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EQ going to the sound system

#21
Just posted about this on another thread.

I've had sound engineers request it either way. Both as: "I want to work with your sound", and: "Send me a pre-EQ and I'll take it from there".

IMO the best of both worlds is a DI pedal with tone shaping built-in or in front of it, and then your amp settings are all yours. Need a little more stage volume? -Turn up your amp. Need a little less boom in the bass? -Make the change on your amp and you won't screw with what the FOH just did for you. Want to craft your sound slightly between songs for a different effect? -Adjust on your bass and/or pedal board. I always wondered why I'd want a DI pedal when I have one built in to my amp head... now I know!
 
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#22
dbsfgyd1 said:
Pre effects always.
Click to expand...
What? No way. Definitely send your effects to FoH. Would be weird to have a crystal clear signal going to FOH while you have an effected signal with distortion or octaver or a filter or whatever on stage.

OP - Pre-EQ though, more often than not. Chances are if you're asking what you should do, then you should go Pre EQ with the DI on your amp and let the sound guy (who likely knows that room) do the EQ'ing for you.
 
#25
Generally post EQ to FOH for me. FOH gets my pretty straight forward pedal board:
bass (generally passive) => Cali76CB (sidechained .. high compression, 75% dry) => VT (with cab sim on and very little EQ adjustment) => Noble => FOH.
I use very modest EQ settings and once we sound check, I NEVER touch my settings ... either on the bass or the pedal board. Never had a sound tech say anything but good stuff about my signal and sound. On the rare occasion that a sound tech insists on a pre-EQ signal, I'll do it without complaint as long as it sounds good in the monitors or IEMs.
 
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#26
Personally I don't use a line out from the amp at all. I use an external DI box inserted between my bass and my pedalboard. The amp gets a mic (if possible) but I ALWAYS use an external DI.

A couple of reasons for using an external DI pre-pedalboard/amp:

1) Most FOH engineers want a clean/dry bass signal.

2) Any adjustments I make during the show (on pedals or tone controls on amp) won't affect this clean signal.

3) Most dirt pedals sound horrible unless they're run through a speaker (or speaker sim).

4) It will be a failsafe if the amp or anything on the pedalboard breaks down.

If I had to use a line out from an amp I would make sure if was pre-eq, if possible (for the reasons mentioned above).

Basically, I'm willing to make a couple of compromises to make the FOH engineer happy. Especially if it's an engineer I haven't worked with before or if there's not much time for a soundcheck.
 
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#27
MYLOWFREQ said:
If you know what you're doing, send a post-EQ DI.
Click to expand...

This right here.

Send FOH a processed signal that works for them, or send FOH a clean signal.

If you use your amp EQ to adjust your tone for the stage, you don't want to send these changes to FOH.

The harder you make it for FOH to make you sound good, the less likely it becomes that you will sound good.
 
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#29
Wasnex said:
IMHO running ampless is a good reason to use a preamp/DI and send a post EQ DI. This gives the player the ability to dial in their own sound, rather than trying to talk the audio tech through it.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, something I should mention about my approach.

My rig has a small mixer that drives my in ears. For other instruments and vocals - all the inputs except me, I take my feed from the house IEM setup. For my signal, that goes direct from my DI/splitter to my mixer.

That way, I have what I need to hear myself dialed in, and I never change the EQ on my pedalboard - what FOH gets at line check and sound check does not change during the performance. They are free to do whatever they want to make my bass work in their mix - but or boost whatever, I will still hear myself just fine. This separation of concerns is key to not having conflict about eq, compression, etc.

Not changing eq ever means what they dial in at sound check is valid for the whole set. Yes, I do use the tone knob(s) on my bass, but those are minor tweaks to make different parts of the performance work.
 
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#30
I keep my EQ pretty flat so it's not a massive difference, but for me it depended on the sound guy. If it's some punter from another band I know who's just filling in the space for 20 bucks and 2 drink tickets but otherwise just knows how to adjust the volume sliders, I'd prefer to just send it post. If it's the actual sound guy for a venue, I'm going to hope and assume that they know how to EQ for their room better than I do.
 
#31
NevadaNed said:
When you guys connect your line out on your amp to the sound system, do you like to send the signal pre or post EQ, and why?
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I usually send a flat un-EQ'd signal because what comes out of the FOH sounds totally different from what is coming out of my amp. During sound check I like to go out to the sound board and listen and make suggestions to the tech on how to EQ my bass. Most of the time I suggest they insert HP because my bass coming through subs usually clashes with the kick drum. If that isn't possible I add HP to my send. This is what works for me.
 
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#34
Savage_Dreams said:
post eq, post effects, post (almost) everything.

I will never understand why so many bassists are willing to give up complete control of their tone to the engineer when guitarists are never forced to do this.
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Bands “give up complete control of their tone to the engineer” when FOH is used.. be that to your bands engineer or someone else.
Realizing and accepting it will make it much easier to work with FOH to get what you want. YMMV
 
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#35
NevadaNed said:
do you like to send the signal pre or post EQ, and why?
Click to expand...

I ask the sound engineer what they prefer
Because they don't have time and I don't have the money to be a prima donna about my tone.

The idea that "guitar players never have to give up control" is not accurate
Guitars get their cabs miked. They control things before that, not after.
If you want that kind of control then invest in your own mic like @JimmyM
 
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#37
s0c9 said:
Bands “give up complete control of their tone to the engineer” when FOH is used.. be that to your bands engineer or someone else.
Realizing and accepting it will make it much easier to work with FOH to get what you want. YMMV
Click to expand...
This is also one of the main reasons why direct recording in studios is often preferred: producers I've worked with want to produce and they just want raw uncooked bass information.....its a lot more difficult to produce a bass sound they want to work with if the bass player gives them something already colored
 
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#38
If the FOH tech doesn’t know me then I’ll approach with a smile and ask for a minute. I’ll play a clip of a song and the sound I’m trying to get out there and ask to take my send ( post ) and do what ya can to make it work in the venue. After my time and the band is doing a final sound check I’ll walk out into the middle and hope all is good. In a larger show with three or maybe 4 bands and HOB size venue and no time for this, I hope all is good as those at the board in a venue like this are more than qualified to take what I send and make it work. And they do. I’ll always ask if they would like a beer or …. too.
I use a Radial JDX 48 DI. All techs seem to like it.
 
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#39
post eq always, I use effects and they won't be heard in the mix. I have argued with sound guys about this more than a few times. I am a set and forget except stepping on pedals, this should not make you life difficult (sound man)
 
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#40
Rib 13 said:
This is also one of the main reasons why direct recording in studios is often preferred: producers I've worked with want to produce and they just want raw uncooked bass information.....its a lot more difficult to produce a bass sound they want to work with if the bass player gives them something already colored
Click to expand...
Most bass players seem to be unaware than mixing bass is one of the hardest instruments to properly EQ in the mix. It has so many transients/harmonics/overtones - and then you have to fit that into a mix with guitars, LEFT-handed keys players, and it's mortal enemy.. the kick!

Every time a POST feed is changed on stage.. it impacts that mix.
That doesn't mean FOH can't handle stylized bass - it depends on the genre, room etc.
Work with FOH if you have anything other than a clean sound going to FOH.
There's nothing worse that suddenly getting distortion, grit, boost, reverb/delay/echo or combinations thereof - out of the blue!

Maybe I have a different perspective being on both sides of the stage.. <shrug>
 
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