowlus]

The experience with my EA rig is that especially in rooms with awful acoustics they are much better than anything else I heard. In a room with a good room acoustics everything sounds good, the more problematic the room, the more of an advantage is the EA stuff.

Wolfram

That's a great observation! I definitely agree with this assessment.

 

[TroyK]

I still don't have mine, but last night I played in Key Arena before and during half time at the Sonics game. We played sort of over a bar on level 2 of 3 with people above and below us and stairs going every which way. No question it was one of the most interesting sonic places I've ever played. I had some house support, but sounded very unnaturall with my GK.

I'm doing it again on the 19th and hope to have my Wizzy by then to compare. I can't think of a better testing grounds, except maybe the same stage without sound support.

 

[drurb]

The experience with my EA rig is that especially in rooms with awful acoustics they are much better than anything else I heard. In a room with a good room acoustics everything sounds good, the more problematic the room, the more of an advantage is the EA stuff.

Wolfram

That is my experience as well! Let's be precise here. There are many causes of "awful acoustics." Some can be ameliorated via EQ and others cannot. I was pointing out that, for the room under discussion, which suffered from reverberation caused by a multitude of hard surfaces, EQ would be of little benefit. I stand by that assertion.

As I also pointed out, for rooms that have "awful acoustics" stemming from resonances/standing waves, EQ will be of great benefit and that is where the EA heads shine. I suspect we do not fundamentally disagree.